Donny's TOS Enterprise Interiors

[Donny]

A couple of reasons just off the top of my head:

First, there's barely room (in a 947' ship anyway) for a crewman in there, and they would have to access it via a crawlway across the roof of the hangar deck. If the room is actually needed, that's just bad design.

Second, why would a futuristic spaceship need a physical window for someone to look out of at approaching shuttles? Time and again we see the crew of the Enterprise use monitor screens or sensors to track their targets. The observation deck is to view the shuttles landing, not guide them. The notion that a single crewman crammed into a tiny room above a landing deck can offer anything to a shuttle's operations is such an antithesis to the philosophy of TOS that it's not even funny.

Or that's how I see it, anyway

I wholeheartedly agree. I think there are some that look at that rectangular "window" and automatically want to see it as a control tower (like the production staff behind the "Enterprise tour" extra of TOS-R) because "cool, right?". but the most damning evidence that it is not a control room is that it is just such an inaccessible part of the ship. And someone may say "Why don't they just beam in there!", but in "Day of the Dove", it is established that intra-ship transportation is dangerous in this era and only used in emergencies.

And yes, if the freakin nerve center of the ship (the bridge) didn't need a physical window, why would they need a physical window in that crammed space above the clamshell doors to ensure the safe launch and retrieval of shuttlecraft? They don't. The only reason to have windows on the ship, with its myriad external sensing devices, it to allow crew members to gaze out into the beauty of the cosmos with the naked eye: a pleasure one dare not take away from weary space travelers.

Or, as @Mytran put it, that's how I see it, anyway

EDIT: This has brought up an interesting piece of dialogue I always thought was a bit off. Lt. Stile's line in "Balance of Terror" that aiming phasers with sensors instead of the naked eye was less accurate in comparison.

 

[blssdwlf]

EDIT: This has brought up an interesting piece of dialogue I always thought was a bit off. Lt. Stile's line in "Balance of Terror" that aiming phasers with sensors instead of the naked eye was less accurate in comparison.

I don't want to tangent your thread too much, but I think in the context of their discussion they were only able to track the cloaked Romulan with their motion sensors so it would have been less accurate. When they were uncloaked (visible), all their sensors would have given them a solid lock. All IMHO

 

[aridas sofia]

As far as what many perceive as a control tower on top of the clamshell door exterior, I most likely won't be making this an actual "room", but rather selling it as a sensor placement of some sort, much like @MGagen has in his renderings.

Where did MGagen have it in his renderings?

 

[Tallguy]

Where did MGagen have it in his renderings?

On the tail of the ship.

I'll see myself out...

 

[Donny]

Where did MGagen have it in his renderings?

I don't want to share his renders without his permission (as I'm not sure if they are publicly available), but he simply envisioned what is commonly perceived as a "control booth" that rests above the exterior of the clamshell doors as a sensor placement instead.

 

[aridas sofia]

I’ve studied his model closely. Didn’t he just make the hangar dome a glowing green light?

 

[Donny]

I’ve studied his model closely. Didn’t he just make the hangar dome a glowing green light?

We were not referring to the green dome light on the top-aft end of the engineering hull, but the yellow light embedded into the cylindrical structure just above the clamshell doors:

 

[aridas sofia]

Ok, but still, those features are connected. The cylinder leads to the dome. It was my understanding he made both of those features purposrly vague. Is there some detail I’m missing that indicates it is a sensor or tractor emitter or something else?

 

[Donny]

Ok, but still, those features are connected. The cylinder leads to the dome. It was my understanding he made both of those features purposrly vague. Is there some detail I’m missing that indicates it is a sensor or tractor emitter or something else?

Sending you a PM :-)

 

[RedForman]

The strategic design blueprints (link) don't really go into much detail here, but this cutaway (link - warning, high res) does, vaguely like aridas suggested.

 

[BK613]

as far as I can tell, it is the only glowy light (other than the "glide slope" lights on the fantail) that points directly aft. Navigational deflector, maybe?

 

[137th Gebirg]

Well, they do need something there for when they go in "reverse warp", a la "Balance of Terror".

 

[Maurice]

as far as I can tell, it is the only glowy light (other than the "glide slope" lights on the fantail) that points directly aft. Navigational deflector, maybe?

Tractor beam?

I've never seen that feature on any of Jefferies designs for the original TOS model or even the Star Trek [Phase] II refit, and it's not present in the WNMHGB shots of the ship, but in those shots the dome on top flashes like a running light, which leads me to suspect the green disc with the rods was installed when the model was modified for series production, which also makes me wonder if the cylinder was added to allow light to get from the bulb in the aft of of the model because said green disc made it impossible to get a bulb up in there?

 

[DanGovier]

I'm having the same issue with the Refit. It has a similar set of windows above the hangar doors, and I'm really struggling with both crew access and headroom. You can just about stand up in there when it's just the outer hull, but as soon as you add support structure etc it's far too small. Plus, the only plausible way in is via a jefferies tube due to the ceiling height of the hangar itself.
(Image courtesy of google images)

 

[Tallguy]

In the case of the refit, those are explicitly called out as crewed areas, aren't they?

 

[Mytran]

Nowhere on screen, as far as I know

 

[Norsehound]

Some renders I'm seeing have windows on the reverse of that operations hub facing inward into the hangar. Unfortunately the one shot we get of that side of the hangar, that part is blocked by an incoming workbee.

I liked believing it was a hangar operations module myself since it seems shuttle operations are much more elaborate on the refit than on the original constitution. But then, I'm not a stickler for precise scales myself, and I always considered it big enough for crew to be there. Access was granted from a walkway at the rear of the warp intermix tube coming back from engineering. Such a structure isn't on the original though...

 

[lawman]

Some renders I'm seeing have windows on the reverse of that operations hub facing inward into the hangar. Unfortunately the one shot we get of that side of the hangar, that part is blocked by an incoming workbee.

An observation about that image, which hadn't occurred to me before even though I've seen it many times...

We've all seen countless discussions (including in this thread) asking about whether these or those dimensions for the TOS shuttlebay would allow space for the nacelle struts to enter the engineering fuselage, on the seemingly reasonable assumption that those struts would have to be extend inside the ship and be anchored there in some way for the sake of stability. But in the one large-scale view we get of that space — this one, albeit admittedly of the refit version rather than the original — there's no sign whatsoever of the struts entering the interior space. On the evidence, it would seem we can and should assume that 23rd century materials and fabrication technology are advanced enough to keep those things stable without any internal attachment.

 

[blssdwlf]

Agreed, crew space and access to those areas are extremely tight. IMHO, I'd make those accessible areas and the "windows" are just openings for aft sensors/scanners and tractor beam machinery.

I'm having the same issue with the Refit. It has a similar set of windows above the hangar doors, and I'm really struggling with both crew access and headroom. You can just about stand up in there when it's just the outer hull, but as soon as you add support structure etc it's far too small. Plus, the only plausible way in is via a jefferies tube due to the ceiling height of the hangar itself.
[\QUOTE]

 

[aridas sofia]

What was intended to go back there is quite literally debating in a vacuum until someone models a hangar that will fit in an exterior at the scale that was indicated on Jefferies’ art and then examines the space around that hangar for accessibility to the aft dome and cylinder.