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Spoilers DC's Legends of Tomorrow - Season 3

Gryffindorian said:
Why did Dahrk betray the team at the last minute? I thought the whole point of creating the temporal anomaly was to bring about Mallus and defeat him, and in the process liberate Nora from his influence. Instead, Dahrk would have history run its normal course in order to save Nora.
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I was a bit puzzled by that, too, but I think the answer must lie in the scene where the death totem manifested Nora. I'd have to review the scene's dialogue to be sure, but my guess is something she said led Damien to conclude she couldn't be restored by Mallus's defeat, but that his full emergence would result in her permanent death. If so, however, they could have conveyed it more clearly, or we wouldn't be having this discussion.
 
Guy Gardener said:
Damian thought that the death of her personality was already a done deal, even if her body hadn't been shredded yet.

All that was left was revenge.

Then Nora's ghost showed up, and his plan changed.
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Okay, pulled up the Nora's ghost scene on YouTube, and think this might be right (though it's still a little confusing).
 
I thought that was pretty clear myself.
This one was a lot of fun.
The "Barry" Obama and John Noble stuff was a lot of fun, although I was surprised how quick they were. I figured they were each going to get whole episodes focused on them.
I'm really liking what they're doing with Damian this season. He was a pretty good villain before, but this season has made him one of my favorite Arrowverse villains.
The stuff with the Vixens' village was good too.
 
Christopher said:
So Obama was president on Earth-1, but we know that President Cannon Fodder and VP Susan Brayden were in office in December 2016. I
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The Legends basically ripped off this canon violation from last month's Scandal/How to Get Away with Murder, where Barack Obama has been the constantly mentioned president in HTGAWM, yet Michaela, and the world's biggest fan of the Obamas, is dying with excitement to meet former President Grant during the third term of the Grants. Are you allowed to plagiarise canon violations? ABC should sue.

It's very possible Barack Obama was up to something very different, perhaps not even politics. I think Mick likes him, and I don't think he'd have liked anyone in power. Or maybe Obama was just a president at a different time. Not that we can take the identity of the president as a constant – Beebo day didn't stick, but John Diggle Jr. and Captain Jiwe rum stuck. Whoever was president, maybe he is not any more.

A bigger problem would arise if they ever tried to integrate Black Lightning into the Arrowverse, where Obama is the president and Supergirl is a role model (it would be worse if she's a fictional one).

JD said:
I thought that was pretty clear myself.
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Pretty clear, but also not very smart on Damien's part. If Nora was so gone, and it was only Mollusc left, how they fooled her/him by playing his own voice in her/his ear? If you watched and thought Damien couldn't be fooled so blatantly, the episode doesn't add up to you.
 
YellowSubmarine said:
Or maybe Obama was just a president at a different time.
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The thing is, he became president at such a relatively young age (48), and such an early point in his career (after only 2/3 of his first Senate term), that it's hard to imagine it happening any earlier.


YellowSubmarine said:
A bigger problem would arise if they ever tried to integrate Black Lightning into the Arrowverse, where Obama is the president and Supergirl is a role model (it would be worse if she's a fictional one).
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BL might be on a different Earth in the multiverse, like Supergirl is. That'd be the simplest approach.


YellowSubmarine said:
If Nora was so gone, and it was only Mollusc left, how they fooled her/him by playing his own voice in her/his ear?
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No, Nora died when Mallus emerged physically. That's what Sara intended to cause by saving Amaya's village, thereby breaking history enough to finally free Mallus from his time prison. The John Noble voice trick was before that. Sure, Mallus said there was nothing left but him, but then Damien got that Death Totem Force-ghost vision of Nora saying "I'm not gone yet, I'm still fighting." (Demons have a way of lying.) So she wasn't actually gone until the village was saved and Night on Bald Mallus emerged.
 
That's what actually happened. But the point is, Mallus fooled Damien that's not the case, which was the only reason Damien was in on the plan, until the death totem made him talk to Nora.
 
YellowSubmarine said:
That's what actually happened. But the point is, Mallus fooled Damien that's not the case, which was the only reason Damien was in on the plan, until the death totem made him talk to Nora.
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Okay, I see what you mean. Still, I think the bit where Mallus-in-Nora claimed she was already gone was after they'd used the voice trick to lure her to the Waverider.
 
In the Arrow Pilot, Tommy Merlyn told Oliver one of the things he missed while on the Island was the election of the first Black President. So there was a President Barack Obama reference from the very beginning of the Arrowverse, Earth 1.

Things got murky later when they started expanding the details of this fictional universe. When they had an alien invasion they did not want an actual real life President killed. So thy created a fictional one. Yet here they want to reference Obama's presidency again. The Arrowverse shows often have been random and inconsistent in their world building. Sometimes they draw on real history when it serves an episode and others invent their own history. Even when it contridicts what they have said.

Sara telling Obama she misses him was practically breaking the fourth. That only has meaning if Trump is president like in the real world. Which does not fit what we saw in Invasion. It also feels off for time travelers to make comments about current events. When they mostly have not been in their time of origin too long for the the last 3 years.
 
Dick Whitman said:
Sara telling Obama she misses him was practically breaking the fourth. That only has meaning if Trump is president like in the real world. Which does not fit what we saw in Invasion.
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Not necessarily. I think President Obama would've been a hard act for anyone to follow. And another president, even a sane and competent one, might've had other baggage like a marital scandal or something. Or just not been as effective a leader. So people on Earth-1 might still miss him, just not quite as desperately as we do.

Hmm... Maybe something happened that required President Obama to step down before the end of his second term (a health issue or family crisis, maybe) and his VP, who took over as president, was the guy who was POTUS at the start of "Invasion!" He then appointed Susan Brayden as his VP in turn, and then "Invasion!" happened. But maybe Trump had already been elected and Brayden just acted pro tem until inauguration -- although that doesn't fit with an Arrow character mentioning a female president in an early-2017 episode, but maybe that can be tweaked to be pre-inauguration.
 
Christopher said:
The thing is, he became president at such a relatively young age (48), and such an early point in his career (after only 2/3 of his first Senate term), that it's hard to imagine it happening any earlier.
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I vaguely recall having this conversation before...Anyway, Obama lost a primary race for a Democratic-leaning U.S. House seat in 2000. A win in 2000 would have given him a platform to win the Illinois governorship in 2002 (in which another Democratic House member won in our universe), which could conceivably have given him a way to take the presidency in 2004. It's an unlikely path to the presidency, but it's not much more unlikely than what actually happened (a first term Senator taking the presidency).
 
That will be 3 new members to the show as series regulars. I assume that means at least a couple of people will be leaving. Just how big would the cast be? Would they have the ability of a "LOst" or "Game of Thrones" were it feels like they have 20 series regulars? I think the writing is clear Amara will be gone. I could even see Nate leaving to go be with her in the past back in 1942. I'm guessing Damien Dahrk would be third, but i'm not sure if he counts as a series regular. Also I am thinking they will need to add at the very least one new bad guy character to main cast though we don't know who would be the baddiie next season.

Jason
 
Jayson1 said:
That will be 3 new members to the show as series regulars. I assume that means at least a couple of people will be leaving. Just how big would the cast be? Would they have the ability of a "LOst" or "Game of Thrones" were it feels like they have 20 series regulars? I think the writing is clear Amara will be gone. I could even see Nate leaving to go be with her in the past back in 1942. I'm guessing Damien Dahrk would be third, but i'm not sure if he counts as a series regular. Also I am thinking they will need to add at the very least one new bad guy character to main cast though we don't know who would be the baddiie next season.

Jason
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To date, fifteen actors have been credited as "main characters", Garber, Renee, Hentschel, Miller and Letscher are pretty definately gone, Darvill and Drameh are definately "in the bubble" maybe Richardso-Sellers, Ashe & Zano too now the Totems arc is drawing to a close.

I think the most likely line-up for s4 at this point is Lotz, Pemberton, Purcell, Routh, Lonsdale, Macallen & Ryan which would be plenty.
 
JD said:
So I wonder if this means she'll be leaving the Time Bureau?
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No reason the show can't have a regular who isn't on the Waverider crew. Heck, even Gary's practically a regular at this point. And if cops like Quentin Lance, Joe West, and Bill Henderson can be regulars on other superhero shows, there's no reason a time cop like Ava can't be too.
 
With the clone stuff you could actually have two Ava's next season. One on the ship and one at the Time Bureau. That's all assuming they are going to keep the Time Bureau concept alive for next season. I could see them doing something else next year though I am guessing they will still want to keep using the Gary character in some fashion. I am kind of curious what the main arc will be for next season. Could they do a season without time travel? I once heard that time travel wasn't going to be used quite like it has become to be used on the show.

Jason
 
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