Star Wars Books Thread

[Tuskin38]

Inferno Squad might be another Battlefront tie in. The Day 1 countdown video for the Battlefront 2 trailer has Aurbesh that translates into Inferno Squad
https://twitter.com/EAStarWars/status/852959682088103936

And apparently amazon UK back in February accidentally listed it as a tie in novel
https://twitter.com/germanjedi/status/833350655003750402

The novel takes place after the destruction of the first Death Star, it might be a prequel to the campaign's story, a leaked PS4 Advert implies the game's Campaign follows imperials after ROTJ.

 

[JD]

Kirk, do you enjoy these debates and are saying this stuff just to get them going? I understand you say you aren't lying, but even so you must realize what kind of a reaction you're going to get. I know how agravating these conversations are when I agree with everyone else, so I can't imagine what it must be like when we don't.
To be completely honest there were times I almost gave up coming the message boards altogether just because of these conversations with you, and the knowledge that there was a chance you could pop up in any thread.

 

[WebLurker]

I don't really have a choice as to how much I'll read. If it pisses me off enough, and it will, I won't read past the point it makes me angry. The ending has no effect on the story. Unless the end directly removes Rebels from canon, its not going to be changing my mind on anything. Its already going to be the worst Star Wars book I've ever looked at because of how much I hate the fake Thrawn its about.

Wow. Just, wow. (FIY, I was assuming that if you read the ending, it would be to see how angry it made you.)

For what it's worth, I think this book, while it might be the best story with the character, is the best Thrawn has ever been written in the franchise period. The good stuff from Legends, with the problems from there fixed.

The poorly done Disney film based off an obscure, uninteresting comic? Not exactly winning your argument with that example.

Fine, How to Train Your Dragon, then.

(FIY, Big Hero 6 got an 89% on Rotten Tomatoes, was a box office success, was nominated for quite a few awards -- including wining the Best Animated Feature Oscar, and was generally well-received by audiences at the time. So, yes, I think I am winning my argument. If you can think of an example that fits the bill for you, I'll listen.)

The prequels fit well with the OT?

Heck, yeah. (I marathon these things in chronological order annually, so I do have a basis for believing that, based on repeated direct observation.)

They certainly don't feel like two halves of the story.

"Rise and fall of the Empire," the "Tragedy of Darth Vader," look at it that way. Does that make sense?

As for Catalyst, its not half the story. Its, maybe, 1/50th of the story, and its the 1/50th that was easily guessed and not needed.

Having read the book more than once, I submit it does.

I have better things to do with my time then read Catalyst. Its not even hate reading with Catalyst, its a waste of time. But, I know its ponly about the characters that needed no extra backstory, and online sources confirm its all pointless garbage instead of the backstory the movie desperately needed.

So, if you're not going to read the book, why angst over it? It's not harming you and there are other people who are happy to have it. (FIY, based on my empirical research, I disagree with your sources.)

Amazon says it was written for people starting around 4th grade (which is about age 9 in the US, I just realized that 8-12 is specifically for that terrible "Rebel Dossier" that was mentioned earlier). They've had books in that format for decades, its a kids book format that exists specifically for young kids. I've been seeing them in libraries even back when I was a kid.

I've seen the Visual Guide in person. While it might be okay for kids to read (no swearing, no graphic images -- well except for mutilated cyborgs), it's not a kiddie book. Trust me, I've seen what the kiddie-targeted DK Visual Guides are. This is an everyone book. (Also, if you never read the Rebel Dossier, then you don't know a thing about it. It's written by Jason Fry, and the they guy does good stuff.)

No, its not. Its just like those grade school kids books. Its funny, back in the day people didn't argue the little kids books were anything but non-canon.

No one argued because it was understood that they were canonical. Heck, New Jedi Order, a so-called adult series, was a sequel to some of those kid's series. The only ones I recall being in question were the Glove of Darth Vader books and even those were confirmed to be canon (if slapped with a thick layer of retcons and clarifications).

For some reason, the terrible new canon stuff gets desperately defended.

I'm just stating facts. Not my fault you don't like them. Also, if Legends "kid's stuff" was canon, why aren't we extending the same courtesy to new canon, esp. given that the people making the stuff have told us that they are?

Not really. Its a big universe, everything can't connect to everything else. To try otherwise is small universe syndrome at best, crappy writing at worst.

"Connects" as in "one continuity." Is that a better way to put it?

Rebels gets referenced because Filoni has friends, and Disney wants to get the five year olds watching the movie to go watch their crappy show for little kids.

Or maybe, there are people working on those things who actually (gasp) like the darn show, so want to use it for color in their corner of the sandbox. Most people I've heard from like it and find it to be among the most authentic Star Wars-y things ever created for the franchise, and to be honest, I think they're right. (You got to understand, you're in a distinct minority on that show.)

Its nothing besides that, and I've already pointed out several places that contain no reference to it.

So?

Whatever. We'll have to agree to disagree. I'll take a 10 year olds fanfiction as canon before I'd take a novelization (the fanfiction would also probably be more entertaining and fit better in the universe).

Well, you're entitled to your headcanon, same's everyone.

(For clarification, when you say that you don't think the YA-ish books are canon, is that your headcanon or is that what you believe LucasFilm's official policy is? If the former, that would make your reasoning easier to understand. If the latter, where the heck did you get that information? That's goes against everything I've seen and heard on the subject.

Seems like an easier way to say that would have been "they're non-canon".

It's possible "align" is being read too strictly.

Yeah, I think that, in regards to the original six were for sure none of the embellishments are canonical, as seems to be the case w/ the Disney stuff (as I understand it, FIY), they should've just declared them non-canon, since they are that for all practical purposes; the only benefit for canonizing a novelization is so that the embellishments can be part of continuity. In fact, the Wook just declares them Legends, despite them technically canon, which I think was the sane thing to do.

 

[Spot261]

Like I said, I'd be reading (or at least attempting the read) Thrawn even if I didn't discuss things online. I'm doing it for my own morbid curiosity, to see how bad it actually is.

I don't really have a choice as to how much I'll read. If it pisses me off enough, and it will, I won't read past the point it makes me angry.

wow

 

[fireproof78]

wow

I read an interesting article about how hatred distorts a perspective on a subject or person. I never quite understood that, but I'm starting too.

 

[kirk55555]

Before I respond to some posts, and on a more positive subject (to prove I do have positive things to say) I've been reading Ahsoka, and the book is actually pretty good. Ahsoka herself is basically written like she was in TCW, being intelligent, skilled, and still an interesting character. The book, which I'm about 180 pages into, is a very good continuation of her story from TCW, while simultaneously being incompatible with Rebels because of how it writes Ahsoka as not being an incompetent doofus. This is the Ahsoka that I liked in TCW. The events of the book, while not the most original, are well written and interesting, same with the supporting cast.

So, this morbidly curious hate read of the book has turned into me just reading the book because I like it. If only other books had done this (write a book about the actual character, not the later saturday morning cartoon version). Actually, New Dawn managed to do that too, weirdly enough. I don't know how EK Johnston managed to be allowed to write about the original Ahsoka and not the incompetent one from Rebels, but its very refreshing to get a real Ahsoka story set after TCW.

Wow. Just, wow. (FIY, I was assuming that if you read the ending, it would be to see how angry it made you.)

For what it's worth, I think this book, while it might be the best story with the character, is the best Thrawn has ever been written in the franchise period. The good stuff from Legends, with the problems from there fixed.

I consider Thrawn from Legends to have zero problems, and the Thrawn from Rebels to not be thrawn, so we are as far apart on that as two people can possibly be about an opinion. I don't consider the book titled Thrawn to even be about the real character, because the real character doesn't exist in the new canon.

"Rise and fall of the Empire," the "Tragedy of Darth Vader," look at it that way. Does that make sense?

I know that what Lucas always tried to say. Obviously they connect, but I'd say, on the style differences and lack of quality of the prequels they barely work together. The basic events connect. But, how those events were put into movie form clash, in my opinion.

So, if you're not going to read the book, why angst over it? It's not harming you and there are other people who are happy to have it. (FIY, based on my empirical research, I disagree with your sources.)

I'm angry because, having watched Rogue One, its obvious what elements needed to be expanded with a real SW book. Exactly none of those things are even mentioned in Catalyst, and the fact that they wasted a book on pointless garbage is infuriating when the movie, for as good as it is, has such deep flaws.

I've seen the Visual Guide in person. While it might be okay for kids to read (no swearing, no graphic images -- well except for mutilated cyborgs), it's not a kiddie book. Trust me, I've seen what the kiddie-targeted DK Visual Guides are. This is an everyone book. (Also, if you never read the Rebel Dossier, then you don't know a thing about it. It's written by Jason Fry, and the they guy does good stuff.)

Based off the cover and preview pages online, its exactly like every visual book DK has done. Its ok to like that, but its very kiddie. As for Jason Fry, he's worked on some legitimately good Star Wars non-fiction, like The Essential Guide to Warfare (which was canon to the old EU) and the decent (but non Canon) Rey's Survival Guide for the new canon. But, he's also written books specifically for kids (some reference stuff and those lame "Moving Target" kiddie books), and the 64 page Rebel Dossier is obviously one of the kiddie books he's written.

No one argued because it was understood that they were canonical. Heck, New Jedi Order, a so-called adult series, was a sequel to some of those kid's series. The only ones I recall being in question were the Glove of Darth Vader books and even those were confirmed to be canon (if slapped with a thick layer of retcons and clarifications).

The NJO wasn't a sequel to any kids books. It might have connected to Young Jedi Knights, but those weren't kiddie books (and, really, NJO portrayed Jacen so badly it might actually count as a partial retcon of his stuff from YJK).

I'm just stating facts. Not my fault you don't like them. Also, if Legends "kid's stuff" was canon, why aren't we extending the same courtesy to new canon, esp. given that the people making the stuff have told us that they are?

Because, at the bare minimu, absolutely nothing important happened in the (non-canon) EU kiddie books. Even if you want to pretend that Young jedi Knights was younger then it was, it effected all of three semi-important side characters, and even then those three got most of their character development from the normal general audience books.

"Connects" as in "one continuity." Is that a better way to put it?

Yeah, that makes more sense.

Or maybe, there are people working on those things who actually (gasp) like the darn show, so want to use it for color in their corner of the sandbox. Most people I've heard from like it and find it to be among the most authentic Star Wars-y things ever created for the franchise, and to be honest, I think they're right. (You got to understand, you're in a distinct minority on that show.)

Rebels is far from a huge hit. I'm pretty sure its not nearly as popular as TCW, both critically and ratings wise. TCW is a show I've actually seen syndicated on a channel with absolutely zero kid focused content, because when it was good it was more for general audiences then kids, and I guarantee more casual SW fans are more likely to be aware of something from tCW then they are Rebels. Rebels is a little kids cartoon. Its fine to like it, hell I still watch and enjoy Power Rangers even though, at 26, I'm about 14 years older then the older part of its targeted demographic. But, in the end, Rebels is just a cartoon (bad or not) for 10 year olds. I'd say that, if you include general SW fans who don't give a crap about kids cartoons, I'm in the vast majority opinion of Rebels, outside of internet forums. Its a stupid kids show that, for me, became offensively bad because of what they did to first Ahsoka and then "Thrawn".

Kirk, do you enjoy these debates and are saying this stuff just to get them going? I understand you say you aren't lying, but even so you must realize what kind of a reaction you're going to get. I know how agravating these conversations are when I agree with everyone else, so I can't imagine what it must be like when we don't.
To be completely honest there were times I almost gave up coming the message boards altogether just because of these conversations with you, and the knowledge that there was a chance you could pop up in any thread.

I don't particularly enjoy it, no. But, I don't like getting bullied, and that's what it feels like whenever I have a different opinion from the majority. Most of the time, I'd post my opinion and have no intention of following it up, because I said my piece. But then someone decides to crap on my opinion, so I defend that opinion, and it snowballs from there. I don't like huge arguments, I just tend to get in them because I'm not going to let people argue me out of a thread just because we don't agree on something. I'll admit I could be more selective about responding to some things, but in the end its a discussion forum. Its made to discuss things, not just post agreeing opinions about things.

I'm not just going to shut up and go away because I have unpopular opinions. If you don't like that, I'm sorry. I don't want to get into arguments, I much prefer discussing things that don't turn into arguments. But, I'm not staying out of topics just because I don't parrot the popular opinion.

 

[Tuskin38]

I know we have a Rebels thread, but I assume not everyone reads that plus it is ontopic. Another EU book character coming to Rebels Season 4, related to Thrawn.

Spoiler

Rukh! Played by Warrick Davis

 

[JD]

Before I respond to some posts, and on a more positive subject (to prove I do have positive things to say) I've been reading Ahsoka, and the book is actually pretty good. Ahsoka herself is basically written like she was in TCW, being intelligent, skilled, and still an interesting character. The book, which I'm about 180 pages into, is a very good continuation of her story from TCW, while simultaneously being incompatible with Rebels because of how it writes Ahsoka as not being an incompetent doofus. This is the Ahsoka that I liked in TCW. The events of the book, while not the most original, are well written and interesting, same with the supporting cast.

So, this morbidly curious hate read of the book has turned into me just reading the book because I like it. If only other books had done this (write a book about the actual character, not the later saturday morning cartoon version). Actually, New Dawn managed to do that too, weirdly enough. I don't know how EK Johnston managed to be allowed to write about the original Ahsoka and not the incompetent one from Rebels, but its very refreshing to get a real Ahsoka story set after TCW.




I consider Thrawn from Legends to have zero problems, and the Thrawn from Rebels to not be thrawn, so we are as far apart on that as two people can possibly be about an opinion. I don't consider the book titled Thrawn to even be about the real character, because the real character doesn't exist in the new canon.



I know that what Lucas always tried to say. Obviously they connect, but I'd say, on the style differences and lack of quality of the prequels they barely work together. The basic events connect. But, how those events were put into movie form clash, in my opinion.



I'm angry because, having watched Rogue One, its obvious what elements needed to be expanded with a real SW book. Exactly none of those things are even mentioned in Catalyst, and the fact that they wasted a book on pointless garbage is infuriating when the movie, for as good as it is, has such deep flaws.



Based off the cover and preview pages online, its exactly like every visual book DK has done. Its ok to like that, but its very kiddie. As for Jason Fry, he's worked on some legitimately good Star Wars non-fiction, like The Essential Guide to Warfare (which was canon to the old EU) and the decent (but non Canon) Rey's Survival Guide for the new canon. But, he's also written books specifically for kids (some reference stuff and those lame "Moving Target" kiddie books), and the 64 page Rebel Dossier is obviously one of the kiddie books he's written.




The NJO wasn't a sequel to any kids books. It might have connected to Young Jedi Knights, but those weren't kiddie books (and, really, NJO portrayed Jacen so badly it might actually count as a partial retcon of his stuff from YJK).




Because, at the bare minimu, absolutely nothing important happened in the (non-canon) EU kiddie books. Even if you want to pretend that Young jedi Knights was younger then it was, it effected all of three semi-important side characters, and even then those three got most of their character development from the normal general audience books.



Yeah, that makes more sense.



Rebels is far from a huge hit. I'm pretty sure its not nearly as popular as TCW, both critically and ratings wise. TCW is a show I've actually seen syndicated on a channel with absolutely zero kid focused content, because when it was good it was more for general audiences then kids, and I guarantee more casual SW fans are more likely to be aware of something from tCW then they are Rebels. Rebels is a little kids cartoon. Its fine to like it, hell I still watch and enjoy Power Rangers even though, at 26, I'm about 14 years older then the older part of its targeted demographic. But, in the end, Rebels is just a cartoon (bad or not) for 10 year olds. I'd say that, if you include general SW fans who don't give a crap about kids cartoons, I'm in the vast majority opinion of Rebels, outside of internet forums. Its a stupid kids show that, for me, became offensively bad because of what they did to first Ahsoka and then "Thrawn".



I don't particularly enjoy it, no. But, I don't like getting bullied, and that's what it feels like whenever I have a different opinion from the majority. Most of the time, I'd post my opinion and have no intention of following it up, because I said my piece. But then someone decides to crap on my opinion, so I defend that opinion, and it snowballs from there. I don't like huge arguments, I just tend to get in them because I'm not going to let people argue me out of a thread just because we don't agree on something. I'll admit I could be more selective about responding to some things, but in the end its a discussion forum. Its made to discuss things, not just post agreeing opinions about things.

I'm not just going to shut up and go away because I have unpopular opinions. If you don't like that, I'm sorry. I don't want to get into arguments, I much prefer discussing things that don't turn into arguments. But, I'm not staying out of topics just because I don't parrot the popular opinion.

I've tried to explain this to you before, but it's not the fact that you have different opinions that pisses people off, it's the way you approach the conversations that pisses us off.

Honestly, putting this stuff aside, you seem like pretty good guy, and if you just approached these debates differently we could probably all get along.

 

[Reverend]

I read an interesting article about how hatred distorts a perspective on a subject or person. I never quite understood that, but I'm starting too.

Well I can hardly see how it could possibly clarify a perspective, no?

 

[DimesDan]

I've tried to explain this to you before, but it's not the fact that you have different opinions that pisses people off, it's the way you approach the conversations that pisses us off.

If he had a dollar for every time he has been told this, he would have a good few hundred thousand by now from the times he's been told this down in the zone that is forbidden.

 

[fireproof78]

I've tried to explain this to you before, but it's not the fact that you have different opinions that pisses people off, it's the way you approach the conversations that pisses us off.

Honestly, putting this stuff aside, you seem like pretty good guy, and if you just approached these debates differently we could probably all get along.

As good chefs say, "Presentation is everything."

In all honestly, it feels like a similar argument against Abrams Star Trek-it destroyed Star Trek. No it didn't. The VHS, DVDs and books are all still there.

Disney didn't destroy the EU books and the iteration of Thrawn from the EU is still there to be read and enjoyed. The fact that LFL adapted Thrawn in the way that they did does no diminish his book presence, nor does it ruin the character. It simply is an adaption, one to enjoyed or ignored.

Well I can hardly see how it could possibly clarify a perspective, no?

It's almost like Yoda was on to something.

 

[kirk55555]

As good chefs say, "Presentation is everything."

In all honestly, it feels like a similar argument against Abrams Star Trek-it destroyed Star Trek. No it didn't. The VHS, DVDs and books are all still there.

Disney didn't destroy the EU books and the iteration of Thrawn from the EU is still there to be read and enjoyed. The fact that LFL adapted Thrawn in the way that they did does no diminish his book presence, nor does it ruin the character. It simply is an adaption, one to enjoyed or ignored.

That argument is so ridiculous. Yeah, I still have my books.But maybe, and this might be a wild idea, I want new stories with the real Thrawn? Not just the same few books for all eternity? I mean, he was dead in the EU so he wasn't getting anything new, but if they're making new Thrawn, it should be the real one. No one has ever argued that old books still exist. But its getting new things with the character(s) you like that is the issue.

Plus, yeah, a bad adaptation is an insult to what came before. Especially since all the terrible changes were not needed and only done because of a lack of writing ability and caring on the part of the people adapting the property/character/etc. It would be better to not use the name Thrawn then to do what Filoni did.

Kids don't care about Thrawn, so there was no reason to use him the way they did when they could have made something up. But, instead, they decided to mess with a great character like thrawn. whether it was being petty (The original thrawn trilogy is better then anything Lucas or Filoni ever made), or thinking their bastardized version could take some money out of older fans wallets, what they did is an insult, and just because I still own the books with the real thrawn doesn't mean they get a pass at an insulting, garbage adaptation.

 

[fireproof78]

That argument is so ridiculous. Yeah, I still have my books.But maybe, and this might be a wild idea, I want new stories with the real Thrawn? Not just the same few books for all eternity? I mean, he was dead in the EU so he wasn't getting anything new, but if they're making new Thrawn, it should be the real one. No one has ever argued that old books still exist. But its getting new things with the character(s) you like that is the issue.

Plus, yeah, a bad adaptation is an insult to what came before. Especially since all the terrible changes were not needed and only done because of a lack of writing ability and caring on the part of the people adapting the property/character/etc. It would be better to not use the name Thrawn then to do what Filoni did.

Kids don't care about Thrawn, so there was no reason to use him the way they did when they could have made something up. But, instead, they decided to mess with a great character like thrawn. whether it was being petty (The original thrawn trilogy is better then anything Lucas or Filoni ever made), or thinking their bastardized version could take some money out of older fans wallets, what they did is an insult, and just because I still own the books with the real thrawn doesn't mean they get a pass at an insulting, garbage adaptation.

It also means that people who want the original Thrawn (sorry, won't use "real" because he isn't) still have him in book form. A bad adaption isn't insulting-it's just a point of disagreement.

Different writers and producers focus on different elements of the character. This is true from Filoni, to Lucas, to any one in the field. So, the argument that production teams who do a poor adaption are "insulting" a character is facetious, at best and ad hominem, at worst. It just means that they emphasized different facets in the adaptation process, rather than focusing on making an exact one-to-one replica from a book .

Regardless, it isn't worth the emotional energy for me to "hate" what is being done on Rebels. There are parts I agree with and parts I disagree with, just like every other book or show I have ever read or watched.

 

[JD]

I forgot to post my thoughts on the second volume of Marvel's Darth Vader series, which I finished on Thursday.

Spoiler: plot details for Darth Vader Vol. 2

Like I said before, Thanoth was a nice addition to the cast. His back and forth with Vader, and the fact that we knew Vader was the mastermind behind the theft were fun.
The whole plot with the theft, the information broker and Aphra's discovery of the fact Amidala had given birth was really good. The whole plot of these first two volumes and Vader's investigation into Luke has done a good job of both filling a gap in the movie story, and giving us great stories at the same time.
I was a little confused about why Vader was so mad at Aphra at the end though, I had assumed he wanted her to find out the about Luke, but then he seemed pissed she knew.

 

[kirk55555]

It also means that people who want the original Thrawn (sorry, won't use "real" because he isn't) still have him in book form. A bad adaption isn't insulting-it's just a point of disagreement.

Different writers and producers focus on different elements of the character. This is true from Filoni, to Lucas, to any one in the field. So, the argument that production teams who do a poor adaption are "insulting" a character is facetious, at best and ad hominem, at worst. It just means that they emphasized different facets in the adaptation process, rather than focusing on making an exact one-to-one replica from a book .

Regardless, it isn't worth the emotional energy for me to "hate" what is being done on Rebels. There are parts I agree with and parts I disagree with, just like every other book or show I have ever read or watched.

Whatever. As far as I'm concerned, they're not emphasizing anything of the original character. its just a standard crap 80s cartoon villain with a Thrawn paintjob. It is an insult to the character and the fans of the character. But, that's to be expected from Filoni at this point. I just wish he stopped ruining characters he had nothing to do with. Its bad enough he ruined Ahsoka, now he's dragging the work of people he's not fit to kiss the feet of through the dirt, and in some cases turning them into his little yes men in the process.

Edit: Ok, I'm not going into more of a Filoni/Rebels rant in this book thread. Suffice it to say I think Filoni is one of the worst things to happen to the franchise, and he will continue going out of his way to ruin the work/characters of people much more talented then he's ever been.

Thrawn is what pisses me off the most, but Filoni is just getting started. His hack work will also effect the books, but since half the books are crappy YA books for the Twilight crowd the biggest effect will be his ccrap taking general audience book slots away from good possible books, and ruining characters the books might have used and done better.

 

[The Wormhole]

I forgot to post my thoughts on the second volume of Marvel's Darth Vader series, which I finished on Thursday.

Spoiler: plot details for Darth Vader Vol. 2

Like I said before, Thanoth was a nice addition to the cast. His back and forth with Vader, and the fact that we knew Vader was the mastermind behind the theft were fun.
The whole plot with the theft, the information broker and Aphra's discovery of the fact Amidala had given birth was really good. The whole plot of these first two volumes and Vader's investigation into Luke has done a good job of both filling a gap in the movie story, and giving us great stories at the same time.
I was a little confused about why Vader was so mad at Aphra at the end though, I had assumed he wanted her to find out the about Luke, but then he seemed pissed she knew.

Spoiler: something to remember

Aphra did snitch him out to the Emperor. Granted, the Emperor didn't care and actually approved of what he heard, but it is still kind of a betrayal.

 

[The Wormhole]

Yeah, I know, double posting. But I think the news justifies it. Apparently we're getting both a comic series and a novel centred on Captain Phasma in the fall.
http://www.denofgeek.com/us/books-c...ar-wars-captain-phasma-comic-and-novel-coming

 

[fireproof78]

Whatever. As far as I'm concerned, they're not emphasizing anything of the original character. its just a standard crap 80s cartoon villain with a Thrawn paintjob. It is an insult to the character and the fans of the character. But, that's to be expected from Filoni at this point. I just wish he stopped ruining characters he had nothing to do with. Its bad enough he ruined Ahsoka, now he's dragging the work of people he's not fit to kiss the feet of through the dirt, and in some cases turning them into his little yes men in the process.

Edit: Ok, I'm not going into more of a Filoni/Rebels rant in this book thread. Suffice it to say I think Filoni is one of the worst things to happen to the franchise, and he will continue going out of his way to ruin the work/characters of people much more talented then he's ever been.

Thrawn is what pisses me off the most, but Filoni is just getting started. His hack work will also effect the books, but since half the books are crappy YA books for the Twilight crowd the biggest effect will be his ccrap taking general audience book slots away from good possible books, and ruining characters the books might have used and done better.

Agree to disagree then. As far as I'm concerned, I have the Thrawn from the books and the Thrawn from the show, and neither is insulting to the other.

I have more confidence with the franchise as a whole than I had at the end of ROTS, and think it will continue to grow and expand and improve.

 

[kirk55555]

Agree to disagree then. As far as I'm concerned, I have the Thrawn from the books and the Thrawn from the show, and neither is insulting to the other.

I have more confidence with the franchise as a whole than I had at the end of ROTS, and think it will continue to grow and expand and improve.

I have full confidence in the movies, and some confidence in the comics. If the books put out a single good general audience book ever 2-3 years it will be a nice surprise, and TV is a complete write off. That won't stop me getting angry/disappointed at the TV/books, but its something I'll have to get used to, although not something I'll ignore.


Speaking of books specifically, I'm a bit over 200 pages through Ahsoka and still enjoying it. We've seen a Rebels element added, but since its 13 years before Season 1 of Rebels its written differently. Specifically, its one of the Inquisitors, the "6th Brother". I have no idea if that one is mentioned in the show (all of the inquisitors kind of mesh together, except for the first one and the one voiced by Buffy). The only issue with this in the book is that, if I hadn't seen some Rebels episodes with them, the Inquisitor would be confusing. The book establishes them as a Empire minion, and someone who hunts force users, but that's it.

There is no physical description so far (although I expect one eventually). I think they could have introduced him better, but I'm curious to see if he'll fly around like a helicopter with his lightsaber like the ones in Rebels did honestly, it makes sense to use an Inquisitor as a worthy single foe for Ashoka. The book will probably explain him in more detail as it goes, but it probably could have done a better job right from his intro. Still, its just a little thing in a pretty solid book.

 

[WebLurker]

I don't know how EK Johnston managed to be allowed to write about the original Ahsoka and not the incompetent one from Rebels, but its very refreshing to get a real Ahsoka story set after TCW.

I think Johnston has gone on record as being a fan of the character. Also, since the book was set shortly after Clone Wars, it would make sense that Ahsoka is still much like she was in that program; she hadn't had time to develop into the person she was in Rebels (to keep purely neutral on whether the show got the character right or not).

I consider Thrawn from Legends to have zero problems, and the Thrawn from Rebels to not be thrawn, so we are as far apart on that as two people can possibly be about an opinion. I don't consider the book titled Thrawn to even be about the real character, because the real character doesn't exist in the new canon.

The thing with Legends Thrawn was that, esp. in the later written books, his deductions and skills got more and more "magical," for lack of a better word, to the point where it felt like he was infallible (a bit like the stereotypical Mary Sue). They also inserted the idea that he was with the Empire only to prepare the Galaxy for the Vong invasion didn't work for me either; it seemed like they were trying to whitewash the original books where he was clearly a villain.

For my money, Zahn gave the character depth that he didn't have before in the new novel and also got the balance between making Thrawn a tactical genius who's among the best in his profession, but in a way that seemed "real life" plausible. But that's just me.

I know that what Lucas always tried to say. Obviously they connect, but I'd say, on the style differences and lack of quality of the prequels they barely work together. The basic events connect. But, how those events were put into movie form clash, in my opinion.

Well, with a twenty-year gap in-universe, things do change (society changes a lot over twenty years in real life). Different parts of the Galaxy were focused on in each trilogy (the prequels focused on the more central, urbanized worlds, the originals were more out on the frontier and farther away from the central powers). I thought it was fine.

I'm angry because, having watched Rogue One, its obvious what elements needed to be expanded with a real SW book. Exactly none of those things are even mentioned in Catalyst, and the fact that they wasted a book on pointless garbage is infuriating when the movie, for as good as it is, has such deep flaws.

We don't know what was going on behind the scenes. For example, Jyn Erso is getting her own novel focusing on her life between being taken in by Saw and being rescued from the prison camp. Maybe a prequel focusing on the earlier generation was chosen to avoid stepping on the toes of other projects like that?

Based off the cover and preview pages online, its exactly like every visual book DK has done. Its ok to like that, but its very kiddie.

This is DK doing a kiddie movie reference work.

As for Jason Fry, he's worked on some legitimately good Star Wars non-fiction, like The Essential Guide to Warfare (which was canon to the old EU) and the decent (but non Canon) Rey's Survival Guide for the new canon. But, he's also written books specifically for kids (some reference stuff and those lame "Moving Target" kiddie books), and the 64 page Rebel Dossier is obviously one of the kiddie books he's written.

Unless you're referring to headcanon, the Survival Guide is canon. I don't really see what's wrong with having stuff that's written to be okay for kids as well. Star Wars has a wide appeal across different age ranges.

The NJO wasn't a sequel to any kids books. It might have connected to Young Jedi Knights, but those weren't kiddie books (and, really, NJO portrayed Jacen so badly it might actually count as a partial retcon of his stuff from YJK).

Well, sequel, followup, kinda the same thing to me in serial storytelling. (I think Jacen was originally slated to be killed in the series, but a change of plans partway through forced them to do something else with him.)

NJO also connected to Junior Jedi Knights, which was written for a primarily children-based audience. The point I'm making is that children's/YA and more adult-orientated books have always coexisted and always connected together to create a single canon. Disney doing the same today is business as usual.

Because, at the bare minimu, absolutely nothing important happened in the (non-canon) EU kiddie books.

Funny, given that Rey's Survival Guide and the Force Awakens junior novelization offered the most clues to Rey's past than anything else to date (until Last Jedi is released, at least). Finn's backstory was only fleshed out in a YA book (Before the Awakening). The explanation of how the Skywalker map worked, only in the junior novelizations.

From my experience, "importance" greatly depends on what you want to know and it can be put anywhere.

Even if you want to pretend that Young jedi Knights was younger then it was, it effected all of three semi-important side characters, and even then those three got most of their character development from the normal general audience books.

What's that got to do with a YA and adult book series being interconnected and building off each other?

Rebels is far from a huge hit. I'm pretty sure its not nearly as popular as TCW, both critically and ratings wise. TCW is a show I've actually seen syndicated on a channel with absolutely zero kid focused content, because when it was good it was more for general audiences then kids, and I guarantee more casual SW fans are more likely to be aware of something from tCW then they are Rebels. Rebels is a little kids cartoon. Its fine to like it, hell I still watch and enjoy Power Rangers even though, at 26, I'm about 14 years older then the older part of its targeted demographic. But, in the end, Rebels is just a cartoon (bad or not) for 10 year olds. I'd say that, if you include general SW fans who don't give a crap about kids cartoons, I'm in the vast majority opinion of Rebels, outside of internet forums. Its a stupid kids show that, for me, became offensively bad because of what they did to first Ahsoka and then "Thrawn".

I've heard a lot of good things about it in Star Wars fan circles. If there's hard data, that's one thing, but it's has been renewed, as I recall, so it has have gotten enough of a fanbase to be profitable enough to keep making.