CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[OtherGene]

Mr prediction is that the completed Axanar will be two fifteen minute chunks of the CGI stuff they already have with Alec Peters voicing the story in the background. It'll probably take an afternoon of his time. Then it'll be YouTubed up and that will be the end of it as far as he's concerned before he starts thinking of his next scam. Did I type 'scam'? I meant 'project'.

 

[Red Shirt]

I've received a few settlements from class action lawsuits, the most generous one I recall was $5 off on my next purchase of Co2.
I'm sure Liquid Air didn't even feel it and the only satisfaction would be seeing Alec dividing his remaining money and sending out penny checks to the donors.

Isn't that from the The Jerk movie with Steve Martin? Funny movie.

 

[Noname Given]

It would be interesting to read that e-mail AP sent to his donors. Does he mention the fair use defense he harped on about for a year didn't fly and all of the unredacted financials were going to be a central focus in court? Probably not. lol. I wouldn't put it past AP to beg for "private donations" which should really piss off more than a few donors.

It was posted earlier upthread by Serveaux:
http://www.trekbbs.com/threads/cbs-paramount-sues-to-stop-axanar.278077/page-1391#post-11892453

 

[Red Shirt]

It was posted earlier upthread by Serveaux:
http://www.trekbbs.com/threads/cbs-paramount-sues-to-stop-axanar.278077/page-1391#post-11892453

Thanks! Having a caffeine deficiency at the moment, forgot it was posted.

 

[Ion]

Wrong, I actually dont wonder about that at all...

And there's your first problem.

but I am not responsible for what you imagine.

What you are responsible for is the way you act, whether you like that fact or not.

You'll note I didn't comment on your opinion of fan films. For that matter, I don't really give a damn about your opinion of fan films. But when you start insulting people (and you are insulting respected individuals here, not just fan films), you're not going to make any friends.

In fact, in less than two posts, you marked yourself as someone I don't want to have even the slightest association with; and that has nothing to do with your opinion that fan films are "shit".

Words have consequences. Using them carelessly is not a wise choice if you want to have the people around you give you the time of day, let alone any respect.

Take that as you will; I expect that you'll probably ignore it and go on acting like a petulant five year old who spent his allowance on Axanar and wants people to acknowledge your perceived vindication. Newsflash: you're not going to get that here.

For my part, I'm done with you; if I could be bothered, I'd go find the ignore feature on this thing, 'cause you've shown yourself to be worth far less time than I've already spent on you.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Right, you never had an "agenda" against Carlosp & Co, you just went out of your way being a snot to Carlosp, Oswriter and Ion as quoted above. You're as full of b.s. as LFIM is.

I'm not here to blow smoke up peoples' arses. I am part of no clique. I say what I see, and I am not here to win "likes". It seems that you and others are too busy engaging in the circle jerk to say anything that might make you unpopular. Nobody is beyond question.

And seriously, you went digging through old posts? Jesus wept.

 

[carlosp]

Aw, thanks @Daddy Todd !

@carlosp we could go on tour together!

Think of all the pie we could share!

 

[Red Shirt]

I'm not here to blow smoke up peoples' arses. I am part of no clique. I say what I see, and I am not here to win "likes". It seems that you and others are too busy engaging in the circle jerk to say anything that might make you unpopular. Nobody is beyond question.

And seriously, you went digging through old posts? Jesus wept.

I see, quoting your past posts senselessly using straw men going after respected people on this thread is inappropriate due to no one is beyond question ... you being the exception of course. Wonderful double standard fail logic. You're beating a dead horse now.

 

[Red Shirt]

Think of all the pie we could share!

Will there be cupgrades?

 

[nightwind1]

Am I the only one that thinks "Prelude to Axanar" was a poorly-written, half-assed greenscreen hackjob? Why do Axanar fans drool all over it like it's the second coming of GR?

 

[jamestyler]

I ended up talking to a friend about this last night (not surprisingly, the one I quoted!) and to be honest.... this isn't the worst option. It's safe to say whatever damage would have been done to Alec Peters after the lawsuit has already happened. Now it's a case of do or die and I'm curious to see what the next steps will be.

I wanted to see this go to trial because of the financials. From this was either the most ridiculous waste of money by someone who wouldn't admit to being clueless (which I've seen many times before), or it was a guy thinking he could live lifestyle and get away with it - which I genuinely think to be the case; he raised that much, I'm sure his ego thought he could keep that going for as long as it took to be a real producer. "Oh, I'll spend this as I'll make it back in other donations." I've seen it happen. Not to this massive degree, but it's easy to think that way.

We'll likely never know whats in those documents; but at this stage I'm not sure it matters. The reputation has been gained. the studio's a washout. There's not going to be a second chance and if he really is the big bad con man or just an over ambitious fool, we'll know that with his next project, whatever that will be.

CBS forced Axanar into a corner and got what they wanted; just another fan film, by their rules, their guidelines and they call the shots. In doing that they've lost.... well, nothing really. The only thing they've lost out on is the ability to embarrass someone really.

Axanar got what it was supposed to to: Make a film. Not as epic as they wanted, but they can now put their money where their mouth. But they have to do it after burning too many bridges, with less resource and trust than they had before and with a reputation that could guarantee a blacklist for them professionally.

The only people to lose out are those who donated money. Thats $1.4 Million that will now never be accounted for, spent, gone, disappeared into a black hole of new carpets and weird expenses. The damage has been done there - Peter's will never get to be the producer he wants to be, and the 'studio' will be on the naughty list (and not even up to code to film anything anyway!). That's up to the donors to decide what happens next for their lost money and empty promises.

There'll be more bluster, shouting, spinning and general nonsense that'll give everyone a headache. Now I'm just curious if it'll ever amount to anything. Now nothings in the way to make the film, will it ever happen?

 

[ThankYouGeneR]

Am I the only one that thinks "Prelude to Axanar" was a poorly-written, half-assed greenscreen hackjob? Why do Axanar fans drool all over it like it's the second coming of GR?

Huh uh. You're not. I know (online if that is to know) a couple of others who do not care for it enough to care about it and a couple who just plain old don't like it.

Myself, I lean towards the liking it a lot. I liked the talking heads thing quite a bit. It made it, I mean for me, it made it seem comfortable or casual.... I dunno. Something like that. I reallllllly liked J.G. Hertzler's writing and acting as well as Richard Hatch's character, make-up, writing and acting. I was okay with Gary Graham's and liked Kate Vernon's acting a lot but didn't care much at all for her writing. Though 'the' line of hers most often referenced did not phase me at all. For me Tony Todd's character, writing, & acting were stand-out good. Top notch character, top notch writing, top notch acting.

On the other hand when scenes would cut to the cgi war going on I would immediately be pulled out of the story. And cgi stuff is one thing I LOVE BIG TIME about the new movies and TV shows that use it. I absolutely loovvvve cgi spaceship flying and fighting. Great stuff that! That Prelude's cgi was good is not in question as I say this, but for my cgi taste I considered them to be really good gaming quality cgi. Which is really good these days I will absolutely stipulate. But for me personally gaming quality cgi is so far removed movie & TV cgi quality that at each edit cut to that city with the Klingon ships flying and bombing, and the building/sky/people I'd be pulled me out of the story. So it, the cgi, thing being 'brilliant' 'movie like' 'better that any done in Star Trek movies Paramount is making now' that lots of people say.. just leaves me saying nuh uh. Not even in the same ball park.

However, there wasn't 'that' much cgi they used in Prelude so I look at my overall experience of it being I liked it a lot.

But I know some people didn't.

It certainly wasn't major breakthrough or giant leap filming or anything. Or making Star Trek great again (<-a pun). But it, well for me I mean, was something to write home about. And donate several times to.

 

[gazomg]

And there's your first problem.



What you are responsible for is the way you act, whether you like that fact or not.

You'll note I didn't comment on your opinion of fan films. For that matter, I don't really give a damn about your opinion of fan films. But when you start insulting people (and you are insulting respected individuals here, not just fan films), you're not going to make any friends.

In fact, in less than two posts, you marked yourself as someone I don't want to have even the slightest association with; and that has nothing to do with your opinion that fan films are "shit".

Words have consequences. Using them carelessly is not a wise choice if you want to have the people around you give you the time of day, let alone any respect.

Take that as you will; I expect that you'll probably ignore it and go on acting like a petulant five year old who spent his allowance on Axanar and wants people to acknowledge your perceived vindication. Newsflash: you're not going to get that here.

For my part, I'm done with you; if I could be bothered, I'd go find the ignore feature on this thing, 'cause you've shown yourself to be worth far less time than I've already spent on you.

Wow, I seem to have really upset your delicate feelings.
My dislike of almost all fan films does not mean I am blindly a complete fan of Peters and the whole Axanar project.
There is this perception that because I loved Prelude I therefore must be a complete pro Axanar fan who finds no fault with that show. For the record I have zero affiliation with anything to do with Axanar or any trek fan production film
The reality is I now expect any final short film to come out from Axanar to be a complete let down..which after the optimism Prelude gave me, that is now a bad thing.
Speaking as just a fan, my original thought was that the Axanar movie would be a good thing and my expectations were high, the actions of peters is/was a complete separate issue, as is the whole cbs court thing.

Like I have already stated which you seem too hurt to grasp, I have no issue with anyone making anything, and if fans films make those who create them happy, that is wonderful for them, but I have zero interest in them as I have found them all to be a complete waste of my time and to be cringeworthy bad.
Unlike you I am not one who needs praise or acceptance , you can list all my faults as you wish, you can put me on ignore for hurting your feelings, you can do whatever you like but it wont change the reality that fans films for the most part are rubbish to me, and that seems to be the bone of contention that is hurting you.

 

[ThankYouGeneR]

I ended up talking to a friend about this last night (not surprisingly, the one I quoted!)
...............
I wanted to see this go to trial because of the financials.

Oh, man, I would have realllly liked to see them myself. And do wonder if that is the straw that broke the settlement back for the defense.

From this was either the most ridiculous waste of money by someone who wouldn't admit to being clueless (which I've seen many times before), or it was a guy thinking he could live lifestyle and get away with it - which I genuinely think to be the case; he raised that much, I'm sure his ego thought he could keep that going for as long as it took to be a real producer. "Oh, I'll spend this as I'll make it back in other donations." I've seen it happen. Not to this massive degree, but it's easy to think that way.

I not only agree with that, I have been thinking and periodically posting that very thing since early January 2016 which is when I listened to his podcast where he was talking about how they got to the settling in the 30 Mile Zone for thiswholething.

"We talked about going to New Voyages to shoot and the director Christian was like no. It's not good enough. We found a facility out in Victorville. It was cheap and the space was really good. And David Gerrold, everyone said 'This place sucks. You need to get better space.

"And then we raised $650,000, and we're like Oh."

It. Was. The. Money.

That facilitated the continued ease of promoting at the conventions, which brought the adulation. This is like a narcotic rush to just regular people. Dopamine running rampant with the brain's pleasure center.

This effect can double, quadruple, on someone with a marked propensity in seeking the center of attention situations... and that is an urge that begs to be filled and refilled. So with easy money readily available to go again and again to places that afford adulation, then double 'that' if the person is also a clever fellow, somewhat charismatic, with self inflatable confidence and a talent for rationalizing. And we'rrreee off. I'll bet ya this all made perfect sense to him because otherwise he would have listened to the actual filmmaker friends who made Prelude with and mostly in spite of his propensities.

Then he lost their council by being, well, himself. And in the middle of his adulation/dopamine/rationalization/bad bad judgment snow ball effect, surrounding himself with Yes Men that also feeds the adulation/dopamine/brain pleasure center...... Voila! A disaster in place to inevitably happen.

 

[wtriker1701]

When I first saw Prelude to Axanar I was really impressed as every fan film prior was basically shit.
I know the others tried and seems cruel to knock them but it was the truth, with Prelude it really looked good and suspect CBS thought so too , and no surprising CBS for some reason to stop it.

Now it is somewhat resolved what now ?
Even if they make the film, what do we get a 30 minute short instead of a proper length movie.
Maybe have as well just killed it.
No one wins

Well, @gazomg , like a poor marksman your posts kept missing the target:
Prelude was not a fan film. It may have started out as such, but with the Kickstarter campaigns it had evolved to much, much more. And that's what they intended to do with their feature movie, quote: "Axanar is the independent Star Trek film which proves that a feature-quality Star Trek film can be made on a small budget..." (from their Star Trek Axanar Kickstarter campaign).

With most of the crew before and behind of the cameras being industry professionals it wasn't to be a fan film any longer (Prelude to Axanar is what I'm talking about here). So basically you are comparing oranges and apples.

In your opinion (and you are not alone in this) "every fan film prior was basically shit". That's your assessment, but many others here in the fan film section of the TrekBBS (like me) would disagree. In my opinion fan films do lack many things and sometimes even fail to entertain on a basic level, but that's why they are fan films. They have been made out of love for Star Trek and its fictional world.

But Axanar Productions wanted to make a "calling card" for being industry professionals who deliver all the goods for so few dollars. That's not in fan film territory by and large!

Prelude, in my opinion, had also its failures. Mainly putting a non-professional actor (Alec Peters) among all those veterans - and it showed. Man, how it showed. A "sheep among wolves".

And the "movie in question" wouldn't have had the same craftsmanship Prelude had, as many industry professionals "had left the bulding" (or the whateverthename studios). So we'll see now, how the new Axanar will look like, compared to other "real" fan films... should it ever be made.

 

[Captain of the USS Averof]

And we were so close…


…to 1,400 pages!

 

[Phoenix219]

Sorry if its been said, but this thread is too long....

does anyone think that Peters is actually *happy* about this? He doesn't have to make nearly as long a "film" now, and has a great excuse for it ending up more mediocre then expected, and having much less time to fill.... all that complicated movie making stuff, ya know....

 

[Ryan F]

None of the other fan films had anything like the budget Axanar did, not the calibre of actors (Peters' Garth notwithstanding).

But I'd rather see an intelligent, thoughtful script (one that stays true to the Trek ethos) brought to life by amateurs than a bad script (with no moral, no subtext, no meaning, bad dialogue) masked by dazzling CGI and good actors, whose performances are so good, they almost manage to paper over the cracks.

 

[gazomg]

Well, @gazomg , like a poor marksman your posts kept missing the target:
Prelude was not a fan film. It may have started out as such, but with the Kickstarter campaigns it had evolved to much, much more. And that's what they intended to do with their feature movie, quote: "Axanar is the independent Star Trek film which proves that a feature-quality Star Trek film can be made on a small budget..." (from their Star Trek Axanar Kickstarter campaign).

With most of the crew before and behind of the cameras being industry professionals it wasn't to be a fan film any longer (Prelude to Axanar is what I'm talking about here). So basically you are comparing oranges and apples.

In your opinion (and you are not alone in this) "every fan film prior was basically shit". That's your assessment, but many others here in the fan film section of the TrekBBS (like me) would disagree. In my opinion fan films do lack many things and sometimes even fail to entertain on a basic level, but that's why they are fan films. They have been made out of love for Star Trek and its fictional world.

But Axanar Productions wanted to make a "calling card" for being industry professionals who deliver all the goods for so few dollars. That's not in fan film territory by and large!

Prelude, in my opinion, had also its failures. Mainly putting a non-professional actor (Alec Peters) among all those veterans - and it showed. Man, how it showed. A "sheep among wolves".

And the "movie in question" wouldn't have had the same craftsmanship Prelude had, as many industry professionals "had left the bulding" (or the whateverthename studios). So we'll see now, how the new Axanar will look like, compared to other "real" fan films... should it ever be made.

Again I am not defending Axanar nor peters or how things were handled

I am merely saying as independent, fan made or whatever outside of official paramount cbs official trek, prelude to axanar was the only one I genuinely was impressed with and yes it had some flaws.
I dont like the Abrams universe movies either, as that too is my right.
I dont pretend to know exactly what peters did or did not do, and dont care either, I was giving my initial opinion on what I like and wanted to see.

With things the way they are now, any hopes i previously had for axanar (pre court case) are now well and truly gone, and any future projects fucked up as well.
whether Peters is responsible for all that is a separate argument, but people are choosing to ignore this and concentrate on my point of me calling fan films shit, cos that touched a nerve for a lot of sensitive delicate little flowers.

 

[Campe]

Okay, so Alec has permission to make Axanar. For many of the fans, this seems to be amazing news, I'm sure. It doesn't change the fact that he spent $1.4 million and all he has to show for it is 23 minutes of footage, half finished sets and a warehouse that he's trying to pass off as a studio that's hundreds of thousands of dollars to being up to code. He has no money to make the movie and he can only raise money via private donation. Crowdfunding is no longer an option.

Oh yeah, he actually has to, you know, make the movie too. Me? I don't care personally. I was against Alec making this because his relationship with fandom has, frankly, been toxic. But now that he can, it doesn't really affect me. I really can't be bothered to care now as I am a hater and have no accomplishments in my life. Seriously, this wouldn't have affected me one way or another. I just personally hate that Peters is getting to make his passion piece... for now. There are a lot of things that might keep him from that: potential bankruptcy, the IRS, talent.... oh, sorry.

Still, if he can get past all of that... For the supporters' sake, I hope making the movie is something he's up to task for.

I've been relatively quiet here for the past few months but I will say that despite the negativity that this has spawned, I'm happy to have met some amazing people through this. Some of you are the tops for sure!