Should Endgame Have Had A 3rd Part?

[Sophie74656]

They kind of had this moment in endgame. There is the scene with Tom and Harry in the corridor where Harry is trying to get Tom to agree with him about going back to the nebula.

KIM: Don't you want to find a way home?
PARIS: I am home, Harry

And the scene in the briefing room when Harry makes his speech...."to the journey"

 

[Galileo7]

Well, first off, "Endgame" wasn't a 2-parter to begin with. It was a single 2-hour episode, even though it was split into 2 parts for syndication.

But yes, definitely it ended too abruptly and did nothing to address the question of what would happen to the crew once they got home. That was a major shortcoming. I was far from the only person who saw the ending, blinked, and wondered, in the words of another entity named Voyager, "Is this all there is? Is there nothing more?" But then, I feel DS9 had the same problem, ending too abruptly and leaving the aftermath unaddressed.

Absolutely agree, after seven years of STVoyager to end "Endgame" without seeing their landing on Earth and what followed was extremely disappointing. It would have been like if in Star Wars(1977) they blew up the Deathstar and the credits ran without ever seeing the closing ceremony events.

 

[Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME]

Have the final episode be a bit of a replay of the first one: 7 sacrifices herself to cure the Borg. Billions of formerly assimilated people are now helplessly stranded on throughout Borg space. Janeway feels a duty to not let Seven's sacrifice go to waste, so she and some of the crew decide to stay behind. The ones who want to go home make it back via the female caretaker or whatever.

A happy ending for those who want to go home and a "The Adventure Continues!" ending for the others.

Oh, I like your idea too, marlboro! But in this case, I'm just curious but who would decide to stay behind with Janeway?

In "The 37's", we learnt that Voyager needed more than 75 crewmembers on 152,to be operated, what means that, even with the losses thereafter, only 1/4 of 145-148, would be allowed to leave and go home.

And among the remainers, I bet that Tuvok and the EMH would stay for sure as maybe Harry, Tom, B'Elena and baby Miral. I guess that Chakotay would stay behind too... if he wasn't ordered to leave and take care of those who would want to go home.
But well, it's just a theory!
,

 

[TheAdmiralty]

I can understand why big Voyager fans were bummed that they just ended the show with them arriving and then abruptly finished. But a whole third part focusing on them just on Earth would have been anti-climactic, and, as another poster said, likely would have just comprised of fan service. The way to do it would have just to have had the last ten minutes be a quick update of what all the crew members were doing on Earth (maybe in the form of a montage) and maybe a Janeway and Chakotay or Seven on the bridge "one last time" scene. Another way to do it would have been to eliminate the time travel element and have the episode be bookended by genuine "flash forward" sequences showing the crew years later.

 

[Prax]

They kind of had this moment in endgame. There is the scene with Tom and Harry in the corridor where Harry is trying to get Tom to agree with him about going back to the nebula.

KIM: Don't you want to find a way home?
PARIS: I am home, Harry

And the scene in the briefing room when Harry makes his speech...."to the journey"

That's one of my favorite things about Tom. He wasn't concerned about getting home. He'd finally found a place he belongs. B'elanna said something similar when she tells Tom "I'd always pictured us raising our daughter on Voyager." She's not that excited about getting home now. After seven years and the prospect of spending the rest of your life on Voyager, I'm sure most had long ago accepted their circumstances and didn't waste emotional energy getting their hopes up on a magic sleigh ride back to Earth.

 

[Sophie74656]

That's one of my favorite things about Tom. He wasn't concerned about getting home. He'd finally found a place he belongs. B'elanna said something similar when she tells Tom "I'd always pictured us raising our daughter on Voyager." She's not that excited about getting home now. After seven years and the prospect of spending the rest of your life on Voyager, I'm sure most had long ago accepted their circumstances and didn't waste emotional energy getting their hopes up on a magic sleigh ride back to Earth.

There may also be a factor in that they both have nothing to go back to the Alpha Quadrant to. For Tom the AQ is where he messed everything up, where he went to prison, where he let down his father. For B'Elanna she had nothing there either. She hadn't spoken with her father in 20 years and her mother in 10 years. As she said in Eye of the Needle all her friends where on Voyager and there was nobody in the aq that cared if she was alive or dead.

 

[Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME]

That's one of my favorite things about Tom. He wasn't concerned about getting home. He'd finally found a place he belongs. B'elanna said something similar when she tells Tom "I'd always pictured us raising our daughter on Voyager." She's not that excited about getting home now. After seven years and the prospect of spending the rest of your life on Voyager, I'm sure most had long ago accepted their circumstances and didn't waste emotional energy getting their hopes up on a magic sleigh ride back to Earth.

"Home is where the heart is". This has never been truer than here!

For Tom & B'Elena, their journey aboard Voyager was a rebirth for them & cherry on the cake, it allowed them to find their soul mate and start a family.
For Harry, no matter what he will experience later, nothing will ever equal what he lived (the discoveries, the fights, the friendship...) during his journey of 7 years.

I bet that if Janeway asked them if they would be ready to sign for a new adventure, the three (and Miral) would sign without hesitation. Same for the rest of the senior staff ans some other crewmembers.

 

[Paul Weaver]

Well, first off, "Endgame" wasn't a 2-parter to begin with. It was a single 2-hour episode, even though it was split into 2 parts for syndication.

But yes, definitely it ended too abruptly and did nothing to address the question of what would happen to the crew once they got home. That was a major shortcoming. I was far from the only person who saw the ending, blinked, and wondered, in the words of another entity named Voyager, "Is this all there is? Is there nothing more?" But then, I feel DS9 had the same problem, ending too abruptly and leaving the aftermath unaddressed.

Not convinced. If DS9 had finished at the end of the war (lets ignore the 2 week voyage of Dukat and Winn through the caves for now), basically fade to black pretty much after the founder surrenders, that would feel more like Endgame's finale.

I don't think it needed an extra episode after they emerged in the AQ (and I disliked the timetravel part anyway), but an extra 20 minutes - the ship landing in front of the golden gate bridge, some montages of the crew meeting up with families, a few short scenes over the next week or two, Janeway promoted, Chakotay taking charge of the ship, Belana and Paris leaving, Icheb starting at the academy - a Paris/Kim goodbye, some form of investigation with a few questions ("you lost how many shuttles?")

Oh and drop the "back to the delta-quadrant" and "Right where we expected to be " fake out.

 

[Sophie74656]

Why would Voyager land on Earth at all? If anything they would enter space dock

 

[Paul Weaver]

Why would Voyager land on Earth at all? If anything they would enter space dock

Because it would look AWESOME

 

[Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME]

Well, failing to see Voyager lands on Earth, I think it would have been fun to see the vessel docks with Deep Space Nine, such a homecoming.

In Caretaker, we had this

In the end of Endgame, we could have had that (with Voyager about to dock)

Or just that

 

[Sophie74656]

Because it would look AWESOME

Yes it would look great but it wouldn't be actually possible.

 

[tomswift2002]

I can understand why big Voyager fans were bummed that they just ended the show with them arriving and then abruptly finished. But a whole third part focusing on them just on Earth would have been anti-climactic, and, as another poster said, likely would have just comprised of fan service.

The whole other problem that really led a lot of fans to feel let down is that Endgame reused the Borg again. Since Season 3, Voyager had had to have it's yearly "big battle with the Borg" storyline,, and really, one single starship had managed to inflict so much damage and destruction, as to cause the entire Collective to shatter after the results of Unimatrix Zero, that Voyager needed to go up against another enemy, and not just one where it was like "its the Borg, lets go at it again". Earlier today I re-read an article from Star Trek The Magazine from 2012 where they were (for Trek's 45 anniversary) talking about each 45th produced episode/movie (starting with "Journey To Babel" and then talking about the next 45th episode, which I believe was "The Terratin Incident" and going on like that), and one of the episodes mentioned, for the last four 45th episodes was Dragon's Teeth, with the Vaadwuur. At the end of DT the Vaadwuur had been setup as potentially dangerous enemies, and yet we never saw them again.

Endgame felt like Turnabout Intruder, but with a very short 'phone call' at the end to say that they were home.

 

[Prax]

Endgame felt like Turnabout Intruder, but with a very short 'phone call' at the end to say that they were home.

How? Half the episode takes place in the future, after they got home. Janeway goes back to take advantage of a missed opportunity. This is the 4th Borg 2-parter and concludes the ongoing story between Seven, the queen, and Janeway. There were more non-borg two-parters than Borg ones.

There's really nothing to see (in a single episode)after they get home. Are they supposed to show a silly slow-mo montage where the Voyager crew are smiling and hugging a bunch of loved ones we don't know, while "Don't Stop Believing" plays in the background?

 

[Prax]

In case anyone needs help imagining what I just described.

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[TheAdmiralty]

The whole other problem that really led a lot of fans to feel let down is that Endgame reused the Borg again. Since Season 3, Voyager had had to have it's yearly "big battle with the Borg" storyline,, and really, one single starship had managed to inflict so much damage and destruction, as to cause the entire Collective to shatter after the results of Unimatrix Zero, that Voyager needed to go up against another enemy, and not just one where it was like "its the Borg, lets go at it again".

As someone else said, I think a bookending with them revisiting the Caretaker stuff might have been a better way to go.

 

[Sophie74656]

Personally i loved the Borg stuff and never thought they were over used. I liked that they were in the finale

 

[Mareika]

To answer the thread`s question: Nooo! I didn`t like Endgame and I was very disappointed about the ending. But I don`t think another part would help. I wish they had give the crew a movie to tell a new story about these wonderful crew.

 

[marlboro]

But in this case, I'm just curious but who would decide to stay behind with Janeway?

I'm not a Voyager expert like you guys, so my ideas may seem ridiculous to people who know the characters far better than I.This wouldn't be a single episode, or even a three parter necessarily. Maybe an entire season's worth of gradual changes leading to big decisions by the characters.


Stays in the Delta Quadrant:

Seven: Sacrifices herself to cure the Borg.

Janeway: Decides to stay behind to aid the now helpless former Borg. Not doing so would make Seven's sacrifice pointless.

Chakotay: The Maquis are long gone. He stays by his captain's side. It's where he belongs.

B'Elanna & Tom: I don't think the Alpha Quadrant treated them very well. I think they would both be willing to try a fresh start in the Delta Quadrant. The tougher question is, would they want to keep the baby on board and in possible danger, or would they settle down on some peaceful planet? I think their arc leads them to seeking a quieter family life, but still willing to go on the occasional adventure with their captain.

EMH: Shaken by the death of Seven, he puts away his childish daydreams of fame and glory back on Earth and devotes his life to helping the ex-Borg and all of the other inhabitants of the Delta Quadrant. Ironically, he becomes a legend to countless future generations of Delta Quadrant citizens.

Kes: A very old - but completely sane - Kes makes a final appearance and uses her now immense powers to return all of the members of Voyager who choose to leave to the Alpha Quadrant. Weakened, she returns to her home world to live out her final days with...

Neelix: He has no real reason to want to go to the Alpha Quadrant. He chooses to stay behind to watch over Kes and eventually makes the Ocampa his new family.


Goes home:

A large percentage of the unnamed crew: I think that many of the people who have been lost for all these years would be willing to jump at the chance to return home.

To replace them, you would see a lot of new faces in the background during the last episode of the show. Reclaimed Borg, and various members of races we have met throughout the seven seasons.

Tuvok: Returns home. He has a wife and family that he loves very much. I would love to see a shot of Vulcan, with Tuvok being welcomed by his family.

Harry: Last scene of the show is Harry sitting in Quark's bar, an extra pip on his collar, Libby by his side, recounting the adventures of the Voyager to a spellbound audience. In the end he toasts his absent friends and we see a majestic shot of the Voyager sailing through the Delta Quadrant.

That's right - Harry got promoted, got the girl, and got the last word!

However, if you look closely, you can see that Libby is wearing a pair of Quark's Lobi crystals. Damn it Starfleet, will you never learn?

 

[tomswift2002]

Personally i loved the Borg stuff and never thought they were over used. I liked that they were in the finale

I've been thinking about this, and really, with the way Endgame was written, it didn't close a number of threads that were left open, like:

-What happened to the Borg from Unimatrix Zero? At the end of the two-parter it seemed like the Collective was splintered and now there was a separate faction that was fighting the Queen to disassemble the hive. Surely a story could've come from here without having to resort to a time travel Borg episode.

-Instead of hitting the "reset" button, why not advance the story by 20 years?

-Forget the Borg and time travel, how about bringing back the Vaadwuur and maybe the Equinox crewmembers?

Seriously, the producers had a lot more options open to them that could've satisfied fans.