If we had a space shuttle with a "00" number, it would be highly classified...and yet, everyone would know its favorite martini.
Original 12 Constitution class ships
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And when you feel like you've mastered Space Shuttle orbiter vehicle numbers, there's [URL "http://americanspacecraft.com/pages/apollo/index.html"]Apollo Command Module serial numbers[/URL] to ponder.
The short explanation of them all: serial numbers are very nice things but it's hard to make ``counting'' actually work that well in practice.
Seems pretty pointless to bend over backwards to justify some throwaway comment Jefferies might have once made. There's no reason for Enterprise to be the first ship of her class.
In Star Trek: Bridge Commander, the USS Sovereign was built and went through her trials, but was not passed for active duty, being mothballed and being picked over during the construction of the second hull frame.
Which during that was christened the Enterprise-E, she was the first and for a while only Sovereign class ship in the fleet. It apparently does happen from time to time.
The Defiant class could have been the same if O'Brien hadn't gotten her to work with some effort. The second ship would have been approved for use instead after some tinkering.
Which during that was christened the Enterprise-E, she was the first and for a while only Sovereign class ship in the fleet. It apparently does happen from time to time.
The Defiant class could have been the same if O'Brien hadn't gotten her to work with some effort. The second ship would have been approved for use instead after some tinkering.
Eh, why not? It factors in creator intent, and it gives us a bit of backstory that's not contradicted by anything in the show. Seems harmless enough. Besides, Jefferies obviously put some thought into his explanation.
^^ I don't know how much thought MJ put into that explanation. It rather contradicts the E being a Constitution-class because that would make it the second one built.
Also much earlier MJ stated he chose 1701 because it was what he believed to be the easiest numbers to discern on the television screens of the time. So the second explanation strikes me as a way of rationalizing the first.
The idea of the E being the first built also strikes me as being another way to make the hero ship just a little more special.
Also much earlier MJ stated he chose 1701 because it was what he believed to be the easiest numbers to discern on the television screens of the time. So the second explanation strikes me as a way of rationalizing the first.
The idea of the E being the first built also strikes me as being another way to make the hero ship just a little more special.
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Probably because they still considered it a "Starship Class" at that point.
I don't find this a problem. He gave an explanation from both a real-world perspective and an in-universe perspective.
Yeah, I agree. I don't really need the Enterprise to be the first of its class or the "flagship" or anything like that to consider it special. It was special because of the captain and crew that was on it and what they did.
Merrick would disagree with you. He felt his was only a lowly spaceship, not a starship.[/QUOTE]
But his ship was The SS Beagle and not the USS Beagle so that's why he seemed ashamed! He was in the Merchant service and not Starfleet!
JB
If I could chime in on this discussion, the 12 ships that Kirk refers to are the remaining ship of the Mark IX Constitution class. A quick glance at the original Starfleet Technical Manual shows the names of all of these vessels as well as the ship of the Mark IX-A and Mark IX-B replacements and design upgrades.
That works for me.
But I think that the Tech Manual is no longer "official" because of money issues, therefore, it doesn't work for everyone.
The Tech Manual was never really official. While it tapped into a great deal of fan interest there is the simple fact that the TM as well as the blueprints they expanded upon diverged greatly from what we actually saw on the show.
There is no actual definitive list of the "12" Constitution-class ships and what little information is available can be interpreted many different ways.
It's easy to accept that for TOS a starship was a particular configuration bolstered by the fact the constrained budget inhibited them from showing any other configuration. But I have little doubt that if TOS could have shown other configurations (for Starfleet) they would have.
There is no actual definitive list of the "12" Constitution-class ships and what little information is available can be interpreted many different ways.
It's easy to accept that for TOS a starship was a particular configuration bolstered by the fact the constrained budget inhibited them from showing any other configuration. But I have little doubt that if TOS could have shown other configurations (for Starfleet) they would have.
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I do agree that there has been a lot of divergence from what would be considered "canon" as far as TOS is concerned, but I must also point out that the TM was, in fact, considered as "official" and is still accepted as such, mainly due to the fact that its primary contributors were Gene Roddenberry, Franz Joseph and Matt Jeffries - the same trio responsible for most of the development of the show itself.
Hindsight being what it is and all, there were actually plans to show many other Starfleet vessel designs (in such contexts as being in Spacedock or in orbit above other planets); however, the funding for the show never materialized as it should have - which is of course the biggest mistake ever made by NBC...
Hindsight being what it is and all, there were actually plans to show many other Starfleet vessel designs (in such contexts as being in Spacedock or in orbit above other planets); however, the funding for the show never materialized as it should have - which is of course the biggest mistake ever made by NBC...
Uh, I don't think so. Franz Joseph had nothing to do with the production, he was basically making "fan art" in the early '70s, originally based on illustrations in The Making of Star Trek. In those very early days of Trek publications, it came to Roddenberry's attention and he basically signed off on what FJ had done in the interest of making a business deal. He had very little input, if any.
Later, the TM and BGP being basically the only in-universe "technical" material around, some parts were used in the Trek movies. How much that makes them canon is a matter of opinion, I guess.
An interesting summary here:
http://www.trekplace.com/fj-timeline.html
I stand corrected, with gratitude. I had always understood that GR had a hand in the TM.
Now, what about Mr. Scott's Guide to the Enterprise (released shortly after ST:TMP)? Official, or fan art?
Now, what about Mr. Scott's Guide to the Enterprise (released shortly after ST:TMP)? Official, or fan art?
More than just credit--thanks to his best selling work, we ended up getting blueprints and tech manuals (official or not) for Space:1999, the entire Star Wars and Alien franchises, Forbidden Planet (and other "rediscovered" 50's sci-fi films), Battlestar Galactica, Planet of the Apes, Irwin Allen's sci-fi TV series...the list goes on an on up to the present day. Just another example of how influential TOS and its ancillary products were on a significant part of the entertainment industry.
I came up with a set of schematics and things a long time ago (c. 1987 when TNG debuted) that would have introduced a whole new race to the Federation. Now with this new series coming out I may have to dig up that old paperwork...
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