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I don't really understand "cultural appropriation"

Is 2017's Ghost in the Shell cultural appropration?

  • Yes

    Votes: 6 27.3%
  • No

    Votes: 16 72.7%

  • Total voters
    22
Cultural appropriation is just another way for bossy people to tell other people what to do (or not do) and another way to feel that they're superior to someone else.

Wear your hair anyway you want. Dye it any color. Wear contacts of any color and any type of clothes or jewelry or shoes that you want.

People don't like it? Fuck 'em. Seems silly anyhow because it should be complimentary if someone of another culture wears something from a different one. It means they like it.

But bossy people must boss.
^^ This. A thousand times this.

No single group has an exclusive right to a style of clothing, or hair, or jewelry, or tattoos, or arts and crafts, or music, or anything else. Culture by its nature transcends all boundaries; all of it belongs to the world. The only time "permission" is needed is when legal issues are involved, like trademarks and copyrights.

Now I'm off to play with my boomerang.

Bo's cornrows were preferable to Juliette Lewis's.
Bo Derek would have looked good bald.
 
It just seems that people are addicted to the feeling of being outraged over something these days.

That's not an exaggeration. An endorfin rush from a self-righteous crusade is a great way to temporarily put aside any feelings of powerlessness (real or perceived). Of course if you get addicted to outrage, you'll have to go seeking it out. Then when people whose outrage detectors aren't so finely tuned disagree with you, you can get outraged at them!
 
My experience with people getting "offended" over cultural appropriation is that it depends entirely on the person, and how predisposed they are to getting worked up about stuff, and 95% of it is online. As someone who has been in more than one "interracial, intercultural" relationship, I have never encountered it. The only time I've ever seen someone complain about it is online.

A quote from a former girlfriend of mine: "Why should I care if white people wear saris or bindis? We wear Western clothes. It doesn't matter." This was around the time that people were "outraged" that Selena Gomez wore a bindi. She also thought that white people who learned ragas on the bansuri, and learned bharatnayam or kathak dances were awesome and "cute."

This same girlfriend bought my lilywhite 63-year old mother, from hills of West Virginia, a beautiful salwar kameez and bangles.

People who get worked up over this stuff have too much time on their hands, looking for things to get offended about. I wish they'd stop.
 
What about this?

This is from a newspaper last weekend.

The thing that separates appropriation from mere exchange is the power dynamic. The ability to exchange implies there is a power parity. What happens when there is no parity? What happens when one group of people are forced to assimilate and what is left of their culture gets pilfered?

https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au...ltural-appropriation-and-power/14958072004699
The only real power dynamic's I buy into when it comes to being able to exploit someone is rich vs poor and male vs female and even then we in theory are supose to have things to stop the exploitation, such as laws.
Things like music,movies,books,clothes etc only have as much value as we personally want them to have. Science Fiction doesn't have value to me because I am white but because I like it and I want it to be part of what I think is important to me.

Jason
 
I will say this the concept of cultural appropriation is really the opposite of 90's multiculturalism.

The later says--"embrace difference"--the former "leave it alone"
 
I just read it as "don't take the piss".

make indian food - sure
wear indian clothes - if invited to when visiting my wife's family who are Bengali. Probably not on a trip to Tesco.
declare I'm a hindu now because I read a book once, decorate my desk at work with artwork of Lord Vishnu - okay whitey stop there
 
I just read it as "don't take the piss".

make indian food - sure
wear indian clothes - if invited to when visiting my wife's family who are Bengali. Probably not on a trip to Tesco.
declare I'm a hindu now because I read a book once, decorate my desk at work with artwork of Lord Vishnu - okay whitey stop there

Yeah, pretty much.

I have to say, I encounter a lot more people complaining about "outrages over cultural appropriation" than I do people actually complaining about appropriation... and I most certainly run in the kinds of circles where you'd expect to see a lot of the latter.

As usual, the relatively privileged commentators make it into a bigger deal than it is rather than getting the fundamental point, which is basically: be respectful.
 
I just read it as "don't take the piss".

make indian food - sure
wear indian clothes - if invited to when visiting my wife's family who are Bengali. Probably not on a trip to Tesco.
declare I'm a hindu now because I read a book once, decorate my desk at work with artwork of Lord Vishnu - okay whitey stop there

Yes. This is what I alluded to in my earlier post. If someone is genuinely interested in things Native American, no problem. Showing up at a pow wow wearing a generic headdress? No. That's just bad taste...
 
I just read it as "don't take the piss".

make indian food - sure
wear indian clothes - if invited to when visiting my wife's family who are Bengali. Probably not on a trip to Tesco.
declare I'm a hindu now because I read a book once, decorate my desk at work with artwork of Lord Vishnu - okay whitey stop there
Nicely summed up :lol:
 
wear indian clothes - if invited to when visiting my wife's family who are Bengali. Probably not on a trip to Tesco.
Personally, I wouldn't wear Indian clothes unless I was invited to either, but why should you care if someone does? That's seriously judgmental and approaching ignorance. You know nothing about that person, their personal journey, their reasons for doing so. And more to the point, why should you care? Plenty of people in India itself wear Western clothes almost exclusively these days, barring a wedding or festival. And people in Asia at large have been wearing Western clothing since the 1860's at least.

decorate my desk at work with artwork of Lord Vishnu - okay whitey stop there
Okay, that's straight up ignorant, shallow, and judgmental. Where does it say white people can't be Hindu or espouse Hindu/Indian philosophies? Why not? Yogis and Swamis have been coming to the West since the 1890's spreading their messages.

Even if "whitey" has a murti on their desk it because they practice yoga....hell, EVEN IF they are just doing it because they like it...why is it bad? THOUSANDS of street vendors all over India sell murtis, clothes, and Indian house decor to tourists, white and otherwise, every day. Where's the outrage among them?

Come on now.
 
You seemed to have forgotten this part of @Stoo 's post
No, I didn't forget it, I just forgot to quote it. But my point still stands. ANYONE can be a Hindu. It doesn't matter where you come from or what color you are. And if the "religious conversion" is not sincere, why should it matter MORE if it's Hinduism or Buddhism as opposed to people who are "born again Christians" because they read a book, but don't stick to it?

Religion is universal. That's the POINT. I'm an atheist, but in this instance, people should listen to Swami Vivekananda. There are no cultural lines.
 
Even if that's so, why should it matter? If people are attracted to an idea, be it religious, philosophical, whatever...sometimes it's sincere, sometimes they're attracted to certain elements and pick and choose...that's completely fine. Isn't life about discovery and evolution? It's their personal journey. Why should even bits and pieces of Hinduism be off limits just because it's "Indian"? If a person is white, and into yoga, and they have a murti or framed picture with a mala draped around it....how does that matter to others? On what basis does anyone have a right to judge that person?

They have none.

I have several murtis, which have been gifted to me, as well as some I've bought myself. I have a Sivalingam stone, gifted to me. I have several Buddhas. I even have an Orthodox Christian triptych my brother brought back from a trip to Romania. I have I have an entire library of Hindu and Buddhist books. I went through periods of my life where bits and pieces of each thing appealed to me. I liked parts, and that coalesced eventually into the philosophy I live by, personally.

And now I'm an atheist. But that doesn't make the things I liked about the books I read, and the journey I took, invalid. I didn't "appropriate" anyone's damn culture.

I have several kurtas, both gifted to me and that I've bought myself. Both decorative and plain. Do I wear them in public? No, because that's a conscious choice I make. But if I did wear them in public, like to Walmart or something, I would love to see someone try to tell me I shouldn't be wearing it, because I'm white, or that I was "taking the piss" appropriating another culture.

Y'know why that doesn't work? Because you're making a presumption. You're judging. You're assuming. You don't know what someone has been through. You don't know anything about them. You're just assuming that they're doing it because of some pop psychology, or they think it's cool, and they don't know how deeply disrespectful it is because of the history of white subjugation of other cultures (of which I know more than most, because of my historical background, so I'd like to see someone challenge me on that, too. They'd lose, pretty badly).

And that's just crap. First of all, you shouldn't judge. And second, what business is it of yours? It's none. Even if someone has a Ganesh statue on their desk and they're white and they're doing it because they think it's cool....who cares? Go after the Indian guy at some stall in Jaipur that sold it to them in the first place. Then go after the whole bazaar and shut it down, because they're allowing white tourists to carry all those kurtas, paintings, murtis, aarti sets, etc. home to the West where they're decorating their homes and office desks. Oh the humanity!!!!!

The entire argument starts to fall apart.

Seriously. Live and Let Live. Even if you start differentiating on who is doing it out of "genuine cultural interest" vs. "taking the piss", you're judging. And when you start judging, it's a slippery slope of muddled preconceptions.

Live your life and let people live theirs. Their fashion choices and how they decorate their home/office are the least of your worries in this big, bad world of ours.

As you can all see, I feel very strongly about this. But I'm leaving this thread now. My blood pressure will thank me later.
 
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No, I didn't forget it, I just forgot to quote it. But my point still stands. ANYONE can be a Hindu. It doesn't matter where you come from or what color you are. And if the "religious conversion" is not sincere, why should it matter MORE if it's Hinduism or Buddhism as opposed to people who are "born again Christians" because they read a book, but don't stick to it?
No one is saying that anyone can't be a Hindu or that it's limited to people from a certain area or color. Or that insincere "Hindu" are somehow worse than insincere "Christians".
 
I think @Stoo meant that somebody who just decides on a whim to become something they're not, is out.

You mean how like you became a baseball fan back in like 2007 or '08, then almost immediately began preaching about the history of the game?
 
Cultural appropriation is a weird one for me, and something that I feel is very fluid. I don't feel the need to define it with any permanence. What feels like cultural appropriation to me in one instance may not in another set of very similar circumstances. The same situations may feel differently for my brother, or my parents. I accept that everyone will not always be offended, hurt, or angry at the same time. I also accept that my own feelings may change and there may be no solid right or wrong. I hope that I can always be open to how other people feel, and I'd hope that they do the same for me.
 
Not sure why you feel the need to add that qualifier at the end but okay. If someone doesn't like reading differing opinions they can go play on their Facebook.

Culture Appropriation is really nothing more than another non issue created by race hustlers and it's ridiculous. America has always been a blend of many cultures: Cuisines, architecture, literature etc. Those things were brought to this country by people who were thankful for the opportunity to be here. Hence the term "Melting Pot."
Because it's my opinion and you don't have to like it.

That's not on anyone else but urbandefault. He feels the need to add a qualifier like that or "Just sayin'" after a bunch of his posts to call attention to what a rebel he is, as if he's announcing "Hey everybody, look out, I'm about to finish saying something edgy!" Only, when you constantly have to call attention to what a badass rebel you supposedly are instead of just stating your opinion, it kind of saps the effectiveness of your defiant stance. It's a bit like George Costanza trying to play the bad boy.
You're very smug. If you want to take issue with what I said, fine. That's your preogative. If you have a problem with they way I said it, oh well. Just sayin'. :P

White people are bad. Study your history!
As are red people, yellow people, brown people, black people. People can be bad. It ain't just the honkeys.
 
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