Cosmostrator and other stuff...

[Albertese]

I recall Guzman's name in relation to TOS, but I don't believe he there very long or the extent of his inf;uence.

He was the Art Director to begin with in 1964. Matt Jefferies was his assistant. But before he long, he decided to go back to his home country and was replaced with Franz Bachelin for a very short time and then Jefferies took over as the head honcho.
All this took place from to the start of filming "The Cage" and MJ was the the main creative force by the time things started to be built.

What I had confused myself about was Guzman's involvement with First Spaceship on Venus.

--Alex

 

[GMSkarka]

I believe this was also the inspiration for the Liberator from the turn-of-the-80s UK TV series Blake's Seven:

 

[Warped9]

During the late 1940s and through the 1950s the V2 inspired rocketship was the most widely recognized idea of a futuristic spaceship. It came in all manner of sizes and variations on the same essential concept. The form could be seen on the covers of countless SF books and magazines as well as in films and television shows.

Chesley Bonestell was one of the first to crystallize this idea with his Moonship design. Here I've adapted the design and added a couple of touches to add a bit more detail.



There is something of a nostalgic charm to this idea of spacecraft. Certainly it seems to suggest some very advanced thinking given what we know today. Today we know how difficult enough it is to launch a large rocket, but to get it to land upright is a whole other magnitude of difficulty--something we are just beginning to manage today seventy years after this concept was conceived. It requires computer control given it's highly unlikely a pilot could to do it manually particularly when/if returning to land on Earth.

Which raises the quetion: did they really think this through in regard to how this ship was supposed to re-enter the Earth's atmosphere, glide toward the surface and then somehow slow down and orient itself upright to land tail first?

Another issue was a matter or propulsion. Back then in the early atomic age the thinking was that spacecraft of the future would be atomic powered (forgoeing chemical propulsion) and thus the drive systems would appear to be much more compact than what later chemical fuel rockets would have.

 

[Warped9]

One irony of this classic design concept is that while it doesn't work so well for rockets as we know them today (unless you have anti-gravity) it could work well enough as a fast reativistic starhip (given the right drive system). The interstellar medium is not actually a vacuum and at fast relativistic speeds there would be a pressure on the hull. A sleek shape would facilitate piercing the medium.

 

[Warped9]

I could do it in colour, but it looks vintage in B&W.

 

[MANT!]

Reminds me of those Heinlein juvenile books for Scribner he wrote back in the 50s..all were illustrated with typical 50s rockets..
loved those pics.

And I do wish Mars and Venus were as depicted in those days..Space travel would be much more interesting with habitable planets in the Solar System.

 

[publiusr]

Dinosaur Venus and dying canal Mars--back when the Moon had jagged cliffs. We need a do-over.

 

[Warped9]

If TOS had been done in the '40s maybe this is what the Enterprisre might have looked like.

 

[MANT!]

off all of Heinlein's juveniles, perhaps the best one that could be translated into the modern era would be "The Rolling Stones"

a lot of that novel had fantastic orbital mechanics, and minus the Martian "Flat Cats" and other complex life forms, much of it takes place in the Asteroid belt , I do feel it could be readily adapted with minimal changes.. other than the nifty '50s spaceship designs..

 

[Warped9]

off all of Heinlein's juveniles, perhaps the best one that could be translated into the modern era would be "The Rolling Stones"

a lot of that novel had fantastic orbital mechanics, and minus the Martian "Flat Cats" and other complex life forms, much of it takes place in the Asteroid belt , I do feel it could be readily adapted with minimal changes.. other than the nifty '50s spaceship designs..

I've never actually read that. Maybe I should check it out.

 

[Atolm]

If TOS had been done in the '40s maybe this is what the Enterprisre might have looked like.

Or something like this

 

[Warped9]

A strange object in the sky.




Racing to intercept.




I admit I've been trying to imagine how this design could be adapted as a design for TOS. An alien shuttlecraft maybe. Something.

I wonder what ever happened to the fullsize mockup.

 

[Warped9]

Returning home.

 

[MANT!]

Yes, New York, 1980...Where everyone has a number instead of a name..
1st showing of what became Professor Zarkov's rocket actually was a Sci-Fi Musical called "Just Imagine" in 1930..

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Film is in the public domain..the rocket first appears about 1 hr 4 minutes in..

Also, one of the original filming models was up for auction on ebay...sold for $250,000.00

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-ORIGIN...SHIP-vintage-scifi-Just-Imagine-/310668324539

 

[Warped9]

A truly weird film.

 

[MANT!]

Agreed, but the 1980 New York models are very good and well shot..
the rocketship makes short appearances but is futuristic from a 1930 point of view (the most advanced airplanes
in the world were actually racing planes)

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The fireworks sound used in Just Imagine is justifiably (IMHO) replaced with some sort of electric dynamo sound in the Flash Gordon serials..

 

[Redfern]

I skimmed parts of "Just Imagine" and I noticed an odd thing (beyond the narrative and performances). The backgrounds in some shots would occasionally sway and pitch, but the actors oddly enough, remained centered. I wonder if during some digital transfer, someone used software to "focus" upon the performers. I've seen something similar upon these very boards. A member applied that technique to a "ship rocking" sequence from classic Trek. After being processed, the bridge set was rock steady and we see how Shatner and the rest throw themselves in one direction, while Nichelle Nichols stumbles in the opposite direction, towards the turbolift alcove. Anyway, it looks like that video editing tool was applied here.

 

[MANT!]

Yeah, I wonder why?

 

[Warped9]

The return.

 

[Warped9]

Using Klaatu's ship from 19651's The Day The Earth Stood Still as conceptual inspiration I've tried fashioning an adaptation of the design as a TOS era alien ship.



It's about 10-11 decks thick and approximately the size of the TOS E's main hull.