What is the "official" version?
I've heard Jennifer Lien say several times that it was just a matter of her contract not being renewed, which is a very common thing for actors. She said she had no ill feelings about it or to the powers that be.
Was Kes a Good Character?
- Thread starter hux
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I've heard Jennifer Lien say several times that it was just a matter of her contract not being renewed, which is a very common thing for actors. She said she had no ill feelings about it or to the powers that be.
it's not actually the case. Each season has one or two episodes that focus on one character. Every character got their fair share of screen time. Janeway always had the most though as the captain.
Kes wanted to experience other things, she, the character, actually stated thus. So, I am in complete agreement, regarding future Seasons having had Kes evolve from the naïve character she started as, towards a more worldly view. But I, personally, would not have wanted that view to be cynical, or sarcastic. Kes believed there was good in people and I would never want to see that philosophy deteriorate into her having some sort of a negative attitude towards Life. Life isn't bad ... Life is Good! At the same time, It wouldn't have been fair to Jennifer Lien to play a character who ends up exactly as we, the audience, found her, years later. That's not any fun.
I see Kes as Tinkerbell, pretty much, the same way that Data of TNG could be - and was - described as another Pinocchio. Data wasn't that character, exactly, nor could he be, but he evoked that same spirit and that's all I'd really want to see happen for Kes. Is it so absolutely necessary that every regular female character on television be some Ice Queen? Some Tough Cookie? I'm not saying make women out as damsels in distress, but for god's sakes ...
Is that the sort of person you thought I was describing? If so that's not what I meant. All I meant was that if she stayed on the show and if they gave Kes any kind of character arc she would be a different person at the end of the seven years from the way she was at the beginning. Something about her would have changed. That doesn't necessarily mean she would become a tough cookie or an ice queen. It doesn't have to go to extremes.
A little tougher than she was when we first met her perhaps but that's not necessarily a bad thing.
After three seasons her character didn't change at all except for growing hair. If she had stayed at the end of 7 years she would be around her final year of life, so I would hope in that time she would have had growth and development.
I would disagree that she didn't change at all. I think we saw the inklings of a change, including her breaking up with Neelix and developing her mental powers. She had an intense love for Voyager that was perhaps best exemplified in her last episode (ignoring "Fury" 
).
I personally would have liked seeing her stay the full seven years.
). I personally would have liked seeing her stay the full seven years.
Her changes were quite minimal. Sure she had an intense love for Voyager but so did everybody and they showed it all the time. Everybody risked their own lives regularly for Voyager and her crew.I would disagree that she didn't change at all. I think we saw the inklings of a change, including her breaking up with Neelix and developing her mental powers. She had an intense love for Voyager that was perhaps best exemplified in her last episode (ignoring "Fury"
I personally would have liked seeing her stay the full seven years.
I don't know why you would want to ignore Fury, I thought it was actually an interesting episode. But to each their own.
It's interesting but it also is a rather odd turn to take the character, rather out of the blue. It doesn't add much to the character, and actually kind of resets Kes in a way. To me, it would be like if The Force Awakens reveals Luke at the end of the film as Supreme Leader Snoke, the main bad guy. That's an incredible twist to throw on a character that hasn't been seen in a while.
To me, it's poor planning and slants Kes in to the realm of mentally ill bad guy of the week. Not a good treatment of the character at all.
I also think that Kes had more growth than she is given credit for and that much of Seven of Nine's growth could have been seen in Kes as well. Sorry, her intense love for Voyager is exemplified in her sacrifice and final act before becoming noncoporeal. So, I give her sacrifice a little more weight than the rest of the crew, but that's me.
Also, @Lynx has talked about Fury before so it's not just my opinion.
You could say that it wasn't out of the blue. In before and after we learn that a normal part of ocampan's aging process is memory loss. So it does make sense that upon looking back at her life durring this memory loss phase some things got lost and confused. She saw herself as a young child taken from her home which is why she became angry. The good thing she experienced were gone or confused. But I thought it was an interesting turn when at the end she went back to her home to help them. There is a follow up to this in one of the recent novels.
My grandmother is currently suffering from Alzheimers so I can actually see some parallels to Kes's behavior here.
One good point out of it doesn't make the episode any more out of the blue. Sorry, to me, it's a poor damper on a rather lovable character. Also, follow up in a novel is great and all, but I haven't read it so, I wouldn't know.
well spoiler alert if you're interested......in one of the novels Janeway "dies" and with the help of Q and Kes she comes back. We see Kes back on her homeworld and how things have progressed there. She has a son also.One good point out of it doesn't make the episode any more out of the blue. Sorry, to me, it's a poor damper on a rather lovable character. Also, follow up in a novel is great and all, but I haven't read it so, I wouldn't know.
I know a lot of people liked her, but I never did. To each their own. For me the moment when I really began to notice how bad she was was in Persistance of Vision. Janeway is in sickbay and Kes is there. Kes is supposed to shudder like she has a chill, and instead she has this crazy convulsion like she's having a seizure and is like "oh I felt a chill". It looked so rediculous. After that all of her annoying habits kept jumping out at me.
I've seen some ideas posted, in this very forum, which offered alternative explanations to what's onscreen, and fit in with it - very comfortably. I believe one, or two even came from the VOYAGER novels, which I have never read.
― But they did hold promise!
There was something about her in one of the Voyager novels. It involved dark matter
Sounds good! But tell me, though ... did the words hold?
I think it worked. The novels were quite good in my opinion.
Kes was a little too tamed for my taste. Even when she was inhabited by the dictator, her demeanor seemed low key, which of course was kinda paradoxical given that she was supposed to be a tyrant.
Seven in comparison was a lot more energetic.
Seven in comparison was a lot more energetic.
I agree. She had no range of emotions
Yeah, she had the same tone of voice as the people who make announcements in airports.
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