News Next Arrowverse Crossover to Include Batwoman
- Thread starter Enterprise is Great
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The Monitor seemed to do the same thing to Supergirl as Flash 90. We actually saw where she was transported though. So presumably he is some place else. Would be very strange to use him to launch this whole crossover, showing that tease on all 3 shows, than to have him vanish with no mention. If Monitor can create portals like Vibe, The Flash might try to cross the dimensional barrier again.
There is a huge opportunity to explore Flash 90’s unseen Past in animation. They could get David Ramsey to voice John Stewart. I looked up his age. He is 47. He could have been Green Lantern for along time on Earth 90.
There is a huge opportunity to explore Flash 90’s unseen Past in animation. They could get David Ramsey to voice John Stewart. I looked up his age. He is 47. He could have been Green Lantern for along time on Earth 90.
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Nora Fries. Mr. Freeze/Victor Fries’ Wife. played by Stephen Amell’s real wife. Confused what was happening with her? Was she a prisoner at Arkham or awakened from stasis accidentally? Mr Freeze keeps her in stasis to prevent her from dying from a disease.
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Well, I'm only halfway through the episode, and its pretty great (although I still don't give a shit about Felicity), but we had the first (and probably only negative about the crossover: Batwoman is shit.
They didn't even dye the actress's hair red, because that would be too much like those icky comics for CW. Well, she won't be ruining the special, but if she gets a TV show it will be the first CW DC show where I don't even bother with the pilot. She joins the list of fake versions of DC characters that the CW periodically introduces because about half the writers/producers are assholes.
But, besides the complete failure that is Fake batwoman, so far this is still a great crossover.
They didn't even dye the actress's hair red, because that would be too much like those icky comics for CW. Well, she won't be ruining the special, but if she gets a TV show it will be the first CW DC show where I don't even bother with the pilot. She joins the list of fake versions of DC characters that the CW periodically introduces because about half the writers/producers are assholes.
But, besides the complete failure that is Fake batwoman, so far this is still a great crossover.
That was a fun episode. I'm not sold on the Kate persona but enjoyed Batwoman. Looks like A LOT will be squeezed into part 3.
So we know Bruce/Batman left Gotham 3 years ago. Was wondering if there was any reason that specific amount of time was chosen. The most significant element of the Batman mythology to be used previous to this was Ra’s al Ghul and the League of Assasins. That was about the time Oliver killed Ra’s. Always hoped that was not the real Ra’s given how poorly cast the role was. Most likely no connection. We will see.
Fun second part. I got a kick of Marc Gugganheim being an inmate at Arkham. This episode felt like a live version of Batman the Animated Series and it was a ton of fun. I could have done without the whole Worlds Finest though, which I thought was a little cringe worthy. I will be impressed if we get a nice wrap up to this. It seems like we still haven't gotten the "meat" of the story yet even though it was coming in the final 10 minutes.
I have to say though on a character level, I'm liking the low key approach to the crossover this year. It's fun and comic booky without really going over the top.
I have to say though on a character level, I'm liking the low key approach to the crossover this year. It's fun and comic booky without really going over the top.
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I really liked how Kara quite obviously knew exactly who Bruce/Batman & Kate/Batwoman really were and was very respectful about not blowing either of their secret identities...which is good since she literally just had that whole conversation with Clark.
Also feeling just a little bit smug right now since for the last several years my head canon for this universe has been that Batman was 1) a thing 2) been around *way* longer than anyone else, possibly no longer active and 3) considered to be an urban myth.
Doing it this way is so much better than having a pre-Batman Bruce Wayne show up since it opens up a whole range of possible Bat Family members that they can use, which until the very recent 'Titans' show, haven't really been used much in live action. Hell, with time travel in play they could even use Terry McGinnis!
Oh and I love that Earth-90 John is GL. How much do yuo want to bet they'll drop some mention of his mother's maiden name being Stewart or something?
Also feeling just a little bit smug right now since for the last several years my head canon for this universe has been that Batman was 1) a thing 2) been around *way* longer than anyone else, possibly no longer active and 3) considered to be an urban myth.
Doing it this way is so much better than having a pre-Batman Bruce Wayne show up since it opens up a whole range of possible Bat Family members that they can use, which until the very recent 'Titans' show, haven't really been used much in live action. Hell, with time travel in play they could even use Terry McGinnis!
Oh and I love that Earth-90 John is GL. How much do yuo want to bet they'll drop some mention of his mother's maiden name being Stewart or something?
Yes and no. Yes, that's the version that originated from BTAS & later adopted by the comics, no it didn't stay that way forever. I think in one version of continuity Nora's stasis chamber was damaged & her body destroyed, and in another IIRC she got dunked in a Lazarus Pit or something and came back crazed & super powered. This version appears to be a mix of the two.
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Now that's more like it. Part 2 was a vast improvement over Part 1 across the board.
From Earth-90 Barry's casual revelation about who and what Diggle's Earth-90 doppelganger is to sciencey goodness with Cisco, Caitlin, Curtis, and Felicity to friendship bonding between Kara and Kate to all of the Batman Easter Eggs we saw in Arkham, this episode was everything that Part 1 should have been, and was a perfect setup for tomorrow's Supergirl episode, which looks like it will be introducing, for the first time, Earth-1 doppelgangers of at least some of the Supergirl cast, even if said doppelgangers happen to be evil.
Pivoting back to Kate, I love the backstory they set up for her with her having taken over Bruce's company, although her seemingly being unaware of why he left Gotham and where he went despite obviously being aware of his activities and identity as Batman seemed a little bit "off" to me.
I'm also unsure at this stage how characters like her father, sister, and OTHER cousin (whom they are casting a bit older than I would've expected) are going to fit into the framework of her life and career as set up in this episode.
On the whole, Elseworlds Part 2 was a much better episode than Part 1 and actually has me looking forward to the conclusion of the story a lot.
From Earth-90 Barry's casual revelation about who and what Diggle's Earth-90 doppelganger is to sciencey goodness with Cisco, Caitlin, Curtis, and Felicity to friendship bonding between Kara and Kate to all of the Batman Easter Eggs we saw in Arkham, this episode was everything that Part 1 should have been, and was a perfect setup for tomorrow's Supergirl episode, which looks like it will be introducing, for the first time, Earth-1 doppelgangers of at least some of the Supergirl cast, even if said doppelgangers happen to be evil.
Pivoting back to Kate, I love the backstory they set up for her with her having taken over Bruce's company, although her seemingly being unaware of why he left Gotham and where he went despite obviously being aware of his activities and identity as Batman seemed a little bit "off" to me.
I'm also unsure at this stage how characters like her father, sister, and OTHER cousin (whom they are casting a bit older than I would've expected) are going to fit into the framework of her life and career as set up in this episode.
On the whole, Elseworlds Part 2 was a much better episode than Part 1 and actually has me looking forward to the conclusion of the story a lot.
Perhaps 3 years was long enough that it allowed Batwoman to make a name for herself, but recent enough that Batman is still a reality everyone (except one guy) is aware of, not be considered some dusty tale from the past.
Refusing to believe in the reality of Batman's existence is just Oliver being Oliver.
I'd be surprised if they didn't use the red sky in part 3, since it's a nod to the red sky that was a unifying element through all of Crisis on Infinite Earths (sometimes just being an unexplained visual detail in otherwise unconnected books at the same time, hence my joke yesterday about wanting Legends to have an unexplained red sky). If we see a red sky tonight, we'll know Barry-90 is trying to come through again.
Hmm... We already know from The Flash that the future Crisis where Barry-1 disappears involves red skies. Interesting...
That would be nice.
Anyway, I love the idea that the Green Arrow has, in a sense, been partners with a Green Lantern all along.
Which makes Batman the only superhero confirmed to exist on both Earth-1 and Earth-38.
I think they should have done that, but I see no reason not to keep it small scale. Supergirl runs into the "why isn't Superman there" problem all the time. The different city doesn't help when there is a threat that requires his attention. I think it makes Batman look very bad if he simply abandons Gotham--unless he had a good reason, and I think that "he disappeared" isn't a good reason.
I learned of him on the Justice League Cartoon. The nature of his power makes him unstoppable. Talk about a character that's hard to beat. He just looks at you and he has all your power, plus the power of everyone else he looks at. The problem is he is hard to stop. In the cartoon, he felt that Earth was too small and he went on to explore the universe. He is a robot, so he doesn't have to be evil, which makes him more fascinating. Not TV show worthy, and a challenge to write for, but an appearance? Sure.
I felt the version here was dumbed down from the cartoon, but that wasn't a bad thing since this problem is something that can be dealt with another time.
But think about a villain where the more powerful the hero, the less likely for success.
Here's a continuity question: A few years ago, when Oliver gave Felicity the Overwatch code name, he said (approximately), "I wanted to call you Oracle, but it was taken." Given that the Batman mythos is now confirmed to exist on Earth-1, presumably the Oracle he referred to was Barbara Gordon. So how could he know that Oracle existed, yet believe Batman was an urban myth?
Well, I guess it's possible. Oracle in the comics became an information broker to the superhero community in general, not just the Bat-family. So maybe Oliver became aware of Oracle as a prominent hacker and information broker, without knowing of her connection to Batman.
Well, I guess it's possible. Oracle in the comics became an information broker to the superhero community in general, not just the Bat-family. So maybe Oliver became aware of Oracle as a prominent hacker and information broker, without knowing of her connection to Batman.
This isn't correct, as we saw with Dark Superman at the end of the episode.
So thoughts on Part II.
For a long time, I really thought that Diggle would have been better if he were John Stewart. David Ramsey is so perfect for that role, and historically, Green Arrow and Hal Jordan were extremely good friends. On this show, Diggle filled that role.
This episode strongly implied that Diggle IS John Stewart on another Earth, and I would absolutely LOVE some sort of story arc where we delve into this on Earth 1. We don't know everything about this highly trained military expert. Maybe he changed his name for a reason. That would be a homerun story for me.
Regarding Bruce Wayne--I think the writers messed up slightly here, and confused the viewers. I interpreted things so far as follows--because Barry and Oliver don't know Superman, there is no Superman on Earth 1. Either that, or he hasn't debuted yet. And likely no Kara either. I'm fine with that, but Kara said that Superman and Batman are frenemies. That means that there is also a Batman on Earth 38.
That means one of two things--either there are 2 Bruce Waynes--one on each Earth, or Bruce Wayne of Earth 1 ended up on Earth 38 and set up shop there. Of course--Batman's superpower is that he's rich, and it might have been hard to set up the Batcave, Wayne Manor, etc., on another EARTH.
So more likely, there are two Bruce Waynes. But the question then is--why didn't the writers just clarify that?
I'm hoping this is a different Clark, and NOT Earth 38 Clark. Maybe we even see the two versions fight. Not raised by the Kents, Kal-El could have grown up much differently.
Think the Sovereign on Hercules if you know the reference.
My biggest issue right now is WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO FLASH 90?
I really hope that wasn't it. I want to see more of Shipp as that character. There are SO many possibilities there. I really hope that they didn't just Thanos him out of existence. That would be a terrible thing. Even if his part is small, doing an episode of The Flash where the two Barrys have an adventure together would be ridiculously exciting.
For a long time, I really thought that Diggle would have been better if he were John Stewart. David Ramsey is so perfect for that role, and historically, Green Arrow and Hal Jordan were extremely good friends. On this show, Diggle filled that role.
This episode strongly implied that Diggle IS John Stewart on another Earth, and I would absolutely LOVE some sort of story arc where we delve into this on Earth 1. We don't know everything about this highly trained military expert. Maybe he changed his name for a reason. That would be a homerun story for me.
Regarding Bruce Wayne--I think the writers messed up slightly here, and confused the viewers. I interpreted things so far as follows--because Barry and Oliver don't know Superman, there is no Superman on Earth 1. Either that, or he hasn't debuted yet. And likely no Kara either. I'm fine with that, but Kara said that Superman and Batman are frenemies. That means that there is also a Batman on Earth 38.
That means one of two things--either there are 2 Bruce Waynes--one on each Earth, or Bruce Wayne of Earth 1 ended up on Earth 38 and set up shop there. Of course--Batman's superpower is that he's rich, and it might have been hard to set up the Batcave, Wayne Manor, etc., on another EARTH.
So more likely, there are two Bruce Waynes. But the question then is--why didn't the writers just clarify that?
I'm hoping this is a different Clark, and NOT Earth 38 Clark. Maybe we even see the two versions fight. Not raised by the Kents, Kal-El could have grown up much differently.
Think the Sovereign on Hercules if you know the reference.
My biggest issue right now is WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO FLASH 90?
I really hope that wasn't it. I want to see more of Shipp as that character. There are SO many possibilities there. I really hope that they didn't just Thanos him out of existence. That would be a terrible thing. Even if his part is small, doing an episode of The Flash where the two Barrys have an adventure together would be ridiculously exciting.