Things you wished were mention in Trek novels

[Nyotarules]

(All TIC..well some are)

1. That invisible doorway from the bridge to the toilets
2. Why 24th century PADDS/tablets have less technology than their 21st century counterparts and so Starfleet crew need more than one to work with
3. Why 23rd century Starfleet communicators are audio only
4. Why TOS people in security wear bright red on landing party duty

 

[Jinn]

4. Why TOS people in security wear bright red on landing party duty

Obviously because the blood isn't noticed, so the shirt can be reused after the wearer dies.

 

[Damian]

Why TOS people in security wear bright red on landing party duty

Ha-ha, that's a good one. To be honest I never gave it much thought (I guess I was just used to it). But yeah, it's kind of like waving a red flag in front of a bull.

How about why was the bridge re-organized between TMP and TWOK? The science station was moved from the back to the side and the engineering station was moved to the other side of the bridge.

 

[Nyotarules]

Obviously because the blood isn't noticed, so the shirt can be reused after the wearer dies.

Unless its a Federation species whose blood is not red.....Vulcans

 

[Nyotarules]

The science station was moved from the back to the side and the engineering station was moved to the other side of the bridge.

Its the same station, the crew are hot desking

 

[Christopher]

As always, folks, take care to avoid anything that could constitute a specific plot idea...

1. That invisible doorway from the bridge to the toilets

There is one on the TNG bridge, though it's never called attention to. I believe the '70s blueprints showed that the second door added in TAS led to a corridor with a head.

2. Why 24th century PADDS/tablets have less technology than their 21st century counterparts and so Starfleet crew need more than one to work with

I'm willing to excuse TV producers using "pile of padds" as a quick visual shorthand for "having a lot of work." Although I did have trouble with things like that Voyager episode ("Good Shepherd," I think) where they followed someone hand-delivering a padd from Janeway's ready room to the lowermost deck of the ship. A nice idea as a filmic sequence, but I wish they'd found some more logical justification for it than hand-delivering something that could've been electronically forwarded in a fraction of a second.

3. Why 23rd century Starfleet communicators are audio only

I believe the ones on Discovery do have video screens. Which is more than a 24th-century combadge could ever have.

4. Why TOS people in security wear bright red on landing party duty

No worse than bright gold or blue. The human eye is actually more sensitive to yellow light than red light, which is why yellow looks brighter to us. And there's no telling what light sensitivity spectra aliens have. (Majliss Larson's TOS novel Pawns and Symbols posited that Klingons couldn't see red, so that security/engineering uniforms looked all-black to them. Although that's been contradicted by all the subsequent movies and episodes with Klingon bridges lit in pure red light.) Different hues of sunlight on different planets would affect the appearance of uniforms too.

Then again, we're most sensitive to yellow because we orbit a yellow sun. Most stars in the galaxy are red, so lots of aliens would probably be more sensitive to red light, in which case red shirts would look brighter to them. Maybe that's why they changed it later on.

How about why was the bridge re-organized between TMP and TWOK? The science station was moved from the back to the side and the engineering station was moved to the other side of the bridge.

I might have already addressed that in Ex Machina or Mere Anarchy: The Darkness Drops Again. Since the TMP bridge was a new design, it's plausible that it had certain features that were being tried out and proved unsuccessful.

TWOK actually shuffled the positions of four stations from the TMP bridge. Science moved two positions counterclockwise (counting the turbolift alcove as one) to replace engineering, which moved five spaces clockwise to replace environmental engineering, which moved diametrically across the bridge to replace internal security, which moved three spaces clockwise to fill science's place at the rear. This put science and engineering back in roughly their TOS positions relative to communications, but moved environmental engineering away from its TOS-like position from TMP.

 

[Jinn]

Unless its a Federation species whose blood is not red.....Vulcans

Uhhhhh..... Well, you see... Errr... The Vulcan redshirts... Just don't die, I guess...

 

[Sophie74656]

(All TIC..well some are)

1. That invisible doorway from the bridge to the toilets
2. Why 24th century PADDS/tablets have less technology than their 21st century counterparts and so Starfleet crew need more than one to work with
3. Why 23rd century Starfleet communicators are audio only
4. Why TOS people in security wear bright red on landing party duty

The real answer of course is that when the PADD was first thought up smart phones and tablets that could do everything was not something people even imagined yet

 

[Nyotarules]

As always, folks, take care to avoid anything that could constitute a specific plot idea...

The thread is about things not in the novels or on screen

I'm willing to excuse TV producers using "pile of padds" as a quick visual shorthand for "having a lot of work."

What excuse do the Star Trek novelists have

 

[Sophie74656]

What excuse do the Star Trek novelists have

The novels tend to follow what is established on screen

 

[Nyotarules]

The real answer of course is that when the PADD was first thought up smart phones and tablets that could do everything was not something people even imagined yet

I can understand that but I find it amusing when the ST books, written after smart phones etc continue that archaic tech in their stories lol

 

[Sophie74656]

I can understand that but I find it amusing when the ST books, written after smart phones etc continue that archaic tech in their stories lol

They're just following what was established in the show

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Here's what I'd like to see in the novels:

- World War III. Quit dancing around the issue, and just show it. Go all-out. Do a Destiny-like series of novels about the war, start to finish. Show us who the ECON actually are, who the other factions were, who started it, how it ended, how exactly the hell Earth managed to recover completely in only a hundred years...well, you get the idea.

- Robau Prime.

- Alexander Marcus Prime. Let's see how different he is from the lunatic Kelvin version from STID.

- Hobus. Need I say more?

(Fortunately, now that the ing lawyers have allowed it, the novels actually will be able to show those last three things.)

How about why was the bridge re-organized between TMP and TWOK? The science station was moved from the back to the side and the engineering station was moved to the other side of the bridge.

Out-of-universe, this was so Shatner and Nimoy could be easily seen in the same shot without having to turn around.

 

[Damian]

Here's what I'd like to see in the novels:

- World War III. Quit dancing around the issue, and just show it. Go all-out. Do a Destiny-like series of novels about the war, start to finish. Show us who the ECON actually are, who the other factions were, who started it, how it ended, how exactly the hell Earth managed to recover completely in only a hundred years...well, you get the idea.

- Robau Prime.

- Alexander Marcus Prime. Let's see how different he is from the lunatic Kelvin version from STID.

- Hobus. Need I say more?

(Fortunately, now that the ing lawyers have allowed it, the novels actually will be able to show those last three things.)



Out-of-universe, this was so Shatner and Nimoy could be easily seen in the same shot without having to turn around.

WWIII is my next big event I'd like to see in some form. We finally answered the Romulan War Question, WWIII is the last significant event to the creation of Star Trek history that I can think of that hasn't been covered.

We've seen snippets in the novelization of First Contact and the novel Federation (which introduced the Optimum movement). But the details are sketchy. I've seen start dates in the 2020s and significantly later, the end date is firm since First Contact noted it was 2053.

I think characters used in the Abramsverse movies, even their prime counterparts, have to probably wait until the licensing is settled and they are allowed to use that.

I might have already addressed that in Ex Machina or Mere Anarchy: The Darkness Drops Again.

I'll take another look at Ex Machina, I may have missed the reference there. I still have to get and read Mere Anarchy so if it's there I'll be on the lookout for it.

I sort of get why they changed it for TWOK, it'd be awkward for Kirk to have to turn around to speak to Spock behind him, it's easier to have him on side, and having the standing security station behind Kirk looked better visually (I would guess moving Spock to Kirk's side was the main goal and other stations were just moved to create better visuals. But in story it made it difficult to explain. I can't imagine it's easy to move an entire bridge station with all the intricate connections. They also somehow made the bridge feel more claustrophobic, even though otherwise it was the same exact set. I attributed that to painting the module darker and decreasing the lighting (but it did seem bigger in TMP and even TSFS where it was white again with brighter lighting).

 

[Christopher]

The thread is about things not in the novels or on screen

That's quite clear, yes. But please keep it to the kind of general details mentioned already, instead of suggestions of specific storylines or events. See: https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/mod...ry-dont-post-story-ideas-spoilers-etc.280025/

(Note: Saying something generalized like "I'd like to see WWIII" is fine, so long as you don't suggest a specific way of telling that story.)

What excuse do the Star Trek novelists have

Can you give an example where novelists have done the "multiple padds" thing?

I can't imagine it's easy to move an entire bridge station with all the intricate connections.

There was a decade or so between TMP and TWOK -- they had plenty of time to change things.

Besides, the actual sets in real life were built so that each station was "wild" and could easily be slid out like a pie wedge. It's easy enough to imagine the in-universe bridge was designed the same way, to make it easier to replace or upgrade the stations.

 

[Damian]

There was a decade or so between TMP and TWOK -- they had plenty of time to change things.

Besides, the actual sets in real life were built so that each station was "wild" and could easily be slid out like a pie wedge. It's easy enough to imagine the in-universe bridge was designed the same way, to make it easier to replace or upgrade the stations.

Yeah, and that's a good an explanation as any. I suppose Kirk could have decided he wanted Spock in easy visual range since he was such an important part of his crew (with Uhura on the other side and Sulu and Chekov in front of him).

Of course there are other examples of even wilder set changes. The Enterprise-A bridge from TVH to TFF is completely different, and TFF is what, weeks after TVH if that long. And of course the Excelsior bridge between TSFS and TUC (granted that was a longer period of time, but the bridge actually did shrink, it was huge in TSFS and was noticeably smaller in TUC.

There were minor changes in the Enterprise-D sets between season 1 and Generations, but those can be easily attributed to upgrades and weren't all that significant.

 

[Greg Cox]

I can understand that but I find it amusing when the ST books, written after smart phones etc continue that archaic tech in their stories lol

Honestly, it's a bit of a balancing act. You want to stay faithful to the original episodes while trying not to highlight the fact that, basically, you're writing a period piece set during a 1960s vision of the future.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

^Plus, it would seem that if an author were going introduce a new technology, he or she would have to explain how it worked and work it convincingly into the plot. Otherwise, I could see an editor or publisher balk at its inclusion. Using conventions that are already part of the show is a safer path to publication.

 

[Leto_II]

Here's what I'd like to see in the novels:

- World War III. Quit dancing around the issue, and just show it. Go all-out. Do a Destiny-like series of novels about the war, start to finish. Show us who the ECON actually are, who the other factions were, who started it, how it ended, how exactly the hell Earth managed to recover completely in only a hundred years...well, you get the idea.

WWIII is my next big event I'd like to see in some form. We finally answered the Romulan War Question, WWIII is the last significant event to the creation of Star Trek history that I can think of that hasn't been covered.

We've seen snippets in the novelization of First Contact and the novel Federation (which introduced the Optimum movement). But the details are sketchy. I've seen start dates in the 2020s and significantly later, the end date is firm since First Contact noted it was 2053.

Actually, several other official sources have depicted WWIII from various points-of-view:

• The Lost Era: The Sundered shows us the nuclear exchange from the perspective of the crew of an orbiting L-5 asteroid habitat, and gives a ton of additional new information on the political situation behind the war (which partially originated in the Star Trek: First Contact movie and novelization).
• The Star Trek: First Contact novelization, of course.
• "The Immortality Blues," a short story found in Strange New Worlds 9 -- Flint the Immortal survives the nuclear destruction of New York City during WWIII, and is consistent with The Lost Era: The Sundered.
  
• "Mestral," another short story likewise found in Strange New Worlds 9 -- the Vulcan self-exile from ENT: "Carbon Creek" helps Zefram Cochrane escape from Boston right before it gets destroyed in WWIII, and helps him survive in the aftermath of the war. (Also used The Lost Era: The Sundered as its basis.)

But yeah -- an epic, historical novel set during the war would be very interesting.

Yeah, and that's a good an explanation as any. I suppose Kirk could have decided he wanted Spock in easy visual range since he was such an important part of his crew (with Uhura on the other side and Sulu and Chekov in front of him).

Of course there are other examples of even wilder set changes. The Enterprise-A bridge from TVH to TFF is completely different, and TFF is what, weeks after TVH if that long.

More like months (at least six months, according to executive producer Harve Bennett, but modern sources have established something much closer to a year or thereabouts between TVH and TFF).

 

[Damian]

Actually, several other official sources have depicted WWIII from various points-of-view:

• The Lost Era: The Sundered shows us the nuclear exchange from the perspective of the crew of an orbiting L-5 asteroid habitat, and gives a ton of additional new information on the political situation behind the war (which partially originated in the Star Trek: First Contact movie and novelization).
• The Star Trek: First Contact novelization, of course.
• "The Immortality Blues," a short story found in Strange New Worlds 9 -- Flint the Immortal survives the nuclear destruction of New York City during WWIII, and is consistent with The Lost Era: The Sundered.
  
• "Mestral," another short story likewise found in Strange New Worlds 9 -- the Vulcan self-exile from ENT: "Carbon Creek" helps Zefram Cochrane escape from Boston right before it gets destroyed in WWIII, and helps him survive in the aftermath of the war. (Also used The Lost Era: The Sundered as its basis.)

But yeah -- an epic, historical novel set during the war would be very interesting.


More like months (at least six months, according to executive producer Harve Bennett, but modern sources have established something much closer to a year or thereabouts between TVH and TFF).

Yeah, there have been snippets about WWIII. It'd just be interesting if someone were able to tie it all together. ECON, what's been covered in the stories you mentioned, Colonel Green's involvement, the drugged soldiers shown in Encounter at Farpoint and the aforementioned Optimum movement. It sounds like there was more than just 2 major actors in that conflict. Dayton Wards' Elusive Salvation covered the time period and was tantalizingly close, but I guess WWIII wasn't really relevant to his story. Like the Romulan War, it's the one event mentioned but a lot of it is still a mystery (who were the major actors, how did it start and what finally ended it).

I wasn't sure of the exact time frame between TVH and TFF. But still a total bridge overhaul, after it was just refit. I'd love someone to find an in universe explanation for that (I mean, it's easy enough to explain changes from TMP to TWOK since it was years later, and there was only station movement, in TFF it's totally different after only a few months).