Discovery and "The Orville" Comparisons
- Thread starter Jedi_Master
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Well, the group sizes are smaller at Metacritic than at Rotten Tomatoes but the result is about the same - the McFarlane show is rated about 90% "Liked It" at RT while Trek hovers around 60% although the critics sampled rate Trek much, much more highly.
But this is all because of some kind of organized downvoting, or upvoting, or the Trek-hating Axanar Illuminati or something. So I have been assured.
But this is all because of some kind of organized downvoting, or upvoting, or the Trek-hating Axanar Illuminati or something. So I have been assured.
Normal person here. I regard Discovery as very much Trek, and am happy to watch it (as opposed to being forced to).
I just have better things to do in my life than to try to counteract review bombers on a website.
Orville hasn't even got an airing in my country, so I have no real view on it.
I just have better things to do in my life than to try to counteract review bombers on a website.
Orville hasn't even got an airing in my country, so I have no real view on it.
Forced to watch? There's no one holding a phaser to my head to make me watch. I gave up on Enterprise after two seasons. There nothing saying that won't happen with Discovery.
The reviews have been invaded by trolls who throw out law scores, raciest, misogynistic and plan BS "reviews". Who often admit they never watched the freaking show.
I'll admit that alt-right trolls might be downgrading Discovery. But I can't see them upvoting The Orville, considering Seth McFarlane's politics.
There's no conspiracy to downvote Discovery. Just a different sample group.
I've never spoken with a person outside this board who liked either, to be perfectly honest. But user polls are an absurd way to justify assertion of quality or even public reception. Simply because you don't have equal representative sample groups.
It's a little bit immature to suggest that arguments that the sampling groups are nonrepresentative of the general public are arguing that there is some illuminati conspiracy.
Give me a poll conducted among TV watchers who enjoy science fiction and have viewed both shows, we'll talk.
I've never spoken with a person outside this board who liked either, to be perfectly honest. But user polls are an absurd way to justify assertion of quality or even public reception. Simply because you don't have equal representative sample groups.
It's a little bit immature to suggest that arguments that the sampling groups are nonrepresentative of the general public are arguing that there is some illuminati conspiracy.
Give me a poll conducted among TV watchers who enjoy science fiction and have viewed both shows, we'll talk.
Yeah, they are. Half the ones bashing DSC are screaming "watch the Orville its "real" star trek and not the SJW nonsense." Last I looked, about 1 in 3 of the trolls plugged it. Damned if I understand that.
Yeah, they are. Half the ones bashing DSC are screaming "watch the Orville its "real" star trek and not the SJW nonsense." Last I looked, about 1 in 3 of the trolls plugged it. Damned if I understand that.
Aggregate sites have caused us all(as in, internet, in general, as I see it) to think in a binary, and consensus driven frame when appraising art and entertainment. Not everything needs to be divided into a "for/against" camp. We don't need confirmation by critic or viewer, or majority or otherwise. We really don't need to polemicize these shows.
What's really sad I think, is how often I see RT or MC, etc numbers posted here, compared to how exceptionally rare it is to see individual critic's reviews posted/linked, broken down, and discussed. I'm not sure I've ever seen that.
If the disparity in these numbers for the two shows, compared, show anything, it's that critics seek consensus unto each other also. We don't know the mysterious algorithms RT uses, but as a general rule, when a movie is highly promoted and highly antipated, and it's getting a flood of perfect scores on gameday. or a flood of terrible scores(like 20%) it makes me untrusting of the whole site. The last time I really read through many of the reviews for a film on RT was Force Awakens, which was getting a perfect score the first few days, and I immediately noticed that every review was saying almost the same thing. The positive reviews had the same complaints and compliments as the negative ones.
What's really sad I think, is how often I see RT or MC, etc numbers posted here, compared to how exceptionally rare it is to see individual critic's reviews posted/linked, broken down, and discussed. I'm not sure I've ever seen that.
If the disparity in these numbers for the two shows, compared, show anything, it's that critics seek consensus unto each other also. We don't know the mysterious algorithms RT uses, but as a general rule, when a movie is highly promoted and highly antipated, and it's getting a flood of perfect scores on gameday. or a flood of terrible scores(like 20%) it makes me untrusting of the whole site. The last time I really read through many of the reviews for a film on RT was Force Awakens, which was getting a perfect score the first few days, and I immediately noticed that every review was saying almost the same thing. The positive reviews had the same complaints and compliments as the negative ones.
The illuminate aren't the trolls...but the critics!
Duhhh..everyone knows that!
Cute.
It's pretty simple. Those who liked Discovery, upvoted Discovery. Those who liked Orville, upvoted Orville. Those who hated Discovery, downvoted Discovery. Those who hated Orville...turned the TV off and forgot it existed, and never went to any website to vote on it.
You again are being flippant and choosing not to rebut my actual point with any real argument.
You think that's bad, remember the time Seth MacFarlane produced a TV show with original ideas?
Yeah, me neither.
Yeah, me neither.
sheesh. comparing orville and tng makes a lot more sense than orville and std.
Prove it.
For that group (lets say some instead of all) the reason why they'd do the upvote would be because it has a white male and female lead. They don't have any intention to watch. It would have nothing to do with MacFarlane's politics either. The fact that the Orville's cast is actually diverse as well wouldn't factor into it. If their comments are related to SJWs, forced diversity, etc then the thing they'd key in on would be the fact it has a white male lead and not a black female lead. The white male lead show being seen as better would be the important thing. For them diversity is fine as long as their white male leading the way. The second you have anyone but that in the lead is when diversity becomes forced, etc. That's what they'd largely care about and its what their comments focus on. They act the same way all over the Internet and have for years. Which is why I said in another thread you can spot them and the behavior. When I see certain words, phrases, and arguments being used my mental red alert goes off extremely fast. They exist and have existed for a long time. I see them at work in a lot areas. No one is ever going to convince me they don't exist.
I've never denied that some people honestly just might not like Discovery. It's not a perfect show as much as I enjoy it. It's still in season 1 but I think it's a strong season 1 so far. They might like Orville more. Maybe they like MacFarlane's work and humor a lot. Maybe it's more comforting because its copying TNG. I don't see how anyone can deny that. I don't see it as being it's own thing. Not yet anyway. People like what they know and are comfortable with. That's not an insult just the way people are. I can be the same way about some things. That said some people keep saying Discovery isn't Trek like but what they're saying I really believe is it's not like TNG. That's the overall impression I get from comments. You can pick out a lot that is like TOS, DS9, some Enterprise and Voy and I honestly think some TNG. It's not trying to be a copy of TNG and that was never what they promised to any degree. It's not treating it as the only way to do Trek or something Trek like. That puts some people off and I think that's why this group might do the comparisons.
I do think there is some crossover though. Cause if the last two years have taught me anything is that everyone slips up and lets their true colors out. Just got to pay attention and wait for it.
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There are 482 user votes for The Orville on MetaCritic.
That means that the very best, of the at least 8.56 million people who watched at least the first episode of The Orville in the US alone, through a particular recorded method (completely ignoring those in other countries and those who watched through other methods), 0.00005 percent have chosen to vote.
To take that tiny sample as representative of anything is ridiculous.
When one considers that more than 5,000,000 of those viewers have apparently stopped watching already (down to 3.43 million viewers as of last week), the high rating seems particularly unrepresentative.
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