We could've had the First Asian Female Captain, but no....

[CorporalCaptain]

Ok, maybe that came across wrong. What I mean by that is I don’t believe you should automatically like something just because a black person or Asian person or woman or gay person or trans person has the lead role, surely they have to have depth to their acting, a likeable factor other than their sexual preference/skin colour.

I don't believe that anybody in this thread has been saying that they would automatically like something, if it had the kind of representation they'd like to see generally. If someone said that, or even implied it, then I missed it.

What I've seen some people saying is that they'd like a more realistic and inclusive representation to exist on screen, period. I presume they'll still be judging whether they like films and shows in terms of, well, whether they like them or not, as in whether they like the story, characters, action, VFX, music, etc. according to their own personal taste for weighing together all the elements that make up a film or show, as the case may be.

 

[Awesome Possum]

I don't believe that anybody in this thread has been saying that they would automatically like something, if it had the kind of representation they'd like to see generally. If someone said that, or even implied it, then I missed it.

What I've seen some people saying is that they'd like a more realistic and inclusive representation to exist on screen, period. I presume they'll still be judging whether they like films and shows in terms of, well, whether they like them or not, as in whether they like the story, characters, action, VFX, music, etc. according to their own personal taste for weighing together all the elements that make up a film or show, as the case may be.

Exactly. Having minority representation doesn't automatically make a piece of media good to a member of that minority. What we want to actually see equal representation and get to see ourselves in roles that are generally just given to white people by default for various reasons. The biggest right now is claiming that hiring a white actor or actress has more of a built in audience, which is really because they get more roles leading to a bigger audience over time. It's a self-fulfilling prophesy. Like in the case of the Ghost in the Shell US movie, yeah Scarlett Johansson has a bigger audience than some Japanese-American actress, but it's only because she has been given more opportunities. If you only sell cheese pizza, then cheese pizza is going to become popular and you can claim no one wants anything else because they all buy cheese pizza due to lack of other options.

 

[Refuge]

How come having Georgiou as the first Asian female Captain doesn't count? I must admit I don't understand why 'Discovery' is being held accountable here.

 

[Nerys Myk]

How come having Georgiou as the first Asian female Captain doesn't count? I must admit I don't understand why 'Discovery' is being held accountable here.

Probably because she isn't the lead.

 

[CorporalClegg]

We were misled. The show promoted this notion that there would be two major starships to follow, unlike the traditional *one*. I had it in my head that these two ships would carry us through the series, with its Captains.

Nothing of the sort was ever 'promoted.' The promotional material presented two ships and two captains; anything beyond that was the collective internet brain interpreting and making assumptions. But that's no different than what happens in the months leading up to any show of film.

 

[Refuge]

Probably because she isn't the lead.

Meh the lead isn't a Captain either. The OP wants a Captain. Mind you the Captain of Discovery - a middle-aged white man is dead.

'Discovery' has failed in many areas but it has contributed to diversity.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Meh the lead isn't a Captain either. The OP wants a Captain. Mind you the Captain of Discovery - a middle-aged white man is dead.

'Discovery' had failed in many areas but it has contributed to diversity.

He seems to want the Captain to be the lead as well.

 

[Jedi_Master]

I won’t stop printing pamphlets until we have a Captain Korg

 

[Refuge]

He seems to want the Captain to be the lead as well.

Yeah I guess that's what we're used to.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Sisko was originally a commander.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Sisko was originally a commander.

 

[cooleddie74]

Well, I'm sure if he was promoted it was because of a politically correct Hollywood agenda forcing minorities on the audience and not because Avery Brooks was a profoundly talented and effective actor who helped create a memorable and beloved Starfleet offi...


Oh.

 

[Refuge]

Well, I'm sure if he was promoted it was because of a politically correct Hollywood agenda forcing minorities on the audience and not because Avery Brooks was a profoundly talented and effective actor who helped create a memorable and beloved Starfleet offi...


Oh.

If he was promoted it would be because it fit the story.

 

[Mudd]

Well, I'm sure if he was promoted it was because of a politically correct Hollywood agenda forcing minorities on the audience and not because Avery Brooks was a profoundly talented and effective actor who helped create a memorable and beloved Starfleet offi...


Oh.

Cripes, the character's promotion had nothing to do with Brooks' performance - he was already the star of the show. It was part of an overall retooling of the show intended to generate some buzz for an underperforming series.

 

[Refuge]

Not every casting or production decision is a conspiracy to prevent diversity or societal influence.

 

[johnjm22]

Michelle Yeoh's acting on STD was terrible. Stiff as hell.

She would have made an awful lead character. Almost as bad as Burnham.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Like in the case of the Ghost in the Shell US movie, yeah Scarlett Johansson has a bigger audience than some Japanese-American actress, but it's only because she has been given more opportunities. If you only sell cheese pizza, then cheese pizza is going to become popular and you can claim no one wants anything else because they all buy cheese pizza due to lack of other options.

As a big GitS fan, I've watched the original movie that was made in the 90's, the 2x TV series, the newer Movie, and read all the original Manga that it was based on.

And boy was I pissed that they couldn't find a SINGLE Asian person to play Motoko Kusanagi.
If it's a bust issue, there are some Busty Asian Actresses out there; if not, padding.
There are also plenty of good Asian Actresses.
What would've been perfect was a ALL Japanese cast, made by Japan, for Japan; And we get some subtitles.

Kind of like how the Rurouni Kenshin movies were made.
God, that was such a good trilogy of movies.

 

[gblews]

As opposed to TOS which was just a tad less white, no less patriarchal, and with an occasional dash of misogyny?

I give them kudos for making an effort

Indeed. What TOS did in 1966, including black woman as a regular castmember and an Asian man, was positively monumental. I think there were had been maybe two other one hour dramas before that that had a black person in the regular cast. By today's standards it doesn't seem like much but if viewed from the perspective of the times in which it happened it represented a MAJOR step forward for black actors and the collective black community.

 

[gblews]

Was the third Ghostbusters movie mediocre because all the leads were female or due to poor storytelling? (I have not seen it).

Fanboy misogynists would have you believe that the reason the movie didn't do better than it did at the box office was because of the lead characters were all played by women actors. The four women stars are among the most accomplished comedic actors working today. Movies have trouble drawing paying customers for all sorts of reasons as this movie did, but of all the issues it had, the lead actors weren't a part of the problem.

 

[Jayson1]

I am curious about something with diversity and tv. Some say that in 2018 it's still not diverse and most shows are lead by while male leads but has anyone actually bothered to look this stuff up or is everyone just going by their gut feelings and memories of how tv used to be? Not to mention the fact that we don't all watch ever single tv show that is in current production. Diversity seems to be happening a great deal with the shows I watch but I can't say, like everyone else, that I have seen every current tv show on tv or a streaming service. I mean I can tell that transgender and asian characters are underrepresented at a glance, but i'm not so sure about other groups and I am almost positive that female characters are no longer under represented. Of course it also gets tricky when you have a show like "X-FIles" were you have basically two leads and has anyone judged gender.race and character popularity and how would someone even do that when that is such a subjective term? One person's great character is just another person's "meh" character.

Jason