CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar
- Thread starter Richard Baker
- Start date
- Status
I tend to agree that letting one fan film divert most of a million of fan money into a commercial resource will come back to bite the studios someday when others try to work it on some other property. But the studios did stop a possible collateral attempt by the law firm to blast a barn door out of fair use boundaries. And they probably did put some fear of lawsuit into crowdfunding sites as to the conduct of their clients.
Other than Star Wars, I'm not aware of other video properties that have created a large carve out for fan films. So the premise that there is legal space to build a studio off of fan donations is probably less viable for most properties. But the example is now there. I would be surprised if it isn't tried again somewhere in the world.
Other than Star Wars, I'm not aware of other video properties that have created a large carve out for fan films. So the premise that there is legal space to build a studio off of fan donations is probably less viable for most properties. But the example is now there. I would be surprised if it isn't tried again somewhere in the world.
Last edited:
I am going to be surprised if Peters is sued by any donor. Like, really surprised. I think most who are upset are just going to walk away, thinking, "lesson learned."
Which... yeah, hopefully, lesson learned.
Which... yeah, hopefully, lesson learned.
BTW - I'd say the following to Axanar donors and former donors:
I believe one of the terms of the settlement is that Alec Peters cannot publically ask for further donations. However if he e-mails you as a donor (or former donor) mentioning or asking about a "private' donation; if you're of a mind, you may want to forward that e-mail to CBS and let them know Alec Peters mentioned the idea of a "private" monetary donation to Axanar .
Why? Well, if Alec Peters' e-mailed 14,000+ people in a similar fashion (what he claims is the Axanar film support base) - A lawyer/judge might indeed see that as publically asking for a 'donation'. <--- And that would be against the terms of the settlement were a Judge to see it that way.
I believe one of the terms of the settlement is that Alec Peters cannot publically ask for further donations. However if he e-mails you as a donor (or former donor) mentioning or asking about a "private' donation; if you're of a mind, you may want to forward that e-mail to CBS and let them know Alec Peters mentioned the idea of a "private" monetary donation to Axanar .
Why? Well, if Alec Peters' e-mailed 14,000+ people in a similar fashion (what he claims is the Axanar film support base) - A lawyer/judge might indeed see that as publically asking for a 'donation'. <--- And that would be against the terms of the settlement were a Judge to see it that way.
Are exact terms available? I thought the restriction was being reported as just can't use crowdfunding, not your wording...
From the Axanar letter to donors:
Yes, he specifically mentions no more Kickstarter or Indegogo - BUT again, just making an announcement asking for funds (whether or not you use a Crowdfunding service or not) to a large group of people could legally be considered "Publically fundraising..." and 12000 - 14000 IMO is a sizeable amount of "the public" which was a point Alec Peters tried to make when defending his desire to make "Axanar".
Guess we will see. Those are his words, who knows. Assume studios knew he had a list and his attorneys advised him on whether he could use it under the terms. They probably negotiated the terms to have as much wiggle room as possible.
If he mailed in any way to the KS/IGG people who did not donate otherwise, I wonder if that would constitute using the crowdfunding path again, and be subject to the 50k limit per segment (or any "no more crowdfunding for this project" restriction, which is what I thought it was), even if the donations wouldn't go through KS/IGG this time.
The studios might want to clarify. Clearly, reusing crowdfunding donor lists could be a loophole in their intention to control fundraising by this channel, if they had this intention. A fan film team could easily tell donors donate once by KS/IGG and we will shift you to the private unrestricted list for our next project, so we can build another 100k in new restricted donations atop prior donors for each new project.
I suppose this could be looked at as good or bad from either side.
After a few rounds of productions, it certainly seems it could effectively defeat the studios' attempt to limit the scale of money obtained from "public" solicitation, by the interpretation you suggest.
Last edited:
Short answer to your question, as I understand it, is that the guidelines specifically prohibit carrying a story (and perhaps effectively characters too) across from one 30-minute work to the next:
"1. The fan production must be less than 15 minutes for a single self-contained story, or no more than 2 segments, episodes or parts, not to exceed 30 minutes total, with no additional seasons, episodes, parts, sequels or remakes."
Yep - it's basically you can tell one self contained story in a total of two 15 minute segments - for a combined total of 30 minutes maximum.
Or as many a Star Trek fan film producer might say to Alec Peters:
Whilst Peters, Burnett, McIntosh, Kingsbury and the rest will never again know what it's like to take over a million dollars of other peoples money and then spend it on themselves there does still appear to be a massive appetite from fans to hand over cash to Axanar. There are people on the various Facebook groups who read like living 'Shut Up And Take My Money' memes.
Like I said, I can't see them hitting a million dollars but I think we might be surprised at just how much money they do get given.
If any of you Axanar fans do end up browsing these comments and you are fortunate enough to have that kind of disposable income please consider giving it to a charity instead and do some good. These guys had the money once and blew it, literally and metaphorically, please don't give it to them again.
Like I said, I can't see them hitting a million dollars but I think we might be surprised at just how much money they do get given.
If any of you Axanar fans do end up browsing these comments and you are fortunate enough to have that kind of disposable income please consider giving it to a charity instead and do some good. These guys had the money once and blew it, literally and metaphorically, please don't give it to them again.
I hope so. I've thoroughly enjoyed sticking with this thread and all the 'fustercluckery' LFIM & Co. have stirred up over the past year. I've learned a lot of legal stuff, seen some good memes and been part of some entertaining twists and turns here. May this thread........
(as is said on the G&T show.....lol)
Oh - here's a little something from our friend Charles Britto I'll leave you with............
"...and can no longer making money..." "..haters and liers..."
We're not exactly dealing with the top end of the food chain here, are we?
Of course, there will be more Alec Peters stories to talk about in the future. What do people expect him to do? Get a regular job and fade into the background? Never going to happen.
We're not exactly dealing with the top end of the food chain here, are we?
Of course, there will be more Alec Peters stories to talk about in the future. What do people expect him to do? Get a regular job and fade into the background? Never going to happen.
You/They are Fake News!
"Everything they said about Alec Peters and Axanar was wrong."
Yeah, except we did say the case was likely to settle. And that Lane and Watkins were unlikely to be allowed as witnesses. And that Van Citters likely would be allowed as a witness. And that donors would eventually start getting angry. And ....
Yeah, except we did say the case was likely to settle. And that Lane and Watkins were unlikely to be allowed as witnesses. And that Van Citters likely would be allowed as a witness. And that donors would eventually start getting angry. And ....
They will though. Sing with me "Sheepul, Sheepul who need Sheepul, are the most gullible sheepul in the world"
Last edited:
Page 1400!!! We made it!! 
1701 would be better
This is exactly why Axanar is such a failure.
Axanar tolerates and perhaps encourages the misleading of their donors.
Alec was not "proved right".
*His* assertion was that he could start a "professional independent Trek" company not bound by any licensing or other copyright considerations, and make a full movie, sell unlicensed merchandise, and raise unlimited funds within the boundaries of his theory of "fair use" of Trek.
He got restrictive guidelines imposed on everyone, and he was forced to roll back his project to those guidelines, as well as admit in public that he violated copyright. He got a precedent set that his theory of "fair use" was utterly rejected on all counts in Federal court.
He used up a year of Trek money at the studio and a year of pro bono representation and a year of taxpayer-funded Federal court resources achieving exactly nothing except his complete loss of his premise. He provoked the disclosure of many financing and management details which ruined his reputation and his hopes of having a place at the Hollywood table. And he earned an epithet from Wesley.
The fact that CBS/P did not go ahead and leave a crater where he stood may feel like a win to him compared to what his ridiculous defense and abuse of fan money was about to rain down in a risible trial, but that wasn't his victory. It was mercy towards the Axanar donors who, largely innocent of Axanar conduct, had funded a fan film, and toward the broader fan base who didn't need their lives to be polluted with knowledge of how Axanar was conducted.
As for "all the things detractors have said about him are now proved false", non sequitur city. The evidence revealed of misconduct and intent to divert fan money into a private company is still in public, and more records may well find their way out by the time any book is published about it. The settlement is not a concession by CBS/P that anything they asserted was false. Its simply an agreement that if the gross violence over copyright committed by Axanar is sufficiently admitted and repaired by Axanar, and if Axanar accepts limits which prevent it from committing those acts of violence again, the other issues will be left unpursued.
Axanar sitting in silence while this is spun differently is exactly why this group should not be making Trek.
Last edited:
- Status