DS9 And STARGATE...

[Farscape One]

I was reading a recently made thread abiut the Prophets and Pah-Wraiths, and it got me thinking.

Could their feud have been the inspiration for the writers of STARGATE SG-1 with the Ancients and the Ori?

 

[Lynx]

Possibly.
Stargate have some resemblances to Star Trek here and there.
Good shows, both of them.
Except for Stargate Universe which was horrible.

 

[Jono]

Or numerous other stories of wars between the gods where the bad guys were represented by fire.

Personally I didn't mind Stargate Universe. Thought it got markably better during the second season.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

Half the Stargate episodes were basically premised on 'Take this Star Trek premise and plug our awesome cast into it'.

In this case I don't think so though. I think Oma Desala was inspired by all Star Trek energy being and then escalating the energy being conflict was the next logical step.

 

[Arpy]

I think it was more in response to the religious issues being discussed at the time in the culture, post 9/11. We had this new islamophobia and people talking about crusades and whatnot, and the Ori were a look at the danger of fanaticism.

Frankly, the entire idea of a corporeal life-form leaping magically into a non-corporeal one through some kind of mystical ascension seems batty to me. We're told that's what happens when you die, so we're eased into the idea by loved ones and society, but I don't think actual evolution to such a higher state would happen that dramatically. I'd imagine millions of years of typical evolution...crazy stuff like telepathy, telekinesis, flight, and teleportation slowly appear in a species, maybe self-aided by genetic manipulation. But you don't just blow out your biology by being nice enough. I don't know if "ascension" would even be possible. We think because our neurons fire. Without a physical brain, there's nothing to ignite the thought. It may be demeaning of life to assume it's possible without form.

...and there's nothing wrong with Stargate. It was a fun TV show that knew humor better than Trek.

 

[somebuddyX]

Personally, I doubt it. I think both groups of writers just kept building upon their own ideas, which very broadly may have ended up similar to one another but looking closely at the details are miles apart.

 

[Jayson1]

At best I think "Stargate" might have been more influenced by "TOS" style aliens that were more evolved beings like the Organians from "Errand of Mercy."

Jason

 

[Lynx]

I see Tealc as a cross between a Vulcan and a Klingon.
Good character anyway.

 

[captainkirk]

The battle between possessed Kira and Jake in The Reckoning is visually very similar to the battle between Adria and Morgan in The Ark of Truth.

 

[somebuddyX]

And Kosh vs Ulkesh from B5.

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[WARLOCK1965]

I

I was reading a recently made thread abiut the Prophets and Pah-Wraiths, and it got me thinking.

Could their feud have been the inspiration for the writers of STARGATE SG-1 with the Ancients and the Ori?

it seems that mini show do this each with its own spin

 

[JirinPanthosa]

Eh, a stoic version of a Klingon maybe but I don't think he's any part Vulcan. Not the most logical guy.

@Arpy
In Stargate ascension is something that happens after millions of years of evolution, just Oma Desala was going around quickening up the process for people. Remember the frozen Ancient, humans would have to evolve to her long before figuring out how to ascend on their own.

Stargate was a really good show, just let's be honest, it is not the most original one. And there are plenty of things in Stargate that are just plain silly, like the zat guns. One shot stuns, two kill. How does this work? What damage could one shot possibly do to the body that there will be no immediate noticeable effects, but is so damaging that a second identical shot is unavoidable death and a third will vaporize you? And what is the reset clock on this? How long after getting zatted can you safely get zatted again without dying? If you get shot a second time in 4 hours, 3 minutes and 41 seconds you are fine, but if you are shot a second time in 4 hours, 3 minutes and 40 seconds you die? But remarkably they made the effort to consistently stick to all their made up physics. Things that worked in one episode were remembered as options in an episode a couple seasons later. They didn't conveniently ignore the silly rules they established whenever it was inconvenient to the current story the way Star Trek does. When something established was inconvenient, the heroes would try it first and then give a passable explanation for why it didn't work again.

Stargate was a fun show, but let's not be under any illusion that it wasn't just riffing really effectively on common scifi cliches.

 

[WARLOCK1965]

Eh, a stoic version of a Klingon maybe but I don't think he's any part Vulcan. Not the most logical guy.

@Arpy
In Stargate ascension is something that happens after millions of years of evolution, just Oma Desala was going around quickening up the process for people. Remember the frozen Ancient, humans would have to evolve to her long before figuring out how to ascend on their own.

Stargate was a really good show, just let's be honest, it is not the most original one. And there are plenty of things in Stargate that are just plain silly, like the zat guns. One shot stuns, two kill. How does this work? What damage could one shot possibly do to the body that there will be no immediate noticeable effects, but is so damaging that a second identical shot is unavoidable death and a third will vaporize you? And what is the reset clock on this? How long after getting zatted can you safely get zatted again without dying? If you get shot a second time in 4 hours, 3 minutes and 41 seconds you are fine, but if you are shot a second time in 4 hours, 3 minutes and 40 seconds you die? But remarkably they made the effort to consistently stick to all their made up physics. Things that worked in one episode were remembered as options in an episode a couple seasons later. They didn't conveniently ignore the silly rules they established whenever it was inconvenient to the current story the way Star Trek does. When something established was inconvenient, the heroes would try it first and then give a passable explanation for why it didn't work again.

Stargate was a fun show, but let's not be under any illusion that it wasn't just riffing really effectively on common scifi cliches.

It may have to do with the electrical charge that one's nerves can take and the charge that the cell's of the body can take from being shot with that type of weapon

 

[somebuddyX]

But remarkably they made the effort to consistently stick to all their made up physics. Things that worked in one episode were remembered as options in an episode a couple seasons later. They didn't conveniently ignore the silly rules they established whenever it was inconvenient to the current story the way Star Trek does.

That's one of things I've always loved about SG1, in how they could take one idea, say there being a second gate, and build storylines off that which still had effects on the show all the way to season 9. The third zat shot is funny because even though it's still canon, no one used it past the end of season 2 because the writers realised it was ridiculous, and they even made fun of it in "Wormhole X-Treme"

 

[Arpy]

It wasn't trying to be realistic. It was an commraderie adventure show with a great sense of humor, and it accomplished that in spades. Come on ancient alien pharoahs and Atlanteans and grey Norse gods, etc. The sweeping scores and the pesky fish. It was consistent with itself, something Trek constantly apologized was impossible.

It was kind of like TOS in being this absurd fun dive into space adventure. And zat guns aren't nearly as bad as Warp 10 or any number of Trek rules and retcons. Don't forget they're built for intimidation -- punishments from the gods. You get one mistake, then you die, then you're forgotten. And they were about as well as logically as inertial dampeners.

 

[Jayson1]

It wasn't trying to be realistic. It was an commraderie adventure show with a great sense of humor, and it accomplished that in spades. Come on ancient alien pharoahs and Atlanteans and grey Norse gods, etc. The sweeping scores and the pesky fish. It was consistent with itself, something Trek constantly apologized was impossible.

It was kind of like TOS in being this absurd fun dive into space adventure. And zat guns aren't nearly as bad as Warp 10 or any number of Trek rules and retcons. Don't forget they're built for intimidation -- punishments from the gods. You get one mistake, then you die, then you're forgotten. And they were about as well as logically as inertial dampeners.

What I liked about the Stargate shows was that it was modern people having Star Trek style adventures. Plus it had a sensor humor and it was a very nerd friendly show. Other than "Silicon Valley" has their ever been a show that embraced nerds on this level. "Atlantis" main star in McKay was the nerd and the main attraction as well.

Jason

 

[Hunter Zolomon]

I was reading a recently made thread abiut the Prophets and Pah-Wraiths, and it got me thinking.

Could their feud have been the inspiration for the writers of STARGATE SG-1 with the Ancients and the Ori?

i mean you add that with the concept of the trill symbiots and i wonder are the goaulds just rip offs also.

 

[shivkala]

Half the Stargate episodes were basically premised on 'Take this Star Trek premise and plug our awesome cast into it'.

In this case I don't think so though. I think Oma Desala was inspired by all Star Trek energy being and then escalating the energy being conflict was the next logical step.

It wasn't trying to be realistic. It was an commraderie adventure show with a great sense of humor, and it accomplished that in spades. Come on ancient alien pharoahs and Atlanteans and grey Norse gods, etc. The sweeping scores and the pesky fish. It was consistent with itself, something Trek constantly apologized was impossible.

It was kind of like TOS in being this absurd fun dive into space adventure. And zat guns aren't nearly as bad as Warp 10 or any number of Trek rules and retcons. Don't forget they're built for intimidation -- punishments from the gods. You get one mistake, then you die, then you're forgotten. And they were about as well as logically as inertial dampeners.

I personally look at Stargate: SG-1 and to some extent, Stargate: Atlantis, as taking general sci-fi tropes (many of which Star Trek has done) and used them in a tongue-in-cheek manner. They'd point out how it was like Star Trek or the general absurdity of the idea, or, in the case of "Window of Opportunity," embrace the humor in the concept, something that "Cause and Effect" didn't do (and, rightly so).

That's what I enjoyed most about the Stargate franchise and what I felt Universe lacked.

 

[WARLOCK1965]

What I liked about the Stargate shows was that it was modern people having Star Trek style adventures. Plus it had a sensor humor and it was a very nerd friendly show. Other than "Silicon Valley" has their ever been a show that embraced nerds on this level. "Atlantis" main star in McKay was the nerd and the main attraction as well.

Jason

All of the Stargate shows were good cartoon series was good too

 

[Mordwyn Fen-Dweller]

I liked how they kept referencing huge actions characters had performed during a mission or an episode, like when Carter destroys that Star or Mckay destroys a solar system, people still bring it up! Mckay's sister even gave him shit for it! I don't remember much of "Hey remember when that Orb thingy made us all fight each other?" in DS9, but lets not bring up Retcons and DS9 in the same sentence, there's not enough time.