Star Trek as "Prophetic"

[thewanderingjack]

I think part of the Star Trek phenomena (it's popularity/passion of it's fans) is not just the entertainment value, but has to do with how, to some, it might be viewed as a vision of humanity in the future, technologically and socio-culturally.

Let me be clear, I don't mean word for word prophecy.

I mean, in terms of how they describe humanity and Earth, they present an ideal (or working towards it) version of many socio-political philosophies (democracy, socialism, egalitarianism, environmentalism, libertarianism, draw your own parallels). The general (supposed) move beyond things like sexism, racism, etc, overcoming things pollution, war, poverty and capitalism (in it's most negative connotation and as a "need" for survival).

Do you feel that applies to you (that to some extent, you see it as either being prophetic, or being desirable... bit like a self fulfilling prophecy)?

If it does, how do you view current events (nationally/globally) in light of desiring such a future as presented in Stark Trek?

 

[johnar]

It is a show. Brilliant, iconic, known world wide with "beam me up" to "warp speed" to the old flip phones, etc. But a show nonetheless. I am 56 and I remember loving Trek since its initial run. And at times I allowed the fantasy of it all to over-occupy my time and attention in life... that was when I was trying to explain every gray area or pot hole. Phenomenal as it is, it is just entertainment.

If it is prophetic, so far it is a false prophet. The 1990's did not see mankind venture out into space. Lie the old prophecy bust in the 60's that said we'd have robots to do all the chores by 1999.

IMO Visionaries like Gene Roddenberry and his successors ( Berman, Braga, JJ ←{yes, even JJ Abrams} ) and some day a real life Zefram Cochraine and the like will put conventional thinking aside and open space up to humanity. But until then, I fear we are headed for that World War III catastrophy in 1stCON from all the selfishness and greed. That prophecy Trek will get right, I'm afraid.

 

[thewanderingjack]

It is a show. Brilliant, iconic, known world wide with "beam me up" to "warp speed" to the old flip phones, etc. But a show nonetheless. I am 56 and I remember loving Trek since its initial run. And at times I allowed the fantasy of it all to over-occupy my time and attention in life... that was when I was trying to explain every gray area or pot hole. Phenomenal as it is, it is just entertainment.

If it is prophetic, so far it is a false prophet. The 1990's did not see mankind venture out into space. Lie the old prophecy bust in the 60's that said we'd have robots to do all the chores by 1999.

IMO Visionaries like Gene Roddenberry and his successors ( Berman, Braga, JJ ←{yes, even JJ Abrams} ) and some day a real life Zefram Cochraine and the like will put conventional thinking aside and open space up to humanity. But until then, I fear we are headed for that World War III catastrophy in 1stCON from all the selfishness and greed. That prophecy Trek will get right, I'm afraid.

So maybe we're just running behind ;-).. I definitely see the whole "we're going into WWIII right now."

 

[Kor]

Before I would decide if I wanted to live there, I would have to know if there is money or not, and if Starfleet is a military or not.



Kor

 

[at Quark's]

Prophetic? No.

However, I think Star trek has probably influenced public awareness of certain technological developments (and prepared our society a little for them). I'm thinking now of gadgets such as cell phones (communicators), computer speech interfaces, and such.

 

[thewanderingjack]

Before I would decide if I wanted to live there, I would have to know if there is money or not, and if Starfleet is a military or not.



Kor

LOL
My view is that there isn't money (to put it simply) in our culture/solar system. And that it's not a military, but it serves that role when the need arises (neither of these assertions are infallible or anything, I'm just saying that's my view and also, let's assume those)

 

[thewanderingjack]

Prophetic? No.

However, I think Star trek has probably influenced public awareness of certain technological developments (and prepared our society a little for them). I'm thinking now of gadgets such as cell phones (communicators), computer speech interfaces, and such.

Than in that sense it's been like a self fulfilling prophecy. And by the same token, I want to say maybe (just a little) it has influenced people's attitudes... you know, being a fan, wanting (in many ways) for it to come true, is sort of an inspiration to make it happen, not only technologically, but socially/culturally.

I mean, I definitely want to live in a world where things like racism and sexism etc don't exist, where "the philosophy of [...] Humans revolved around self-enlightenment and the bettering of society as a whole. A Human's moral goal was the achievement of knowledge through peaceful exploration [...] Humans found a sense of balance in their lives and attitudes. Compassion, courage, and intellect developed into an ideal combination, with ambitions of further self-improvement. [..] Deviations from these ideals were rare and considered abnormal behavior for Humans." as Memory Alpha puts it.

 

[Tenacity]

I've never seen the Trek future as some form of utopian dream existence, although it does look to be a materially comfortable future with cool tech toys.

At the same time there seem to be a whole lot of war and destruction and death and weird new diseases.

There a lot about the Trek future that we just plain don't know about, how much freedom, how much control. The form of the government is semi-mysterious, the sovereignty of Federation members is definitely ill-defined.

We've only heard of one government official being elected, and it not clear if that was the general population doing the electing, or just the Federation council.

The civilian society is all but unknown.

We've seen hundreds of characters over the course of fifty years and are only now going to be seeing the first clearly gay person in the Federation.

The sometime confusing there's no money, except that there is.

Supposedly no sexism, yet the males in leadership positions far out-number the females.

"Yes, I'd love to live there!" Not without knowing more than I already do,

 

[thewanderingjack]

I've never seen the Trek future as some form of utopian dream existence, although it does look to be a materially comfortable future with cool tech toys.

At the same time there seem to be a whole lot of war and destruction and death and weird new diseases.

There a lot about the Trek future that we just plain don't know about, how much freedom, how much control. The form of the government is semi-mysterious, the sovereignty of Federation members is definitely ill-defined.

We've only heard of one government official being elected, and it not clear if that was the general population doing the electing, or just the Federation council.

The civilian society is all but unknown.

We've seen hundreds of characters over the course of fifty years and are only now going to be seeing the first clearly gay person in the Federation.

The sometime confusing there's no money, except that there is.

Supposedly no sexism, yet the males in leadership positions far out-number the females.

"Yes, I'd love to live there!" Not without knowing more than I already do,

Utopia: an imagined place or state of things in which everything is perfect.
Eutopia: A place of ideal well-being, as a practical aspiration (compared with utopia as an impossible concept).

So Earth, as described in-universe, is a Eutopia. For us, it's a Utopia (imaginary).

There are a lot of details that are missing, that's true. But, objectively, the society shown in show isn't just a factor of the supposed developments of mankind, they are a product of the writers/producers/etc, their own prejudices and limitations. In that it says more about our present than our future (what we're unwilling to even imagine as possible, or are not ok dealing with). Very sad : (.

From another angle, we are assuming that everything is the way we see... maybe we're following the most backwards people left in Humanity :-P.

 

[at Quark's]

Than in that sense it's been like a self fulfilling prophecy. And by the same token, I want to say maybe (just a little) it has influenced people's attitudes... you know, being a fan, wanting (in many ways) for it to come true, is sort of an inspiration to make it happen, not only technologically, but socially/culturally.

I mean, I definitely want to live in a world where things like racism and sexism etc don't exist, where "the philosophy of [...] Humans revolved around self-enlightenment and the bettering of society as a whole. A Human's moral goal was the achievement of knowledge through peaceful exploration [...] Humans found a sense of balance in their lives and attitudes. Compassion, courage, and intellect developed into an ideal combination, with ambitions of further self-improvement. [..] Deviations from these ideals were rare and considered abnormal behavior for Humans." as Memory Alpha puts it.

Well, I think we live in a more diversified society than 40 years ago. At least in my country this is certainly the case. I think Star Trek may have helped to prepare the ground for that as well a little bit, acted as a kind of messenger that, if not actual aliens, we would have more diversity in the future. Though I think our attitudes still have a long way to go before we can cay they're really adjusted to that.

 

[BillJ]

Prophetic? No.

If I had to live in that world. I'd prefer the 23rd century as shown in TOS. I have no love for what they did the Trek in the 24th century series.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

It's a world where capitalism is dead and people aren't judged over all the petty little differences, sounds like a pretty great place to live, IMHO.

 

[thewanderingjack]

Well, I think we live in a more diversified society than 40 years ago. At least in my country this is certainly the case. I think Star Trek may have helped to prepare the ground for that as well a little bit, acted as a kind of messenger that, if not actual aliens, we would have more diversity in the future. Though I think our attitudes still have a long way to go before we can cay they're really adjusted to that.

I live in the U.S., so I feel like I can say the same, but I also look around and see how far we haven't come and it's sad.

Prophetic? No.

If I had to live in that world. I'd prefer the 23rd century as shown in TOS. I have no love for what they did the Trek in the 24th century series.

Which differences are you referring to?

 

[2takesfrakes]

STAR TREK is prophetic, in the sense that it has influenced the present and the future since TOS first came out, by way of inspiring people in any number of ways to do something extraordinary. Though I find it difficult to wrap my head around, it's Common Knowledge that Trekkies have claimed over these many, many decades that they were inspired by the show to take up careers in engineering, let's say, or medicine. Myself, I became an Artist because I was good at it ... which had nothing to do with Picasso, or anyone like that "inspiring" me to. I just gravitated towards it, as a natural extension of who I was. But that's what these Trekkers are saying, that Scotty made them want to join NASA, or whatever and if you look at NASA culture, it's pretty obvious that they geek out on STAR TREK. They go out of their way to express it and to make comparisons of what they're doing in Real Life to the franchise, which I find disturbing, honestly. But there it is.

STAR TREK has left its stamp on society and continues to do that and in so-doing has influenced Life. People want a Life of significance, I think that's why entertainment is so popular, because it gives us that escapism, like an icon, sort of ... where we can latch onto a make-believe concept and say, "yeah! My Life should be, well not THAT, exactly, but it should be as eXciting as that looks to be!" And it might get you to thinking about doing that, you know? Of finding some way to break through the mundane, 9 to 5 workweek and week ends at the shore routine. Maybe its our mortality that puts that kind of pressure on us ... and STAR TREK has dealt with that topic more times than I can recall, over the years.

 

[Qonundrum]

I love "Trek" in most of its incarnations. But it's only a show, no matter how cool some of the stories are.

Most shows are influenced by culture already, "Trek" just has the luxury of outer space in ways that, say, Shakespeare does not. And Trek is essentially 'Shakespeare in Space".

Or Jerry Springer, for that matter.

 

[johnar]

I love "Trek" in most of its incarnations. But it's only a show, no matter how cool some of the stories are.

Most shows are influenced by culture already, "Trek" just has the luxury of outer space in ways that, say, Shakespeare does not. And Trek is essentially 'Shakespeare in Space".

Or Jerry Springer, for that matter.

I like this guy!

 

[Tenacity]

It's a world where capitalism is dead

There are entire planets in the Federation that are owned by corporations, apparently no, capitalism isn't dead.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

There are entire planets in the Federation that are owned by corporations, apparently no, capitalism isn't dead.

Which ones?

 

[Tenacity]

I was thinking specifically of the Dytallix Mining Corporation.

 

[Herbert]

Yes. I would love to live there. I'd be able to fully realize my life's dream of becoming a slacker extraordinaire. No reason to work. Saunter over to the replicator when I'm hungry. Nothing to do all day but read, play video games and D&D in a holodeck. In between travelling all over the earth via transporters, of course.