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Legion season 1 (new X-Men related tv show)

Set Harth said:
It feels like this last episode left us in more or less the same place the last one did.
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I noticed that, too. I'm not looking forward to mystery being milked and dragged out in any way, so I hope to get answers Really Soon, but right now, I'm still enjoying things. For comparison, regarding Mr. Robot (for courtesy, I'm putting my specific discussion of both seasons of that show in the spoiler tag, although season one is now over a year old):

Mr. Robot managed to keep from explicitly revealing the truth about what we were seeing basically for an entire season, in two different cases. For the first season, it was the fact that Mr. Robot, the character, exists entirely in Elliot's head. For the second season, it was the fact that Elliot was actually in prison instead of walking around free. Other reveals have also been kept hidden for extended periods, such as the fact that Darlene is actually Elliot's sister and what Stage 2 is intended to be.

In my opinion, Mr. Robot has managed to deal with extended unreality masterfully. Not everything is always imaginary and existing solely in Elliot's head. The '80's sitcom that Elliot experienced is a notable exception, but in that case it was so unreal that it was obvious that that part was all in Elliot's head. Reveals never happened Really Soon, but the show held my interest and I cared about the characters and situations even while it was clear that we didn't know for sure all that was going on.

If Legion is going the same route of having elements and people that aren't real in the sense that they have been created out of David's mind, then a high bar for comparison has, in my view, been set by Mr. Robot.
 
Well that whole Cary and Kerry business was certainly interesting. As was Oliver. And then there was Lenny and Benny. And that little hint there at the end seemed to indicate that Lenny might actually be a threat.

Anyone else get a huge Scooby Doo vibe when she walked into her office and saw a diver ghost? That was the first thing that popped into my mind. Heck, we even got a lighthouse at the end.

Okay, so what's with The Eye? He somehow replaced the doctor? Is his power similar to Syd's?

I would approve if Jermaine Clement was a permanent fixture on the astral plane.
 
Man, with each passing episode, I'm loving this show more and more.

In a continuation of strange stylings of other works like Wes Anderson, The Lobster, Stranger Things, and Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, this episode reminds me of Lemony Snicket and Pushing Daisies (the lighthouse in particular felt like it could have been from either).

While it might be offputting to the average viewer, I'm loving the more ethereal and cerebral aesthetics of the show. David's journey through the astral plane was especially intriguing as well as were his visits with Oliver and Lenny.

I'm also loving a certain trend about all of the mutants on this show: Their powers all have some kind of connection with the mind. I'm not entirely clear what's going on with Cary and Kerry, but seems to me that Kerry initially existed in Cary's mind and now has the ability to project beyond Cary's body and take her own form, while still being directly connected with him.

kitik said:
Well that whole Cary and Kerry business was certainly interesting. As was Oliver. And then there was Lenny and Benny. And that little hint there at the end seemed to indicate that Lenny might actually be a threat.
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I had begun to suspect in the last episode whether or not Lenny was malevolent or even another form of the Devil with the Yellow Eyes. That final shot seems to confirm it as well as Benny being separate from Lenny.

That leaves some lingering questions: Who did Syd accidentally kill in Clockworks? Was it Benny, and if so, why did he look like Lenny to Syd? Misled because of the connection she made with David? Or perhaps Syd only imagined killing Lenny and it didn't actually happen in the real world?

kitik said:
Anyone else get a huge Scooby Doo vibe when she walked into her office and saw a diver ghost? That was the first thing that popped into my mind. Heck, we even got a lighthouse at the end.
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Ha, I didn't think of that but now it seems so obvious now. :lol:

kitik said:
Okay, so what's with The Eye? He somehow replaced the doctor? Is his power similar to Syd's?
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I don't think it's that. I think has some kind of mental illusion power.
 
Felt like we got some good movement on the plot in this one. Some stuff slowly peeled back, but lots of new questions.

Lenny is David's "monster", as Oliver called it. But has she always been an avatar for the "parasite?" The reveal with the imaginary dog seems to suggest something that has always taken a form that David would trust and bond with. So has she always been a fake, a fictional friend, overwritten over Benny to deepen their bond? Or was Lenny a real girl in Clockworks, and the monster is only now taking her form, for convenience, though with the same memory overwrites? The former seems more likely, doesn't it?

I'm increasingly curious about The Eye as well. Any thoughts on his power so far? He seems able to move between people almost like the Agents from The Matrix. And he's bulletproof? Or intangible in some way? His power could be entirely psychic in nature, but Syd could swap bodies with him, which at least suggests a physical form.

Really liking this show. The astral plane imagery, with Oliver's apartment, for lack of a better word, was really well done. Wonder if they were intentionally riffing on Austin Powers with the frozen in time sixties elements.

Can't wait for next week!
 
Emh said:
I'm also loving a certain trend about all of the mutants on this show: Their powers all have some kind of connection with the mind.
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Well, technically not all of them. There was that guy who was flinging people away with "the Force" ( to put it in SW terms ), for example.
 
Ah, good point. I had forgotten about that character. Still, it works for all of the main characters.
 
Come to think of it, you would think Melanie would have sent him with Syd and the others as protection. She knew The Eye was hunting them.
 
Captain No-Name was pretty much their most powerful guy, so he may be off on other missions right now.

Anyone else like that sign from the end that they crashed into?
"Slow Down: Uncertainty Ahead"

Uncertainty ahead? What do you call the 4 episodes we just watched?
 
I'm pretty convinced that the Devil with Yellow Eyes is one of the Spineless Ones. The other-dimensional race that Mojo belongs to. It looks like Mojo without all of the cybernetics. If David killed it and absorbed/subsumed it's persona just like he/Syd did to Lenny, then the cybernetics wouldn't be a part of it's mental image. It had to "grow" legs in Chapter 1. It's body and head are bloated and it's arms an legs are atrophied. With David talking about seeing another world (and not the Astral plane that he was just in), that other world could be the Mojoverse.
 
I just knew they weren't going to treat the end of the last episode like it was a cliffhanger. So what happened there? Why didn't Walter shoot anyone else? Did he only have the one bullet? Was there more teleportation involved?

Captain No-Name is back, finally!

So Oliver's been in the astral plane for about 21 years? Does that place the show at around 1990 or something? :shrug:
 
I knew the moment David strummed the banjo he was going to sing "The Rainbow Connection." :D

Talk about a twist of an ending. I bet David created this false existence with everyone inside as a means to defend themselves from The Devil with the Yellow Eyes, to the point that he makes everyone forget who they are and believe they're actually patients at Clockworks. Although it is curious that Amy wasn't present in the circle and instead there was a patient that we saw in the first episode (credited as "The Man In All His Clothes").

This episode went full on horror and the good kind, too. The aftermath of the assault on Division 3, the walk through David's childhood home with no sound, Lenny belittling Amy, and The Devil with the Yellow Eyes chasing Syd. Aesthetically, I felt like we walked into Stanley Kubrick's playpen, between A Space Odyssey, A Clockwork, and The Shining stylings. Hell, there was even a reference to "Singing in the Rain" at end of the episode.

I like how the episode subverted the "You have a secret" troupe, making us think Amy had some dark secret, perhaps that she might have a mutant power. Instead the secret was more mundane: David is adopted. That help explain why David's father didn't look like James McAvoy or Patrick Stewart. ;)

I know it's coincidental, but when we first saw the red glow in David's mind palace, it looked purple and I couldn't help but think of the Purple Man from Jessica Jones.

More talk about The Devil with the Yellow Eyes as a parasite. We also got another glimpse at David's telescope, this time in his mind palace, which makes me think that my theory that it came from the stars is true.
 
If Oliver was lost 21 years ago, how come he's stuck in the '60s? It hadn't occurred to me before, but is this show set in the past? Have we seen anyone use a mobile phone or a laptop? The psychiatrist was using a reel-to-reel tape deck -- that's very pre-millennium. The computers and such that we've seen tend to have retro or odd-looking screens. It's late enough that MRIs exist, so it's have to be no earlier than the '80s -- and David's familiarity with the 1979 song "The Rainbow Connection" bears that out.

And yet Oliver has heard of karaoke, which didn't come into widespread use until the '90s.


Shawnster said:
I missed how Carey and Kerry can exist separately. How was that explained.
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They're basically a cross between conjoined twins and Jamie Madrox -- two separate people sharing a body but able to physically separate. As I understand Kerry's explanation, her Native American parents conceived her, but the white male Cary was born instead, which led her/his father to assume his wife had had an affair, so he left her. Eight years later, Cary awoke to discover 8-year-old Kerry playing with his trains. He eventually figured out that she lived inside him. And she only ages when she's outside of him, which is why he's so much older than she is -- although there's a logic error there, because if that were the case, how come they were the same age at 8 if that was her first emergence?


Emh said:
I knew the moment David strummed the banjo he was going to sing "The Rainbow Connection." :D
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The opening notes are unmistakeable, though he mangled the timing.


Hell, there was even a reference to "Singing in the Rain" at end of the episode.
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What was it?
 
Christopher said:
If Oliver was lost 21 years ago, how come he's stuck in the '60s? It hadn't occurred to me before, but is this show set in the past? Have we seen anyone use a mobile phone or a laptop? The psychiatrist was using a reel-to-reel tape deck -- that's very pre-millennium. The computers and such that we've seen tend to have retro or odd-looking screens. It's late enough that MRIs exist, so it's have to be no earlier than the '80s -- and David's familiarity with the 1979 song "The Rainbow Connection" bears that out.

And yet Oliver has heard of karaoke, which didn't come into widespread use until the '90s.
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I've been assuming 70s/80s based on the attire, technology (particularly the cars), and music.

Christopher said:
Emh said:
Hell, there was even a reference to "Singing in the Rain" at end of the episode.
What was it?
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At the end, during the therapy circle, the PA announcement: "Hello, everyone! Tonight's movie is Singin' in the Rain."
 
Emh said:
At the end, during the therapy circle, the PA announcement: "Hello, everyone! Tonight's movie is Singin' in the Rain."
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Oh. When I hear "a reference to X," I assume it means an allusion or homage to something in it -- like how David playing the banjo and singing "The Rainbow Connection" is a reference to The Muppet Movie (although he totally mangled the timing and didn't get the melody quite right either).
 
Normally I can engage and either agree with or nit-pick other members theories about shows. This show, though, is just so absolutely crazy that I can't. Anyone's ideas and theories so far seem quite possible.

I found this interesting on Wiki:
In 1991 Legion was assigned to be a co-starring character in the newly revamped X-Factor, as a member of the eponymous superteam. However, writer Peter David was uncomfortable with this, and ultimately editor Bob Harras independently came to the conclusion that Legion should not be used in the series. David explained, "I don't mind building a story around [Legion], but working him into a group - you're really asking for a bit much from the reader. Believing that a group of people will come together to form a team is enough of a suspension of disbelief... 'Oh, by the way, one of them is so nuts he shouldn't be setting foot off Muir Island'... that's asking the reader to bend so far he will break."[1]
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So, in the 90s it was deemed uncomfortable or impossible or whatever to use Legion in a series and now, 20+ years later the exact opposite has happened - Legion is the lead in a regular series on TV which (as a medium) has a much broader audience than the original comics.
 
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