Spoilers We now have Ship Class names for BotBS

[Christopher]

Paramount didn't want the Sovereign class used in a TV show, feeling there had to be a movie exclusive ship in order to get people to the theatres.

Huh? Who goes to a movie exclusively for the ship? I'd think movie audiences would care more about whether they could see Patrick Stewart, Brent Spiner, etc. than whether they could see a model spaceship. I'm not convinced this was their actual reasoning.

 

[CRM-114]

They come from startrek.com

http://trekcore.com/blog/2017/11/star-trek-discovery-battle-of-the-binary-stars-armada-identified/

I don't like that they're all named after Americans.

Engle-class USS T’Plana-Hath (NCC-1004)
Nimitz-class USS Europa (NCC-1648)
Hoover-class USS Edison (NCC-1683)
Cardenas-class USS Yeager (NCC-1437)
Malachowski-class USS Clarke (NCC-1661)
Shepard-class USS Kerala (NCC-1255)
Magee-class USS Shran (NCC-1413)

For all the talk about embracing other cultures and celebrating diversity, Star Trek has always held a very Western mindset (which I tend to believe has hindered its' popularity).

 

[Dukhat]

Paramount didn't want the Sovereign class used in a TV show, feeling there had to be a movie exclusive ship in order to get people to the theatres. I remember Ira Behr fought tooth and nail to get a Sovereign class ship into the fleet in WYLB but Paramount wouldn't budge fearing no one would see the next TNG movie in theatres. Ironically, no one saw that movie in theatres anyway.

I don’t think that was the reason. I remember reading somewhere that TPTB didn’t want a Sovereign class ship in DS9 simply because they felt the audience would think that they were seeing the Enterprise each time instead of some other random ship. Remember, this was a time when Trek producers thought their audience was such a bunch of morons that they used an intact establishing shot of Starfleet Academy in VOY even though it had been previously destroyed in DS9. Why? Because they thought that the VOY audience didn’t watch DS9 and wouldn’t understand why it was destroyed. Never mind that references to DS9 were made many times throughout the show once they established contact with Earth. Or the fact that the producers of ENT originally wanted to use the Akira class for the NX-01 because they thought that being just a background ship in FC and DS9, the audience wouldn’t remember it.

 

[Mel Tenorio]

Where's the USS Escobar, cartel class?

 

[Captain of the USS Averof]

Huh? Who goes to a movie exclusively for the ship? I'd think movie audiences would care more about whether they could see Patrick Stewart, Brent Spiner, etc. than whether they could see a model spaceship. I'm not convinced this was their actual reasoning.

That was indeed their reasoning. Whether it was reasonable or not is another story.

 

[Tim Thomason]

They come from startrek.com

http://trekcore.com/blog/2017/11/star-trek-discovery-battle-of-the-binary-stars-armada-identified/

I don't like that they're all named after Americans.

Engle-class USS T’Plana-Hath (NCC-1004)
Nimitz-class USS Europa (NCC-1648)
Hoover-class USS Edison (NCC-1683)
Cardenas-class USS Yeager (NCC-1437)
Malachowski-class USS Clarke (NCC-1661)
Shepard-class USS Kerala (NCC-1255)
Magee-class USS Shran (NCC-1413)

Or possibly:
Engle class - named after Swedish socialist Kerstin Engle
Nimitz class - named after German physicist Gunter Nimtz, who worked heavily investigating superliminal quantum tunnelling
Hoover class - named after German botanist Herbert Huber, who studied angiosperms
Cardenas class - named after the Bay of Cardenas, Cuba
Malachowski class - named after the first Prime Minister of Poland, Stanislaw Malachowski
Shepard class - named after English Puritan Thomas Shepard, an early minister at Harvard College
Magee class - named after a Canadian already. He was raised in China and England, and had very little ties to America, despite his father's family and one year of American boarding school.

Five of the seven ships were not named after Americans.

 

[Captain of the USS Averof]

Hoover class, named after the Hoover Company, an American manufacturer of vacuum cleaners.

What? Starfleet does have a "tech hygiene" reputation after all!

 

[Christopher]

Or maybe they're named for important space explorers of the 21st and 22nd centuries?

 

[Tuskin38]

Or possibly:
Engle class - named after Swedish socialist Kerstin Engle
Nimitz class - named after German physicist Gunter Nimtz, who worked heavily investigating superliminal quantum tunnelling
Hoover class - named after German botanist Herbert Huber, who studied angiosperms
Cardenas class - named after the Bay of Cardenas, Cuba
Malachowski class - named after the first Prime Minister of Poland, Stanislaw Malachowski
Shepard class - named after English Puritan Thomas Shepard, an early minister at Harvard College
Magee class - named after a Canadian already. He was raised in China and England, and had very little ties to America, despite his father's family and one year of American boarding school.

Five of the seven ships were not named after Americans.

Nope

Also John says that first ship of the class using that class's name should still be true

 

[Tim Thomason]

Nope

Also John says that first ship of the class using that class's name should still be true

I agree. I was just telling Tuskin that he can choose to believe something else if he wants to ignore background info.

 

[Tuskin38]

I agree. I was just telling Tuskin that he can choose to believe something else if he wants to ignore background info.

You were quoting me lmao

 

[The Wormhole]

I remember reading somewhere that TPTB didn’t want a Sovereign class ship in DS9 simply because they felt the audience would think that they were seeing the Enterprise each time instead of some other random ship.

Thing is, we saw plenty of Galaxy class ships in the Dominion War fleets, wouldn't that have run the risk of people thinking they were seeing the Enterprise D? Or for that matter, when we saw the Intrepid class Bellerophon wouldn't someone have thought it was Voyager?

 

[David cgc]

Or for that matter, when we saw the Intrepid class Bellerophon wouldn't someone have thought it was Voyager?

In that case, it's probably more a confirmation of the rule. Aside from deep-background Frankenstein Fleet ships, the Bellerophon was the only Intrepid seen in DS9, and in a specific situation where there were a lot of scenes set on a Starfleet ship in rooms that didn't correspond to places on the Defiant. I suppose they could've redressed the Voyager sets and used a different kind of ship, but that may not have been practical since Voyager would've needed those sets back intact fairly quickly. But either way, Intrepids weren't just hanging around in DS9 when any ship would do.

The Galaxy is harder to fit with the rationale, though they could've believed it didn't matter since the Enterprise-D was already replaced in the movies, or that they'd already set a precedent with the Odyssey.

There's also the matter of the Defiants in "Message in a Bottle" and "Endgame." Of course, I don't think it made sense either. I think it would've been fun to see more Sovereigns and Intrepids (and Ambassadors and New Oreleanses and Constitutions and any ships with actual names and registry numbers instead of big weird blank spots on the saucer...), but Paramount seemed terrified of creating a trans-media franchise empire a la the modern Star Wars or Marvel stuff. Perhaps TPTB still are, and that's why Discovery isn't in the Kelvin Timeline.

 

[The Wormhole]

There's also the matter of the Defiants in "Message in a Bottle" and "Endgame."

I choose to believe that one of the Defiants in Message in a Bottle actually was the Defiant, since the security officers who beam aboard the Prometheus bridge when the battle is done were regular background extras from DS9. And as it turns out, due to a production error, both Defiants actually have USS Defiant on their hulls. Maybe one was the Defiant, and the other the Sao Paulo?

Paramount seemed terrified of creating a trans-media franchise empire a la the modern Star Wars or Marvel stuff. Perhaps TPTB still are, and that's why Discovery isn't in the Kelvin Timeline.

Well, there is the rumour that Abrams wanted to do a transmedia thing with his movies, which was partially realized by Orci having a supervisory role with the comic books, though Paramount allegedly put their foot down before that got too far.

 

[Christopher]

Perhaps TPTB still are, and that's why Discovery isn't in the Kelvin Timeline.

I think it isn't in the Kelvin Timeline because it isn't a Bad Robot/Paramount co-production. And because it was conceived by Bryan Fuller, who wanted to fill in gaps in the Prime Timeline.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

when we saw the Intrepid class Bellerophon wouldn't someone have thought it was Voyager?

Interesting thing about the Bellerophon, BTW...check out the scenes in the mess hall: It's the same as Voyager's, and it shouldn't be.

Voyager's mess hall originally had a bank of replicators in it. Neelix had them removed so he could put in his kitchen. And the Bellerophon's mess hall looked the same.

 

[cooleddie74]

But how big are they??

That's a personal question, mate.

 

[The Wormhole]

Interesting thing about the Bellerophon, BTW...check out the scenes in the mess hall: It's the same as Voyager's, and it shouldn't be.

Voyager's mess hall originally had a bank of replicators in it. Neelix had them removed so he could put in his kitchen. And the Bellerophon's mess hall looked the same.

Which means the Bellerophon's captain gave up his/her personal dining room.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ Yes, but how did they get ahold of Neelix's plans?

 

[STR]

Well, there is the rumour that Abrams wanted to do a transmedia thing with his movies, which was partially realized by Orci having a supervisory role with the comic books, though Paramount allegedly put their foot down before that got too far.

Good, because Countdown was dumb AF.