Did CBS Steal the Tardigrade Idea?

[Takeru]

Oh wow, he's in Kuwait.

I don't think it's right to compare this to the Alec Peters case. This isn't a Star Trek project, or a ST fan. Moreover this isn't a case of someone trying to profit off of the ST IP. He was just making his own thing a few years ago, and had it protected under copywrite. Yeah, he's trying to get money... but that's sort of the point if you feel your property was taken, right?

But his ideas weren't taken, his ideas are completely generic (a black female lead and a gay couple where one guy has a beard ) or based on popular science stuff that has been in the media for years. I remember hearing about space travelling tardigrades a long time before Discovery was even a thing (I'm pretty sure they were referred to as "first astronauts" and it was specifically mentioned that they can survive in the vacuum of space).
Sure, they both have giant tardigrades but that happens naturally when a work of fiction decides to use them because it's hard to do a character that's the size of a mosquito compared to human characters.

Looking at the specifics of the stories they don't even seem to be that similar. His is about an ancient human civilization using tardigrades to travel through space, Discovery's is more about future humans using a mycelial network with the tardigrade showing them how, they do it without it after a short time.

Both having space travelling tardigrades isn't proof of anything because it's not even an original idea he had, so he saw a Discovery channel piece about space travelling tardigrades and thought "Wow, I can use that!", so what? Tens of thousands of people probably had ideas about stories involving them the last few years.
You cannot use an idea that's literally all over the media and then act outraged of someone else does it too, this guy is a joke and I hope he's crushed by CBS.

 

[Krandor]

But his ideas weren't taken, his ideas are completely generic (a black female lead and a gay couple where one guy has a beard ) or based on popular science stuff that has been in the media for years. I remember hearing about space travelling tardigrades a long time before Discovery was even a thing (I'm pretty sure they were referred to as "first astronauts" and it was specifically mentioned that they can survive in the vacuum of space).
Sure, they both have giant tardigrades but that happens naturally when a work of fiction decides to use them because it's hard to do a character that's the size of a mosquito compared to human characters.

Looking at the specifics of the stories they don't even seem to be that similar. His is about an ancient human civilization using tardigrades to travel through space, Discovery's is more about future humans using a mycelial network with the tardigrade showing them how, they do it without it after a short time.

Both having space travelling tardigrades isn't proof of anything because it's not even an original idea he had, so he saw a Discovery channel piece about space travelling tardigrades and thought "Wow, I can use that!", so what? Tens of thousands of people probably had ideas about stories involving them the last few years.
You cannot use an idea that's literally all over the media and then act outraged of someone else does it too, this guy is a joke and I hope he's crushed by CBS.

I still think he's hoping that by filing the lawsuit CBS will give him money to go away. I honestly hope they don't. My opinion is this that the CBS motion to dismiss will be accepted and this will be thrown out early.

 

[STRenegade]

Just waiting for the inevitable response from Alec saying "See? We told you they stole people's ideas!"

 

[Noname Given]

I still think he's hoping that by filing the lawsuit CBS will give him money to go away. I honestly hope they don't. My opinion is this that the CBS motion to dismiss will be accepted and this will be thrown out early.

Yep - that's the whole point. I'm sure CBS legal will file an Motion To Dismiss and depending on how much is excluded from the initial plaintiff's pleading (if anything) as a result of said motion; they'll reach a monetary settlement that will in effect cost both sides less then actually going to trial.

 

[Krandor]

Yep - that's the whole point. I'm sure CBS legal will file an Motion To Dismiss and depending on how much is excluded from the initial plaintiff's pleading (if anything) as a result of said motion; they'll reach a monetary settlement that will in effect cost both sides less then actually going to trial.

CBS isn't going to settle IMO. They have a history of vigorously defending when people sue them for copyright and in one case when somebody sued them they found a picture from gunsmoke the suer posted years ago and sued him in retaliation. CBS will defend this, win, and get attorney's fees as well and this guy will wish he never did this.

 

[Noname Given]

CBS isn't going to settle IMO. They have a history of vigorously defending when people sue them for copyright and in one case when somebody sued them they found a picture from gunsmoke the suer posted years ago and sued him in retaliation. CBS will defend this, win, and get attorney's fees as well and this guy will wish he never did this.

^^^
I think times have changed as were that the case, they would never have settled (and they offered a settlement a FULL YEAR before Alec Peters finally took it) and would have sued Alec peters into bankruptcy and beyond. The Axanar case was as open and shut as you get and even the Judge was giving the Defense numerous clues basically saying: "If CBS/Paramount is offering a settlement, I'd take it..." all through his various motion decision write ups.

Also, given what's in the game, that the game was 3 years prior; and that Harlan Ellison won his lawsuit against the creators of "The Terminator" films; the Plaintiff actually has a decent claim. CBS will way the costs, and if they see it costs less to settle (in time/money/possible negative publicity), they'll settle.

 

[Krandor]

^^^
I think times have changed as were that the case, they would never have settled (and they offered a settlement a FULL YEAR before Alec Peters finally took it) and would have sued Alec peters into bankruptcy and beyond. The Axanar case was as open and shut as you get and even the Judge was giving the Defense numerous clues basically saying: "If CBS/Paramount is offering a settlement, I'd take it..." all through his various motion decision write ups.

Also, given what's in the game, that the game was 3 years prior; and that Harlan Ellison won his lawsuit against the creators of "The Terminator" films; the Plaintiff actually has a decent claim. CBS will way the costs, and if they see it costs less to settle (in time/money/possible negative publicity), they'll settle.

There is a difference between suing somebody and being sued. In the axanar case, I think they had an agreement they would be happy with going in (the 2 15 minute segments vs a full length movie) and so they were fine with that outcome.

When you are sued it is different and if CBS setteled they would have to give this guy money which could lead to other people doing the same thing so it is in their best interests to walk away paying nothing so will defend it to the end. The only way I see a settlement is if what the creator says is true and all he wants is assurances CBS won't sue him. If a statement to that effect with CBS paying no money makes this go away then they might do that. If money is involved in the settlement I think they keep fighting

 

[Noname Given]

There is a difference between suing somebody and being sued. In the axanar case, I think they had an agreement they would be happy with going in (the 2 15 minute segments vs a full length movie) and so they were fine with that outcome.

When you are sued it is different and if CBS setteled they would have to give this guy money which could lead to other people doing the same thing so it is in their best interests to walk away paying nothing so will defend it to the end. The only way I see a settlement is if what the creator says is true and all he wants is assurances CBS won't sue him. If a statement to that effect with CBS paying no money makes this go away then they might do that. If money is involved in the settlement I think they keep fighting

No, Paramount/CBS WASN'T happy about creating ANY guidelines for Fan Films. If you believe that then you dismiss the situation leading up to the decision to sue. CBS stated they informed Mr. peters personally at a Convention they were NOT HAPPY with what he was doing and asked him to stop. (And yes, Peters claims no such discussion on that particular point ever took place; but that would have come out one way or another in testimony ha they gone to trial. There was deposition testimony that Peters HAD been informed Paramount was not happy and wanted his to stop the project.

What matters in a lawsuit is not whom initiated the lawsuit; it's the FACTS as presented in the lawsuit, and what the 'Trier of fact' (be it a Judge or a Jury) ultimately finds based on the evidence presented.

Movie and TV production companies are sued all the time, and whether or not they settle depends on their assessment of what is best for the bottom line in time/money spent/publicity. In the end, the 'Bottom Line' always dictates their actions.

 

[Krandor]

Movie and TV production companies are sued all the time, and whether or not they settle depends on their assessment of what is best for the bottom line in time/money spent/publicity. In the end, the 'Bottom Line' always dictates their actions.

I guess we will see what happens in this one. I can't wait to see what CBS/Netflix's answer to the complain looks like.

 

[Red Panda]

Half of it is coincidence. Also tardigrades in space aren't new or exclusive to either Star Trek or Abdin's game.

 

[Krandor]

Half of it is coincidence. Also tardigrades in space aren't new or exclusive to either Star Trek or Abdin's game.

and that is the problem the plaintiff has. Tardigrades and the fact they can survive in the vacuum of space has been in the news a lot the last few years. It isn't a stretch for two people to think of using them in a sci-fi series.

As for the cast stuff, and I don't mean this in a negative way, but if you go down a checklist of a diverse cast that is what you'll get. We need a gay couple and let's make them interrcial too, a black female lead, etc etc. Again, very possible for two productions that want to be diverse to hit the same boxes.

 

[CorporalClegg]

As for the cast stuff, and I don't mean this in a negative way, but if you go down a checklist of a diverse cast that is what you'll get. We need a gay couple and let's make them interrcial too, a black female lead, etc etc. Again, very possible for two productions that want to be diverse to hit the same boxes.

Which is a whole different probably for Disco in and of itself. (i.e. their laundry list diversity isn't nearly as forward-thinking as they try and sell it as.)


*As far as the allegations go, I've never heard of the game before. And as far as I can tell, it was never finished. As the only Steam page is a Greenlight page -- but Steam doesn't use that anymore. (There is no store page.)

So what's more likely: the Disco team scoured the internet for anything relating to tardigrades, stumbled upon the game and said "Let's steal everything!" Or the creator of a small indie video game none of the staff has likely ever heard of is trying to drum up sympathy and get donations to his Go fund patreon me?

 

[Mudd]

But his ideas weren't taken, his ideas are completely generic.

Yeah...okay.

The giant space traveling tardigrade is a thing. In fact, it's about the least "generic" and predictable thing in STD.* I'm not surprised that he's suspicious.

*Faint praise, I know.

 

[Takeru]

Yeah...okay.

The giant space traveling tardigrade is a thing. In fact, it's about the least "generic" and predictable thing in STD.* I'm not surprised that he's suspicious.

*Faint praise, I know.

I didn't say the tardigrade idea was generic, generic are the black female character and the gay couple. I said the tardigrade traveler is based on popular science stuff and unoriginal because media referring to tardigrades as natural astronauts or whatever easily plants the idea in many heads. All he di was makimg it bigger and faster with super powers and that's hardly a new idea.

 

[Red Panda]

Space spores aren't new either.

 

[Mudd]

I didn't say the tardigrade idea was generic, generic are the black female character and the gay couple. I said the tardigrade traveler is based on popular science stuff and unoriginal because media referring to tardigrades as natural astronauts or whatever easily plants the idea in many heads.

You're bending over backward here to rule out plagiarism in a situation where you cannot know the truth.

You never thought of a giant tardigrade that transports people around the galaxy in the blink of an eye. I guarantee that.

Neither did I.

Someone did. The question, probably moot, is...who?

 

[Agony_Boothb]

As I understand it the Tardigrade was originally conceived to be an actual crew member but it was canned for being too expensive. They then decided to incorporate the tardigrade into the spore drive story.

 

[Tuskin38]

As I understand it the Tardigrade was originally conceived to be an actual crew member but it was canned for being too expensive. They then decided to incorporate the tardigrade into the spore drive story.

I believe you are correct

 

[Graham]

It's pretty obvious that he has a good case. It seems very clear that they did in fact steal his ideas.

I doubt he will win, though. One guy against a big rich corporation? Not going to go well.

Still, I can hope. Heh, whilst I'm dreaming, I will dream that he wins so big that it makes the show unprofitable and CBS cancel it. A thin hope for these dark days.

 

[CorporalClegg]

It seems very clear that they did in fact steal his ideas.

Nope.