• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Summarizing Discovery at 5 episodes

Status
Not open for further replies.

RAMA

Admiral
Admiral
So it turns out the show was every bit as different, from production to writing and execution as I had suggested. While I thought it would be polarizing it is even more so, with older fans generally having a hard time accepting it than newer, though the reaction has also been one of surprise from every facet of fandom. This is difficult to see why it is so. Not only have the Producers gone into great details at the changes but I also have been pointing them out for about a year. I can literally post the same screencaps from a year to before the premiere and they are all still accurate and valid. Some but not all of these include:

1) Reimagining-which covers most of it. (Ex: why oh why is it called the D7 when we know what a D7 is?) All this does is make fans sound uninformed and dim.

1A) Canon-Are you kidding?

2) Darker and edgier- Well yes it is and we were told it as going to be. Still, it's not exactly Hannibal or GoT. It's a streaming show, get over it.

3) Profanity! With the amount of outrage online over a couple of words in the last episode, you'd think every Trek fan was a puritan. I can't even count how many curse words I've heard since I started catching up on Fall episodes of various series. It's a streaming show, get over it.

4) Expensive: Yes fans, this is not your Mother's Trek. Everything is finely made, detailed, and jumps off the screen with color, life, and hi-tech glossiness. How many times have I heard fans who miss the static establishing shots, constant head closeups, lack of movement, and washed out TV lighting, let me count...no, nevermind. Yes, the camera moves..we've been lamenting the lack of up-to-date production and photography since ENT went off the air. Now we have what is quite possibly the best-looking show ever made.

5) This isn't Star Trek/Starfleet! Well, it is and we were told the usual character interaction rules did not apply. They don't all like each other, and the characters have problems. As much as I love the idealism of Trek in it's purist form in STNG, we know 21st-century audiences have a hard time with it, hence the update. I think it's what's needed for the modern audience, and as long as the context is the struggle and and reaching for those ideals we've seen before it's a worthwhile endeavor.

So to the show itself. I wrote a long, well-received review for the first two episodes I collectively call the pilot. It's not a standard pilot, and doesn't introduce everyone or everything but it's a good start to the show. Epic in scope, it gives us 3-4 of the best scapescapes and set-piece scenes in Tre right off the bat. The first episode is weaker in general and it's clear there is the usual part in Trek where the actors need to get used to things but it all works. I'd be remiss if I didn't point out the shocking moment when everyone I watched the pilot with was agape at the Vulcan pinch scene and the sentencing of Burnham. Both moments that showed how different this show would be, and how it was all open season like the destruction of Vulcan in ST09. Terrific. In all of Berman Trek I might have been shocked like this twice. Here, twice in 1 episode. I gave the overall grade of 8.5/10 to the pilot.

Context is for Kings: Wow, this episode was amazing. So this is how the new show is going to be? More surprises. Like most episodes that establish mystery this one is better than it's follow up the following week. We have the reveal of the Discovery and find out it's experimental. We have a theoretical new propulsion system based on quantum entanglement over a network of intragalactic spores! Probably never going to happen but neither is crystal focused, warp core drive. This joins the pantheon of hundreds of supra-light drives in scifi history. Though some elements are closely associated with Dune space-fold drive, it differs in that the organic element for Guild Navigators was a "drug" that mutated them into guiding space folding through a fictional means, while in DSC, the drive's organic element already exists in space, and is navigated by a symbiotically linked creature that has a brain the evovled along with it! The onscreen flashing of "this is, of course, impossible" from the TV mini-series of "Hitchhikers Guide.." comes to mind, but hey Trek is trying something new, it involves war, but they are exploring new technologies in the process. The episode in the last 10 min finishes with one of Trek's most wonderful scenes ever, with Lorca getting the better of Burnham's expectations and showing her the wonders of the drive. 10/10 rating

Butcher's Knife..: A very good episode, though not quite to the level of the previous. We get more answers to the drive. We have lots of moral and ethical questions being raised here and some of our prickly characters have a lot to explain. Stamets is humanized here somewhat. After appearing he clearly didn't want to be part of the war effort, was clearly unhappy about being saddled with another outsider into his experiments, but here, he is warming up to Burnham and recognizes her usefulness as well demonstrating his emotions about the spores. None of these characters are particularly likable yet, though I expect quite a bit of growth in 15 episodes. Burnham in ep 1 was rather cocky, full of the standard Starfleet drive and enthusiasm and is now a broken woman on the road to "redemption" as it seems. The biggest ethical question here..once they find out about the Tardigrade, even in a war situation (and we are led to believe is pretty dire) is using this being who is at least semi-sentient going to have repercussions? Surely, a tribunal would be in order, but as with most wars, the "victors" or status quo will win, and those adjudicating would most likely be those who gave the original sanction in the first place. Lorca is very interesting, my gut tells me to like him but almost nothing about him "good" in the standard sense, but we are almost compelled through sheer weight of charisma and drive to go along with him. This is where the usual Trekkie perception fails us...we want these questions solved in 43 min. How dare they do this! Outrage! But this is a novel with chapters and we have more to discover. Grade: 9/10

Choose you Pain: I thought Context would be the best episode of DSC for a long while. Not so. CYP came along. An episode with literally everything in a dazzlingly paced 47-minute runtime. Action, suspense, a few answers and..Mudd. Yes, Mudd is now an up to date character with an origin story. The actors and characters are now gelling even more. Rainn is a great addition. He has just the right amount of humor, and just dark enough that his final threat sounds like we should worry about it. Lorca...what can I say about Lorca. He killed his crew rather than let them be savaged and tortured because that is the Klingon way. I instinctively recoil at this, but we also saw cases were other captains almsot did the same.. Kirk was going to set auto-destruct rather than let his ship be taken off course (with no torture involved mind you). Picard did the same thing..but with the prospect of torture and death in "Where Silence Has Lease". The tardigrade story is wrapped up for now. Our crew does have a conscience, even with war looming, and they found a workaround. The Klingons are getting more interesting every week, and we've seen a lot of behind the scenes motivation we never did in the other Treks. I'm quite impressed with the fact they are now an "Empire" with multiple races and even species. We get to see a reimagined D7 and it looks great! Then there is the mirror scene...raising more questions. I like this ship..it's exciting! Grade: 10/10

Critical reaction: The series has a 90% positive ratings for episodes on RT with an 86% for the overall series. The latest episode "Choose Your Pain" is rated 90%. This is about where I think it should be. IGN rates it 8.2/10. Metacritic had it at 74 with 15 positive ratings, 4 mixed and none negative.

Fan reaction: Mixed, but 83% on Google, with a large sample size. On RT and IMDB, organized downvoting (which was directly reported to us on the FB group I mod) has kept the ratings down, but even so, the sheer weight of the quality of the show still gives it a 7.3 on IMDB (individual episode ratings are higher). RT is at 60%. The realistic positive fan reaction is probably 70-75 on RT, but I'm sure fans will come around after 15 episodes. :)

Ratings: We will probably know few details about how it's doing on All Access, but reports are it has doubled revenue in apps, and set records not once but two weeks in a row for subscriptions on CBSAA. Our one true indicator of viewers comes from the 1-hr CBS airing. A healthy, but unspectacular immediate 9.5 million viewers but 10.6 million after the +3 ratings and a reported 15 million after the +7 ratings, giving DSC' 3 million more viewers above Enterprise's pilot aggregate rating in 2001 and roughly in the range I predicated (14-16 million). Additionally, CBS expects a 10-15% increase in the 15 million viewer number at the +35 rating. So basically, a hit. CBS is beaming.

So to finalize. DSC pushes Trek forward past 2017. Some other wannabe shows like to look back, but that's not going to work, as the ratings freefall and critical drubbing demonstrate. DSC's success moves us forward and it's likely to lead to more big Trek shows. I can't wait to see where it goes.

As for the BBS, I take my leave.

So long, and thanks for all isolinear chips.

RAMA
 
Last edited:
Not everyone's gonna love everything. Yes, some are still obsessing about fitting rebooted Klingon D7 battlecruisers into TOS canon, but I think most get it and are just enjoying (or not) the show for what it is.

I'm having fun watching DISCO™ and am having fun discussing it here, too. What more could I want? (other than Star Trek 4 confirmed, of course)
 
Fan reaction: Mixed, but 83% on Google, with a large sample size. On RT and IMDB, organized downvoting (which was directly reported to us on the FB group I mod) has kept the ratings down, but even so, the sheer weight of the quality of the show still gives it a 7.3 on IMDB (individual episode ratings are higher). RT is at 60%. The realistic positive fan reaction is probably 70-75 on RT, but I'm sure fans will come around after 15 episodes. :)

7.3 is actually a dreadfully low rating for a TV series on IMDb. For a movie, that's a pretty good rating, but quality TV series almost always have at least an 8.5 rating. Of course, there's been a lot of downvotes going on. Almost 2000 people voted it 1/10. Of course, I don't take a lot of stock in the ratings when it comes to Star Trek. DS9 has only a 7.9 rating on IMDb.
 
7.3 is actually a dreadfully low rating for a TV series on IMDb. For a movie, that's a pretty good rating, but quality TV series almost always have at least an 8.5 rating. Of course, there's been a lot of downvotes going on. Almost 2000 people voted it 1/10. Of course, I don't take a lot of stock in the ratings when it comes to Star Trek. DS9 has only a 7.9 rating on IMDb.

I've been saying there is organized downvoting for weeks... of course some here say 'Why do you think that, 'cause you don't agree with it? The show is just not well liked', etc., but I'm glad there's more and more acknowledgement of the downvoting..
 
I've been saying there is organized downvoting for weeks... of course some here say 'Why do you think that, 'cause you don't agree with it? The show is just not well liked', etc., but I'm glad there's more and more acknowledgement of the downvoting..
They can downvote all they want, over and over until their fingers are blistered. If people keep watching, they'll keep making it and all their effort will be for nought.
 
On the point of being divisive among fans, whilst true, I've actually noticed more positivity than I was expecting. I suppose that's because I'm enjoying it more than I thought I would (despite some changes and concepts I'm still uncertain about).
 
Summarizing Discovery at 5 episodes
Summary after 5 episodes:
1. I can't believe The Orville is actually better Star Trek than Star Trek Discovery
2. Can't wait what the reaction for both shows is online.
3. Comes to TrekBBS
4. Not disappointed :D
 
After five episodes I find that the Orville is better Trek than this. This is new BSG like more than Trek. I haven't decided yet if I like it but I think it has improved since the pilot. Certainly enough for me to watch the entire season.

I don't find these klingons all that compelling and am not a fan of the changed look or the subtitles. They all talk like they have ten pieces of gum in their mouths. Just my take. I love the new ship and I just wish we got a strictly exploration episode in the trek tradition.
 
So what if DSC wants to be more like nuBSG? Battlestar Galactica is still a great series. Even if it is now a 13-14 years old show.

Well I loved BSG. It's one of my all time favorites. This show in my opinion is not in that league so far. I will give it time though.

What I was hoping for was a more exploration themed Trek but now I have Orville for that so it's not bad. Considering that last year I had neither. Well I had the Expanse which is great and sadly under rated.

I have issues with discovery but it's been on an incline since the pilot so I'll stick around.
 
After five episodes I find that the Orville is better Trek than this.

That's what happens when a narrow view of trek meets a show that does it's best to ripoff a narrow view of trek.

Between the boner and the boob jokes.... it's clearly a low brow comedy effort masquerading as a sci-fi show. Discovery is doing Trek just fine, it's just new. It's at least DOING trek, not boner jokes pretending to be trek.
 
That's what happens when a narrow view of trek meets a show that does it's best to ripoff a narrow view of trek.



Between the boner and the boob jokes.... it's clearly a low brow comedy effort masquerading as a sci-fi show. Discovery is doing Trek just fine, it's just new. It's at least DOING trek, not boner jokes pretending to be trek.

The humor is hit and miss sure. I appreciate the attempt. Orville is not a cheap rip off though. The show is one big tribute to Trek and shows its love for it at every turn. They are very open about it and because of that I adore it.
 
The humor is hit and miss sure. I appreciate the attempt. Orville is not a cheap rip off though. The show is one big tribute to Trek and shows its love for it at every turn. They are very open about it and because of that I adore it.

Doing it cause you love it does not keep it from being a ripoff. I mean a homage would be maybe doing it once in a while but this is pretty blatant.

Don't get me wrong, I love it, I think it's hilarious. but better "trek" ?

It's a scifi excuse for ridiculous low brow humor. Watchin Seinfeld on the viewer, frantically running off the bridge complaining to your crew, no real establishing of an organized group, and the exploration is just ripping off trek episodes.
 
My count so far is two good episodes, one rather average, and two crap episodes. Which for me, is about a standard count with any random 5 episodes of Trek.

What comes out the south end of a north bound cow is Orville.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top