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fred freiberger : hack or hapless?

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Actually, according to multiple viewpoints of the 50-year mission book, Paramount was the one trying to get out from under this huge expense they inherited when they bought Desilu.
Strictly speaking, Paramount didn't buy Desilu; Gulf+Western did. The conglomerate had acquired Paramount Pictures in 1966. Since the two studios were physically next door to each other, the new parent company simply merged them into a single facility under the Paramount banner.
 
How can anyone despise Sean Connery's James Bond 007? The only time in the franchise that the stories were treated with any type of realism! Diamonds are forever excluded but that's worth it because of the gorgeous Jill St.John!
JB
 
Season 3 was actually rescued from being the total disaster it could have been under FF, I think, by a lot of dedicated and more talented people on Trek, who got a lot of good episodes made despite him. Bad stories will have good scenes and moments inserted which are totally true to the characters, and show interesting aspects of the ship..... It looks as if they had no control over the stories chosen, but once those bad stories were dropped in their laps, they made them watchable and genuine Trek.
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I have no evidence, except the example of season 2 Space:1999, where he seems to have had free reign. Trek s3 actually has greatness in it, of which FF was just not capable.
 
Frieberger followed GR's dictum that "Star Trek was not a comedy" and for that I'm thankful. He didn't seem to care much fir David Gerrold so there is that.

Overall S3 seems more similar to S1 in overall tone and that certainly isn't a bad thing.
 
I have no evidence, except the example of season 2 Space:1999, where he seems to have had free reign. Trek s3 actually has greatness in it, of which FF was just not capable.

You can't hold him responsible for what went wrong, without also giving him credit for what went right. During season three, it was his show. Everything about it was ultimately his responsibility.

I think people treat season three far more harshly than it deserves. It didn't quite hit the heights of seasons one and two, not too many TV shows do, but it is entertaining.
 
Freiberger did spoil a lot of things about Space 1999 it's true to say but he did end the show with a great row of episodes! The cerebral first series did degenerate into a rubber monster of the week type of show when he came on board and he did screw up the timeline of the series it has to be said! His tenure on TOS also had it's good and bad moments but he did give us Enterprise Incident, Day of The Dove and The Tholian Web didn't he!
JB
 
Unless there had been a miraculous turnaround in ratings during the third season I don't think it would have mattered who was producing. NBC was out to get rid of TOS when the third season was done.

And the loss of Justman and Fontana as well as Coon earlier simply hampered the show. Even GR's absence hurt the show.

Things were stacked against Frieberger so I think he has been judged unfairly.
Agreed. Season 3 was doomed before it even got going. And no, all of season 3 is not bad. It's still Star Trek but the team that did the first 2 seasons was gone specifically the main story editor and the producer. The only way to recover from that is to have equal talent replace them. Fred was not the guy and by then the production was such a downer for the crew that they kind of just let it die. It's hard for us to fathom now but Trek was just a show then. It was still a couple years away from becoming a phenomenon.
 
Freiberger did spoil a lot of things about Space 1999 it's true to say but he did end the show with a great row of episodes! The cerebral first series did degenerate into a rubber monster of the week type of show when he came on board and he did screw up the timeline of the series it has to be said! His tenure on TOS also had it's good and bad moments but he did give us Enterprise Incident, Day of The Dove and The Tholian Web didn't he!
JB
S1 has bumps here and there but it was never rubber monster of the week. In fact some of the best and most thought-provoking episodes were in the second half. The show was a little British and talky for the American viewers but Gerry wasn't under orders to re-tool or make drastic changes. It was selling well enough to warrant a second series which said a lot since ITC (American distribution) loved UFO at first too and green lit a second series with a bigger budget (which is the only reason why space 1999 exists) until the show got deeper and less action oriented, they reneged. S1999 despite its huge production cost coasted into a second series renewal comparatively speaking. FF didn't like scifi so he changed it into a bad lost in space.
 
It's a business no matter how much they might like a show. But the simple fact is that if you exile a show to Fridays at 10pm back in those days you were sending it to the graveyard. Thats the same as being out to get rid of it.

Again, though, that's assuming the decision was exclusively about Star Trek itself, independent of any other factor. That's not the way television programming works. The network executives had to consider dozens of different shows and weigh their interests against each other. They had to figure out a whole schedule, some 23 hours' worth of prime-time programming, more than two dozen shows that had to be juggled and arranged in the best possible pattern. Moreover, they had to keep the other two networks' schedules in mind and counterprogram against them. So Star Trek was just one of more than 80 variables that they had to weigh against each other.

In this case, the plan to move Star Trek to Mondays fell through because the producers of Laugh-In objected. Laugh-In was a far more successful show than ST, and NBC couldn't afford to antagonize its producers. So the decision to bump ST was more about Laugh-In than it was about ST itself. Sure, maybe they could've moved some other show to make room for ST, but look at the link above and see how many top-30 shows were in its lineup. They had to make those producers happy, and the less profitable shows had to come second in importance. That's not a petty vendetta against any single show, it's the kind of hard decision that has to be made by any responsible person who has to weigh conflicting priorities.



Actually, according to multiple viewpoints of the 50-year mission book, Paramount was the one trying to get out from under this huge expense they inherited when they bought Desilu. Solow wouldn't know because he was Desilu and not on the lot anymore after some point in the 2nd season when Paramount took charge of production. The Desilu money men wanted to jump ship too after season 1, but Lucy herself renewed production, and it cost her the company. She was forced to sell mid-season 2. Enter Paramount. The show cost too much, Gene didn't bow to their will. Desilu tolerated his artistry where Paramount did not. One of the quotes was that it was clear to many people that Paramount did not want to be in business with Gene anymore.

Okay, that I can buy. It makes more sense that Gulf + Western/Paramount would want to get rid of the show than that NBC would, since new owners often shut down their predecessors' projects in order to develop their own.


They also are believed to have held Gene personally responsible for the letter-writing campaign that saved the show, that he used his influence with the fans.

I'm not convinced the letter campaign "saved" anything. That's the conventional wisdom, but there's no proof that NBC was ever actually going to cancel ST in the first place. All we really know is that it was "on the bubble," neither renewed nor cancelled yet. Per Inside Star Trek, the meaning of the NBC renewal announcement wasn't really "Okay, you win, we've changed our minds about cancelling the show" -- rather, it was just, "Hey, guys, we're not actually cancelling the show, so please stop overloading our mail department for no reason."

Anyone who doubts the hack he is simply needs to compare Space:1999 series 1 and 2. Watch the interviews from the series where he talks about the changes and lightening things up, etc. He's a second string TV producer. Harve Bennett without the talent. He should never have been allowed near Trek.

I'm certainly not saying Freiberger was a good writer or producer. But no one is entirely without merits. ST season 3 isn't nearly as well-written overall as seasons 1 or 2, but it's arguably less sexist than previous seasons and less prone to basing aliens on Orientalist/tribal stereotypes, and it arguably reverses season 2's trend of solving more problems with violence than with positive moral examples. So for all that there are things about season 3 that deserve criticism, it does have saving graces that I think are overlooked -- and season 2 has faults that I think are overlooked.


I have what seems to be an utterly contrarian view of the two seasons of Space: 1999. Probably because I started with the second season. But quite frankly, I found the first season to be reminiscent of (and only slightly less unwatchable than) The Starlost (which is to say, I got through most of Space: 1999's first season; I got through about 15-20 minutes of one episode of The Starlost).

I figured out that the way to approach season 1 of Space: 1999 is as a work of surrealist, existentialist fantasy. It's sort of in the vein of Stanislaw Lem's Solaris, in that it embraces the idea that the universe is endlessly bizarre and unknowable and our human constructs of knowledge and perception are inadequate to define or cope with it. There's a lot of Twilight Zone in it too, those episodes where strange and impossible things happen to people who probe the frontiers beyond existing knowledge.


Then again, I didn't care for Bain and Landau in Mission: Impossible, either (their characters seemed to have a sadistic streak), and thought it was a better show in the Linda Day George years, or the Leonard Nimoy years, or the Lesley Ann Warren years.

There was only one Lesley (Ann) Warren year, specifically Nimoy's second year. That was the fifth season, which was my personal favorite, with the richest writing and characterization and the greatest tendency to depart from the usual formula where missions unfolded like clockwork.

Landau and Bain never really had much characterization of their own, outside of the first season. Bruce Geller's ideal was to have the lead characters be virtual ciphers, their own personalities completely subsumed beneath their identities of the week. Part of the reason seasons 1 and 5 are my favorites is because they're the greatest departures from that, the ones that give the regulars more personality of their own. (Also the first half of season 2 of the '80s revival series, though it really crashes in quality toward the end.)
 
Now I'm curious. NBC cancelled TOS and obviously replaced it with a series that the executives thought would be successful and profitable. Does anyone know what show succeeded TOS and how it performed? To paraphrase Mr. DeSalle, "I'll bet you credits to navy beans that the replacement series didn't remain on the air as long as TOS".
 
Now I'm curious. NBC cancelled TOS and obviously replaced it with a series that the executives thought would be successful and profitable. Does anyone know what show succeeded TOS and how it performed? To paraphrase Mr. DeSalle, "I'll bet you credits to navy beans that the replacement series didn't remain on the air as long as TOS".

During the 1969-70 broadcast season, NBC aired what I gather was a semi-anthology series called Bracken's World in the 10-11pm timeslot on Friday nights. That series remained in that timeslot during the first half of the 1970-71 broadcast season, after which it was cancelled and replaced by a British import called Strange Report, which only lasted 16 episodes. (Honest question -- did any of the ITC imports to the United States in the 1960s last on American network television?)

If you're talking about the 8:30-9:30pm Friday night timeslot, which Star Trek occupied during the 1967-68 broadcast season, it was succeeded by The Name of The Game, which occupied that timeslot (and a little more, since it was a longer show) for three seasons.
 
During the 1969-70 broadcast season, NBC aired what I gather was a semi-anthology series called Bracken's World in the 10-11pm timeslot on Friday nights. That series remained in that timeslot during the first half of the 1970-71 broadcast season, after which it was cancelled and replaced by a British import called Strange Report, which only lasted 16 episodes. (Honest question -- did any of the ITC imports to the United States in the 1960s last on American network television?)

If you're talking about the 8:30-9:30pm Friday night timeslot, which Star Trek occupied during the 1967-68 broadcast season, it was succeeded by The Name of The Game, which occupied that timeslot (and a little more, since it was a longer show) for three seasons.

Thanks for the info. I'm sending you a half empty bottle of Saurian Brandy. It was full up until last night. **hiccup**
:beer:
 
Again, though, that's assuming the decision was exclusively about Star Trek itself, independent of any other factor. That's not the way television programming works. The network executives had to consider dozens of different shows and weigh their interests against each other. They had to figure out a whole schedule, some 23 hours' worth of prime-time programming, more than two dozen shows that had to be juggled and arranged in the best possible pattern. Moreover, they had to keep the other two networks' schedules in mind and counterprogram against them. So Star Trek was just one of more than 80 variables that they had to weigh against each other.

In this case, the plan to move Star Trek to Mondays fell through because the producers of Laugh-In objected. Laugh-In was a far more successful show than ST, and NBC couldn't afford to antagonize its producers. So the decision to bump ST was more about Laugh-In than it was about ST itself. Sure, maybe they could've moved some other show to make room for ST, but look at the link above and see how many top-30 shows were in its lineup. They had to make those producers happy, and the less profitable shows had to come second in importance. That's not a petty vendetta against any single show, it's the kind of hard decision that has to be made by any responsible person who has to weigh conflicting priorities.
Correct. In terms of the history of TV production, Trek is the one scifi show where the network wasn't the villain, but the production company. It fascinates me how Trek broke new ground everywhere, not just in front of the camera.





Okay, that I can buy. It makes more sense that Gulf + Western/Paramount would want to get rid of the show than that NBC would, since new owners often shut down their predecessors' projects in order to develop their own.
I doubt creating their own shows had anything to do with it. That implies they might have spent similar money and taken similar risk if it was their own creation. History shows us that was not the case. No, they owned Trek after the sale. And their reasons beyond disliking Gene (and he earned their contempt, they weren't just picking on him) were the same as they are today when it comes to an expensive production that is not a runaway hit. Profit margin. Star Trek started with the little production company that could, Desilu, and that's who we really owe our respect, after Gene. Herb Solow, and queen herself. I can honestly say I really love Lucy. The fact that Desilu died keeping Trek alive seems to me worth quite a bit historically. Paramount stepped in *it, wiped if off their wingtips in disgust and then years later jumped on the Trek bandwagon. They weren't evil, they were a BIG company. Big companies by nature concern themselves with money first, not art. And it should be noted that after Paramount GOT Trek, they have spent decades supporting it.



I'm not convinced the letter campaign "saved" anything. That's the conventional wisdom, but there's no proof that NBC was ever actually going to cancel ST in the first place. All we really know is that it was "on the bubble," neither renewed nor cancelled yet. Per Inside Star Trek, the meaning of the NBC renewal announcement wasn't really "Okay, you win, we've changed our minds about cancelling the show" -- rather, it was just, "Hey, guys, we're not actually cancelling the show, so please stop overloading our mail department for no reason."
It didn't save the show. It quickened it. The campaign brought critical embarrassment to both Paramount and NBC. Companies that are supposed to make shows we like were exposed as not knowing at all what we like. It was a slap in the corporate face. The proof is the unprecedented tv announcement that NBC ran stating Trek was renewed for s3, not canceled as was widespread rumor. But neither forgot that Gene, who was their man(employee, contractor, whatever) did an end run and embarrassed them.



I'm certainly not saying Freiberger was a good writer or producer. But no one is entirely without merits. ST season 3 isn't nearly as well-written overall as seasons 1 or 2, but it's arguably less sexist than previous seasons and less prone to basing aliens on Orientalist/tribal stereotypes, and it arguably reverses season 2's trend of solving more problems with violence than with positive moral examples. So for all that there are things about season 3 that deserve criticism, it does have saving graces that I think are overlooked -- and season 2 has faults that I think are overlooked.
Credit for season 3 goes to the remaining crew and the cast, not to FF. On Trek he didn't have total control so some of it turned out ok. On S1999 s2, he had total control and ran it into the ground.




I figured out that the way to approach season 1 of Space: 1999 is as a work of surrealist, existentialist fantasy. It's sort of in the vein of Stanislaw Lem's Solaris, in that it embraces the idea that the universe is endlessly bizarre and unknowable and our human constructs of knowledge and perception are inadequate to define or cope with it. There's a lot of Twilight Zone in it too, those episodes where strange and impossible things happen to people who probe the frontiers beyond existing knowledge.
It's actually horror-scifi as a genre which I never heard of before a few years ago. However being aged 6 at the time, some of the eps scared the fertilizer out of me, so I can attest to its classification. It is way trippy and slow burning. Everyone whispers. It's totally non-military, and the heroes were just people that sometimes behaved selfishly. I loved it because it's everything Trek is not, and we can all agree that we have room for more than one scifi show in our hearts.
 
Actually, according to multiple viewpoints of the 50-year mission book, Paramount was the one trying to get out from under this huge expense they inherited when they bought Desilu.

You'd do yourself a favor in this section of the book if you redacted every word from so-called historian Marc Cushman. He provides a lot of context in this section, and much of what he says is pure fabrication.

It is true that Gulf+Western, once the acquisition of Desilu was complete, became concerned with the cost of the three shows they inherited from Desilu that were renewed past they 1967-68 broadcast season (The Lucy Show ended in 1968 in favor of a new format, Here's Lucy). This included Star Trek, as well as Mission: Impossible and Mannix. It's worth pointing out that Star Trek had the lowest budget of those three programs under Desilu. All were rather expensive for their time.

Solow wouldn't know because he was Desilu and not on the lot anymore after some point in the 2nd season when Paramount took charge of production.

Solow, in fact, continued as Vice President of Programs for Paramount Television once Desilu was absorbed by Gulf+Western, although he quickly became disenchanted and left before Star Trek's third season began production.

The Desilu money men wanted to jump ship too after season 1, but Lucy herself renewed production, and it cost her the company.

Source? The old guard on the Desilu board later admitted that they tried to talk Lucy out of Star Trek and Mission: Impossible during the pilot pre-production phase in 1965 (in this case, Star Trek's second pilot), but Lucille Ball (with the support of others on the board at that time, Bernie Weitzman and Oscar Katz, I should point out) elected to continue on with both projects.

She was forced to sell mid-season 2.

The sale was set in motion long before the deal was signed. Most reports I've read indicate Lucille Ball was "relieved" once the sale went through, as she disliked having to run a major studio, but kept on doing so for so long because she felt obligated to her employees, which were like a family.

Enter Paramount.

Gulf+Western, really -- Paramount's parent company. They were one of several bidders for Desilu.

The show cost too much, Gene didn't bow to their will.

Roddenberry left, re-negotiating his contract so that he was no longer exclusive to Paramount, and moving to a new office on the National General lot to work on a pair of projects, including a Tarzan movie, that never made it out of development. Star Trek essentially did bow to their will -- the budget was slashed, and the cost overruns that had afflicted seasons one and two were kept under much better control.

They also are believed to have held Gene personally responsible for the letter-writing campaign that saved the show, that he used his influence with the fans. Indirectly they were right.

Desilu (which became Paramount) had to have been aware of Gene's involvement with the letter-writing campaign -- after all, he submitted expenses from the campaign to the studio for reimbursement! It was NBC that suspected Gene's involvement, but didn't know for sure.

--

@Indysolo already alluded to this, but one of the reasons cited in the trades for Star Trek's move to the 10pm Friday night timeslot (rather than the earlier slot on Monday nights where it had previously been announced for 1968-69) is that big tobacco was a major sponsor:

Weekly Variety (March 20 1968) said:
Each web still has its agency and sponsor confidantes - a half-dozen influential clients with whom they discuss their scheduling plans and for whom they stage secret screenings to get a feeling of how they stand with pilots that are on the fence. And there will probably always be instances of shows shifting to new periods because of a healthy participating buy. Ted Bates' Dick Pinkham had a hand in moving NBC's "Julia" to Saturday night, and it's said a buy from R. J. Reynolds prompted that web's shift of "Star Trek" from early Monday night to late Friday night, where it Is safe for a tobacco to advertise.

Anyone who doubts the hack he is simply needs to compare Space:1999 series 1 and 2. Watch the interviews from the series where he talks about the changes and lightening things up, etc. He's a second string TV producer. Harve Bennett without the talent. He should never have been allowed near Trek.

Freiberger had a long and varied career on programs such as the highly-regarded Slattery's People and The Bold Ones: The Senator, as well as low-budget cheapies such as The Beginning of the End (an easy target for Mystery Science Theater 3000) and The Beast from 20,000 Fathoms. The way he's tarred and feathered by science fiction fans for his involvement on Star Trek (which would have had a troubled third season under any producer) and Space: 1999 (I haven't seen the second season, but the first season is a mess of forced interpersonal conflicts, cold and aloof leading characters, and bad technobabble that makes later-day Star Trek look like a hard science lecture in comparison -- the show needed major changes, no doubt about it) is myopic and unfair.
 
Ok I messed up the formatting on my prev post and my replies are grouped with the quote text. Sorry. I'm still a newbie to Trek BBS and well as any BBS.
 
Ok I messed up the formatting on my prev post and my replies are grouped with the quote text. Sorry. I'm still a newbie to Trek BBS and well as any BBS.

You should be able to go in an edit the post.

Quotes should be entered (without the spaces):

[QUOTE ]Text text text.[/QUOTE ]
 
During the 1969-70 broadcast season, NBC aired what I gather was a semi-anthology series called Bracken's World in the 10-11pm timeslot on Friday nights. That series remained in that timeslot during the first half of the 1970-71 broadcast season, after which it was cancelled and replaced by a British import called Strange Report, which only lasted 16 episodes. (Honest question -- did any of the ITC imports to the United States in the 1960s last on American network television?)

If you're talking about the 8:30-9:30pm Friday night timeslot, which Star Trek occupied during the 1967-68 broadcast season, it was succeeded by The Name of The Game, which occupied that timeslot (and a little more, since it was a longer show) for three seasons.

I remember a little bit about those 2 shows. I believe Gene Barry was in 'Brakens World' and Tony Franciosa was in 'Name of the Game'. Other than that....
 
You'd do yourself a favor in this section of the book if you redacted every word from so-called historian Marc Cushman. He provides a lot of context in this section, and much of what he says is pure fabrication.

It is true that Gulf+Western, once the acquisition of Desilu was complete, became concerned with the cost of the three shows they inherited from Desilu that were renewed past they 1967-68 broadcast season (The Lucy Show ended in 1968 in favor of a new format, Here's Lucy). This included Star Trek, as well as Mission: Impossible and Mannix. It's worth pointing out that Star Trek had the lowest budget of those three programs under Desilu. All were rather expensive for their time.



Solow, in fact, continued as Vice President of Programs for Paramount Television once Desilu was absorbed by Gulf+Western, although he quickly became disenchanted and left before Star Trek's third season began production.



Source? The old guard on the Desilu board later admitted that they tried to talk Lucy out of Star Trek and Mission: Impossible during the pilot pre-production phase in 1965 (in this case, Star Trek's second pilot), but Lucille Ball (with the support of others on the board at that time, Bernie Weitzman and Oscar Katz, I should point out) elected to continue on with both projects.



The sale was set in motion long before the deal was signed. Most reports I've read indicate Lucille Ball was "relieved" once the sale went through, as she disliked having to run a major studio, but kept on doing so for so long because she felt obligated to her employees, which were like a family.



Gulf+Western, really -- Paramount's parent company. They were one of several bidders for Desilu.



Roddenberry left, re-negotiating his contract so that he was no longer exclusive to Paramount, and moving to a new office on the National General lot to work on a pair of projects, including a Tarzan movie, that never made it out of development. Star Trek essentially did bow to their will -- the budget was slashed, and the cost overruns that had afflicted seasons one and two were kept under much better control.



Desilu (which became Paramount) had to have been aware of Gene's involvement with the letter-writing campaign -- after all, he submitted expenses from the campaign to the studio for reimbursement! It was NBC that suspected Gene's involvement, but didn't know for sure.

--

@Indysolo already alluded to this, but one of the reasons cited in the trades for Star Trek's move to the 10pm Friday night timeslot (rather than the earlier slot on Monday nights where it had previously been announced for 1968-69) is that big tobacco was a major sponsor:





Freiberger had a long and varied career on programs such as the highly-regarded Slattery's People and The Bold Ones: The Senator, as well as low-budget cheapies such as The Beginning of the End (an easy target for Mystery Science Theater 3000) and The Beast from 20,000 Fathoms. The way he's tarred and feathered by science fiction fans for his involvement on Star Trek (which would have had a troubled third season under any producer) and Space: 1999 (I haven't seen the second season, but the first season is a mess of forced interpersonal conflicts, cold and aloof leading characters, and bad technobabble that makes later-day Star Trek look like a hard science lecture in comparison -- the show needed major changes, no doubt about it) is myopic and unfair.

The source is mostly the 50-year mission Vol1 book and everything I've stated can be referenced there with the exception of my personal FF bashing, which is mostly due to my being upset about s2 s1999. If you haven't seen it and if you don't care for S1999 s1, it's irrelevant. FF had a long career. That much I will stipulate. :)
 
I think I see the problem. I'm too much of a newbie to edit posts until I get promoted. I have not edit button. Blast!
 
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