Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 1x08 - "Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
It first appears in an earlier scene in the film.
I never once, not for one minute, ever thought the Xindi might win. You know why? It's Star Trek! The closest we're ever going to get to the Federation losing a war is imagining that Andromeda was a Trek series. Even if the series were set In 2525, I'd feel no suspense about the outcome of the war.
Liked that Airiam got the conn this episode.
Ariam gets the conn quite frequently yet we know nothing about her. I loved hearing both navigator and helmsman speak today!
Two biomechanical people on the bridge who are probably head-texting each other privately all the time, which is why they have had three lines spoken aloud between the two of them since the pilot.
It's back next week. Then takes a break until Jan 2108.
I'd better find a cryotube or something.
This one was a 4.
It felt like a poor ST:VOY episode. I don't mind a trope here or there but this one was Star Trek trope galore:
- Non Corporeal beings take control of crewmember -- check
- Controlled crewmember goes on and on about how "Everything's fine...this is the answer to everything -- check
- Controlled crewmember expects all other Landing Party members to 'go native' -- check.
But hey, at least Saru wasn't made immune to Phasers on stun so there's one trope avoided.
And they didn't need to re/de/whatever polarize something to get Saru back to normal so a second Trope avoided.
As for the serialized elements: I find it interesting that Starfleet DIDN'T order Lorca to attempt to find/free/recover the Admiral. And if Starfleet Command doesn't want to put the U.S.S. Discovery at the center of Klingon tactical thouught, WHY did the Admiral not use a Shittle from her Cruiser to travel to the meeting site? Also, I guess victory is fleeting as last week Discovery was single-handedly winning the war; yet now all of a sudden - due to Klingon cloaking tech - although with the way it works it seems more like ECM since they seem to know the Klingon ships are there, but they cant get a lock/plot a solution to fire -- even though invisibility was a part of the ship T'Kuvma used to destroy the U.S.S. Europa - the Federation is losing big again.
^^^
Although if this is going to be the Production team's attempt at a technicality regarding Klingon Cloaking tech; please that ship has sailed. And sorry to say, but unless Starfleet is terminally incompetent; with the degree of cloaking tech we've seen -- there's no way Kirk or Spock wouldn't/shouldn't have recalled this during TOS - "Balance of Terror" so even I have to say I wish the Production team would stop trying to claim "Oh, any seeming continuity violations will be explained by the end -- trust us." because sorry, at this point I don't see any other explanation then: "Hey, we really don't care that much about actual TOS continuity - and we really didn't want to limit our story options..."
And you know, if they just came out and admitted this at the start, I as a hardcore TOS fan would have been fine with that - but I really hate it when they sit there and go: "No it'll all be worked out because we do care, and we're all BIG TOS fans..." Yeah, they may be TOS fans, but again, I'd rather see an honest answer then the BS they've been shoveling on that aspect. And again, this really felt like warmed over ST:VOY.
Also, after L'Rell's comments to the Admiral, if Ash ISN'T a altered Voq and a spy, then Voq as a character was really useless to this 'serialized story'overall. I also really hope the Admiral IS dead; and we don't have a: "L'Rell knocked me out and ejected me in an Escape Pod moment. I also like that they showed Kol knowing full well what L'Rell was up to on the ship and I hope they don't wimp out on the execution. Time will tell.
It felt like a poor ST:VOY episode. I don't mind a trope here or there but this one was Star Trek trope galore:
- Non Corporeal beings take control of crewmember -- check
- Controlled crewmember goes on and on about how "Everything's fine...this is the answer to everything -- check
- Controlled crewmember expects all other Landing Party members to 'go native' -- check.
But hey, at least Saru wasn't made immune to Phasers on stun so there's one trope avoided.
And they didn't need to re/de/whatever polarize something to get Saru back to normal so a second Trope avoided.
As for the serialized elements: I find it interesting that Starfleet DIDN'T order Lorca to attempt to find/free/recover the Admiral. And if Starfleet Command doesn't want to put the U.S.S. Discovery at the center of Klingon tactical thouught, WHY did the Admiral not use a Shittle from her Cruiser to travel to the meeting site? Also, I guess victory is fleeting as last week Discovery was single-handedly winning the war; yet now all of a sudden - due to Klingon cloaking tech - although with the way it works it seems more like ECM since they seem to know the Klingon ships are there, but they cant get a lock/plot a solution to fire -- even though invisibility was a part of the ship T'Kuvma used to destroy the U.S.S. Europa - the Federation is losing big again.
^^^
Although if this is going to be the Production team's attempt at a technicality regarding Klingon Cloaking tech; please that ship has sailed. And sorry to say, but unless Starfleet is terminally incompetent; with the degree of cloaking tech we've seen -- there's no way Kirk or Spock wouldn't/shouldn't have recalled this during TOS - "Balance of Terror" so even I have to say I wish the Production team would stop trying to claim "Oh, any seeming continuity violations will be explained by the end -- trust us." because sorry, at this point I don't see any other explanation then: "Hey, we really don't care that much about actual TOS continuity - and we really didn't want to limit our story options..."
And you know, if they just came out and admitted this at the start, I as a hardcore TOS fan would have been fine with that - but I really hate it when they sit there and go: "No it'll all be worked out because we do care, and we're all BIG TOS fans..." Yeah, they may be TOS fans, but again, I'd rather see an honest answer then the BS they've been shoveling on that aspect. And again, this really felt like warmed over ST:VOY.
Also, after L'Rell's comments to the Admiral, if Ash ISN'T a altered Voq and a spy, then Voq as a character was really useless to this 'serialized story'overall. I also really hope the Admiral IS dead; and we don't have a: "L'Rell knocked me out and ejected me in an Escape Pod moment. I also like that they showed Kol knowing full well what L'Rell was up to on the ship and I hope they don't wimp out on the execution. Time will tell.
Except that these items did NOT happen. That was the idea, right? That the episode subverts the longstanding Trek trope of "If you just inhaled an alien species, you're definitely being controlled by it." Saru wasn't controlled; he was being entirely himself. Have we ever seen that before on Trek?
Its called Booze.
He says at the end - "I was not myself..." - controlled/influenced, it's an OLD Star Trek (and Science Fiction in general) trope. And yes, he did expect Burnham and Tyler to stay on the planet with him and 'commune' with the lifeforms (which is why he took and crushed their communicators) - so yeah, those things did happen in this episode.
Have we seen it before? Yes.
TOS - "This Side of Paradise"
TNG - "Lonely Among Us"
i thought this episode was the best example so far for what i suspect discovery is trying to accomplish: juggling the interpersonal and political conflicts with star trek science fiction tropes and dilemmas.
it only kind of succeeded. i thought the 3-4 threads here kneecapped the A story, which was the planetside plot. and the klingon story was less interesting because it was so opaque - i didn’t know who was playing who and it was frustrating, not thrilling.
but maybe the show is starting to find its voice. maybe.
it only kind of succeeded. i thought the 3-4 threads here kneecapped the A story, which was the planetside plot. and the klingon story was less interesting because it was so opaque - i didn’t know who was playing who and it was frustrating, not thrilling.
but maybe the show is starting to find its voice. maybe.
He doesn't say that. Here's the dialogue from the end of the episode:
Saru: I lied to you and Lt. Tyler. I attacked you. I could have killed you.
Michael: You weren't yourself.
Saru: But I was.
Saru was not controlled, so his actions were not those of a "controlled crewmember." That's my point--not that he didn't want them to stay on the planet, not that he didn't at least say that he thought the planet was the answer--but that these were his character-based actions, not those of someone whose mind had been compromised and controlled.
EDIT: Which is to say, I don't think we've seen that before--a character turning out not to be controlled. The episode knows we expect him to be controlled, and turns it on its head.
Yeah , I should invest in a cloning process.Shit, I'll be dead by then.
At lest the next generation of my selves will be around for the rest of the first season!
Another great episode this week. I like the more ensemble feel of the last few episodes. After the first few episodes,I wasn't sure about Discovery but it seems to have found its groove. It may not be as good as <insert-your-favorites-trek-series-here> yet but it's certainly top quality tv. Better than most tv shows out there.
I liked the alien planet and beings this week. The interactions between characters. Good space battle. It's unfortunate there's so many hiatus periods in American TV. It's harder to generate loyalty and some kind of weekly date with a TV show without more consistency on the scheduling.
Top quality episode. Among the best show on TV at the moment along with The Orville.
I liked the alien planet and beings this week. The interactions between characters. Good space battle. It's unfortunate there's so many hiatus periods in American TV. It's harder to generate loyalty and some kind of weekly date with a TV show without more consistency on the scheduling.
Top quality episode. Among the best show on TV at the moment along with The Orville.
You can blame the 2007 Writers Guild of America strike for that one.
So, Tilly is captain in the mirror universe?