Balance of Terror Observations

[Pauln6]

I think I agree that there must have been a Romulan Warbird hiding on the other side of the Neutral Zone. Possibly a sub-light assassin was picked so as to leave no warp trail.

A more logical approach would have been to hide a detachable warp drive (or several) perhaps on asteroids in the Neutral zone and use that as a stop off point.

I can't recall how big is the neutral zone. If it's more than a light year, the attack vessel has no hope of reaching its next target before help arrives without warp capability.

 

[johnnybear]

Strange that Romulus and Remus are the two sons of Aeneus, who escaped from the ruins of Troy, and founded the city of Rome! But that is human mythology or maybe history so I doubt the Romulans would call themselves a name from human literature!Rather it must be a name (or two) possibly from their Vulcan heritage that or the fact that in a novel I think the author states that the Romulans call themselves something else entirely in their own land! A bit like how Vulcan, which is also a human term, must call themselves another name behind closed doors!
JB

 

[Pauln6]

Strange that Romulus and Remus are the two sons of Aeneus, who escaped from the ruins of Troy, and founded the city of Rome! But that is human mythology or maybe history so I doubt the Romulans would call themselves a name from human literature!Rather it must be a name (or two) possibly from their Vulcan heritage that or the fact that in a novel I think the author states that the Romulans call themselves something else entirely in their own land! A bit like how Vulcan, which is also a human term, must call themselves another name behind closed doors!
JB

Universal translator. In their own language their real name is unpronounceable.

 

[johnnybear]

Maybe, but I'm sure someone wrote a novel with their real name revealed although it is not canon!
JB

 

[Timo]

ENT "Minefield" (in?)famously made it canonical that Romulus is the native name of the place. Or at least that the proper name for their star empire is "Romulan", because that is what Hoshi Sato gets out of the raw untranslated feed from a Romulan ship.

Nuances to that abound. We do not know what language the Romulans are speaking there, but it sure as hell ain't Romulan - because the 2009 movie establishes the common Romulan language (all three dialects of it) to be basically indistinguishable from the common Vulcan language, and Sato doesn't go "Sir, they are speaking Vulcan!". Perhaps the name of the star empire is "Romulan" only in some obscure dialect, or in a third-party language the Romulans in the ENT episode mistakenly believed was spoken by Archer's folks.

Also, nobody ever establishes Reman or Remus as native things. Quite possibly the humans or their rather independent-minded UT thought it apt to dub the second planet of their enemy "Remus" as per the Earth legend, against the ground truth of Romulan native naming.

Finally, Romulus is a name the Vulcans of ENT are already familiar with - T'Pol corrects Sato's pronunciation of the name, even though Sato is merely accurately repeating what the Romulan voice said. Perhaps Romula was a nation or political party on ancient Vulcan, and the adopted (and slightly altered) designation of those Romula people who left in a huff when Sarek said "Passionate love, punching your neighbor and letting your forehead ridges bulge are illogical things and you should instead meditate a lot"...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[johnnybear]

Sarek? Surak surely?
JB

 

[Marsden]

Also, they mentioned Romulus and Remus but the star map says Romulus and RomII or Romii.

Is it a new word or shorthand for Romulus 2?

http://tos.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/1x14/balanceofterror025.jpg

 

[Christopher]

Also, they mentioned Romulus and Remus but the star map says Romulus and RomII or Romii.

Romulus and Remus are twin planets around the same star. The star map is, obviously, of stars, different star systems light-years apart. The twin planets would both be around the star labeled "Romulus," too close to see separately on the map -- just like, say, the Met Life Building and Grand Central Station are too close together to see separately on a map of the entire United States, but would both be subsumed within the dot representing New York City. Romii would be a different star system in Romulan space.

 

[Timo]

Or then the map is supposed to show but a single system, with some distant random stars on the background just as in every TNG era map.

But that is water under a burned bridge, a train that sailed long ago. The map ceased to be of such a small scale in TNG at the very latest, but most of TOS and TAS strongly suggests the larger scale already.

The matter still stands that most of the dots on that map are unlikely to be anywhere near the map plane, and are mere distant background... But Romii or RomII is unlikely to be such, by virtue of being labeled!

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Maurice]

A few interesting details from story outline for "Balance of Terror":

...in the direction of the twin giants Romulus and Remus 638...​

The script describes the map as showing:

...a curved space marked "Neutral Zone", and extending off the map beyond that a star system of which one of the planets is marked "ROMULUS"...​

So maybe ROM II is the star and Romulus is the planet?

Regardless, there's no clarification as to what ROM II is on the map seen in the episode, since it's in neither document.

 

[Christopher]

So maybe ROM II is the star and Romulus is the planet?

Again: The way the map is drawn, they can only be separate star systems. A map of a single planetary system wouldn't be just a bunch of dots scattered about; it'd be a big dot being circled by a bunch of smaller dots. On the scale of the map, a star and its entire planetary system would all be within a single dot. (And it's Romii, not "ROM II." There's no space in there.)

The problem is, the script was evidently written with the intention that the Neutral Zone surrounded only a single star system, but whoever drew the map misunderstood or ignored the script's instructions and instead drew the Zone as separating one set of stars from a different set of stars. It also added the phrase "Romulan Star Empire," which is never mentioned in dialogue. So clearly the script and the graphic are working at cross purposes. What was scripted as a single interdicted planetary system was retconned into a whole interstellar empire by a single post-production graphic. And the name "Romii" was clearly pulled from the graphic artist's imagination along with the rest.

 

[Maurice]

We have some story treatments and scripts and a few memos, but we don't know what was discussed amongst the staff or in production meetings, ergo, you're just deciding what must have happened. "...but whoever drew the map misunderstood or ignored the script's instructions" is mere speculation.

 

[Christopher]

We have some story treatments and scripts and a few memos, but we don't know what was discussed amongst the staff or in production meetings, ergo, you're just deciding what must have happened. "...but whoever drew the map misunderstood or ignored the script's instructions" is mere speculation.

It's pretty obvious just by comparing the dialogue and script directions to the actual map. There is no way to interpret that map as representing a single star and its planets, especially since it's actually labeled "Romulan Star Empire" rather than "Romulan Star System." And you said yourself, the name Romii doesn't come from the story outline or script.

 

[Poltargyst]

Strange that Romulus and Remus are the two sons of Aeneus, who escaped from the ruins of Troy, and founded the city of Rome!

Descendants, not sons. They are sons of Mars.

 

[alchemist]

A few interesting details from story outline for "Balance of Terror":

...in the direction of the twin giants Romulus and Remus 638...​

This description was shortened to just "...twin giants Romulus and Remus" in the first draft dated 6/21/1966.

The script describes the map as showing:

...a curved space marked "Neutral Zone", and extending off the map beyond that a star system of which one of the planets is marked "ROMULUS"...​

The full quote describing the map, from the revised final draft dated 7/18/1966, is:

Beyond this curve, a curved space marked "Neutral Zone", and extending off the map beyond that, a star system of which one of the planets is marked "ROMULUS"... the entire area marked "ROMULAN STAR EMPIRE".

My interpretation of this, and I'm recognizing that Roddenberry encouraged his department heads to be creative in translating script directions, (i.e., as evidenced by his coinage of the term, "measure," per his memo of 6/15/1966), is:

1. "...and extending off the map beyond that..." implies that we only need to see the relevant portion of the map and not the whole thing. Indeed, the sun of the Romulan/Reman system can be off the map entirely if it's not needed.
2. "...of which one of the planets is marked "ROMULUS"... " This seems to indicate that one of the planets on the map needs to be Romulus and, via what the ellipses suggest, the artist can draw another planet (or planets) on the map... and name one of them "Romii," if they wish.
3. "... the entire area marked "ROMULAN STAR EMPIRE"." This portion of the sentence implies that the area beyond the "Neutral Zone" should be labeled "ROMULAN STAR EMPIRE."
4. Finally, in looking at the film of the episode in high resolution, Romulus, as shown on the map on the bridge main viewing screen, is actually a small solid circle with a circle drawn around it. I suspect that the artist was merely trying to draw attention to that particular celestial object (i.e., by drawing a circle around it) in order for the viewer to find it more easily. Otherwise, the solid circles of Romulus and Romii are exactly the same diameter.

 

[Christopher]

The full quote describing the map, from the revised final draft dated 7/18/1966, is:

Beyond this curve, a curved space marked "Neutral Zone", and extending off the map beyond that, a star system of which one of the planets is marked "ROMULUS"... the entire area marked "ROMULAN STAR EMPIRE".

Okay, so that part was in the script. Although that date was two days before they started filming, so maybe the map had already been created by then. (Although I don't see why it would've been, since it wasn't added until post-production.)

4. Finally, in looking at the film of the episode in high resolution, Romulus, as shown on the map on the bridge main viewing screen, is actually a small solid circle with a circle drawn around it. I suspect that the artist was merely trying to draw attention to that particular celestial object (i.e., by drawing a circle around it) in order for the viewer to find it more easily. Otherwise, the solid circles of Romulus and Romii are exactly the same diameter.

On maps of Earth, capital cities are often highlighted with circled dots. So I've always assumed the intent was to highlight Romulus as the Empire's capital.

 

[alchemist]

On maps of Earth, capital cities are often highlighted with circled dots. So I've always assumed the intent was to highlight Romulus as the Empire's capital.

That's an interesting thought.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

The effect to me was of his soberly considering, if but for a moment, the possible relevance of a deity at this sorrowful moment.

Kirk seemed to be having his own moment with God--perhaps one seeking forgiveness for his actions which--without question--caused Tomlinson's death, and the life Angela would live from that point forward.

The interlude's feeling is broken when Kirk stops out into the corridor and encounters numbers of the crew filing around, accompanied by the upbeat musical finale.

"End Title"--the cue played as Kirk walks the corridor was anything other than upbeat--it was the somewhat mournful, Taps-esque piece composed for "Where No Man Has Gone Before"--essentially serving as the coda to Gary Mitchell's ultimately tragic story.

 

[Maurice]

It's pretty obvious just by comparing the dialogue and script directions to the actual map. There is no way to interpret that map as representing a single star and its planets, especially since it's actually labeled "Romulan Star Empire" rather than "Romulan Star System." And you said yourself, the name Romii doesn't come from the story outline or script.

"The is no way to interpret". Really? Lots of maps are stylized. And the map is meant for the audience more than the fictional crew. But those ideas you'll shoot down too because.

 

[Christopher]

"The is no way to interpret". Really? Lots of maps are stylized. And the map is meant for the audience more than the fictional crew. But those ideas you'll shoot down too because.

It's just common sense -- hell, it's obvious just from glancing at the map. Romii is about as far from Romulus as the Earth outposts are from each other, and nearly half as far as the Neutral Zone border is from Romulus. If those two dots were meant to represent twin planets, then the Neutral Zone would have to be well inside the Romulan star system, much closer to the planets than they are to their own sun. That just makes no sense. Unless you're proposing that that part of the map is somehow enlarged relative to the rest, but there's nothing on the map to indicate it, and that's just one more ad hoc assumption pulled out of thin air. I just don't see the point in making up arbitrary excuses not to interpret the map in the simplest, most obvious way. Why shouldn't Romii be a second system in the Empire? Why is that a bad thing? An empire, by definition, has more than one territory in it.