Spoilers STAR TREK BEYOND

[Adam]

But what was his chances that he would be able to find it? He attacked "Enterprise" with such indiscriminate weapon as ramming drones. He could easily inflict such damage, that the ship would just disintegrate. Or, the crew may decide to activate self-destruct system. And after that, his chances to find the artefact would be null.

And again, such troubles only for a marginally powerfull bioweapon? Couldn't he just jury-rig a neutron bomb, or produce a few thousand tons of VX?

But he didn't inflict too much damage in the beginning. He boarded the Enterprise to get the artifact.
He saw the Federation and Starfleet personell as weak. I don't think he saw Starfleet personell as capable of self-destructing, self-sacrificing their ship and crew.

That bioweapon wouldn't have left a trace of the attackers. It would have put Starfleet and the Federation on edge. Probably produced another Admiral Marcus.

 

[Dilandu]

The bioweapon seemed much more than "marginally powerful" IMO. Kill millions in a single attack with no collateral damage to the base itself. Remember, Spock speculates that Krall wants to wipe out the people on Yorktown and use the station for himself. He can't do that if he blows it up.

Well, he could just use old-fashioned VX. Or small-scale neutron bombs. Or even simple miniature antimatter charges (microgram-scale), to produce large radiation flux.

 

[Dilandu]

That bioweapon wouldn't have left a trace of the attackers. It would have put Starfleet and the Federation on edge. Probably produced another Admiral Marcus.

With all respect, buth it's much easier to trace the unique bioweapon artifact than the mundane neutron bomb (on the Star Trek tech level basically anyone could compose crude nuclear device).

 

[Adam]

Well, he could just use old-fashioned VX. Or small-scale neutron bombs. Or even simple miniature antimatter charges (microgram-scale), to produce large radiation flux.

Technobabble to "Enterprise" lead. "Enterprise" to the death of the franchise nearly lead. /Joda

 

[BillJ]

With all respect, buth it's much easier to trace the unique bioweapon artifact than the mundane neutron bomb (on the Star Trek tech level basically anyone could compose crude nuclear device).

Just like a fire, sensors would probably detect a bomb going off and force fields would kick in to minimize damage.

 

[Dilandu]

Just like a fire, sensors would probably detect a bomb going off and force fields would kick in to minimize damage.

And they would not detect the obviously visible virus particles?

P.S. And, even so, the all-out attack make no sence. The majority of population rushed to the shelters - and I suppose, that civilian shelters on the space station have independent oxygen supply (or they make no sence).

Some sneak attack with bioweapon - yes, this may work at least once. But with the full-scale attack it's just make no sence.

Technobabble to "Enterprise" lead. "Enterprise" to the death of the franchise nearly lead. /Joda

Remember, that Roddenberry the Great started TOS as SCIENCE fiction, not just fantasy)

 

[Romulan_spy]

Perhaps. Had the torpedoes found a target.

The torp does not need to find a target. It would simply need to detonate close enough for the swarm to be inside the lethal blast radius.

 

[BillJ]

Remember, that Roddenberry the Great started TOS as SCIENCE fiction, not just fantasy)

From the Star Trek Writer's Guide...

 

[Adam]

Remember, that Roddenberry the Great started TOS as SCIENCE fiction, not just fantasy)

Explain "Spock's Brain" then

 

[Kor]

From the spoken dialog, it was obvious that if the bioweapon was to be deployed in Yorktown as Krall wanted, they would not have been able to contain it, for whatever unspoken reason.

Kor

 

[Dilandu]

The torp does not need to find a target. It would simply need to detonate close enough for the swarm to be inside the lethal blast radius.

Exactly. That's why bombers stopped to use tight formations after Korean War, by the way)

 

[Adam]

The torp does not need to find a target. It would simply need to detonate close enough for the swarm to be inside the lethal blast radius.

But it didn't.

 

[Dilandu]

From the spoken dialog, it was obvious that if the bioweapon was to be deployed in Yorktown as Krall wanted, they would not have been able to contain it, for whatever unspoken reason.

Kor

The problem is, that the bioweapon worked TOO FAST. It would not be able to spread - i.e. as contagious weapon it's useless. The real bioweapon was considered effective exactly because it took a lot of time to kill the target, and the target could infect others. With the Kraal bioweapon, nothing like that could possibly happens.

 

[BillJ]

With the Kraal bioweapon, nothing like that could possibly happens.

It's fantasy, just go with it. If I stopped every time Star Trek didn't make sense on some fundamental level, I would've never finished "Where No Man Has Gone Before".

 

[Dilandu]

But it didn't.

Because the authors of "Beyond" simply were too lazy to think about anything, and they decided "ah, those fans would swallow anything if we add the tons of computer images and BAM-DAM-BABADOOM!"

They could simply made droneships attack "Enterprise" from different directions, in loose, not tight formation. This would greatly negated area-effect weapon as photon torpedoes. But they were lazy, and didn't knew a thing about space.

 

[Romulan_spy]

Exactly. That's why bombers stopped to use tight formations after Korean War, by the way)

which is why if star trek depicted photon torps in a realistic way, the battle in Beyond would have been very different. The Enterprise would have fired a couple torps that would have been programmed to detonate close to the swarm. There would have been a blinding light as the energy from the explosions would have expanded out at the speed of light and taken out the entire swarm or a very high percentage at least.

 

[BillJ]

They could simply made droneships attack "Enterprise" from different directions, in loose, not tight formation.

Which they did. Some came straight forward, others slammed into the side.

 

[BillJ]

which is why if star trek depicted photon torps in a realistic way...

Now ask yourself how many times Star Trek has depicted space combat in a realistic way?

 

[Dilandu]

which is why if star trek depicted photon torps in a realistic way, the battle in Beyond would have been very different. The Enterprise would have fired a couple torps that would have been programmed to detonate close to the swarm. There would have been a blinding light as the energy from the explosions would have expanded out at the speed of light and taken out the entire swarm or a very high percentage at least.

Oh, I wrote a short about exactly this on another ST forum...

---------------------------------

...The photon torpedo left "Enterprise" launch tube. It could not seek it's target: the tangled, twisted mass of moving drones make this impossible even for the best Starfleet equipment. But she doesn't need that. Actually, she doesn't even have a working seeker - she was launched on the straitforward trajectory with the only goal to move at pre-selected speed for a pre-set nubmer of milliseconds. And she done exactly that.

As soon as last millisecond passed, the torpedo activated her warhead and one thousand grams of matter combined with one thousand grams of anti-matter.

The total conversion of mass into energy.

The annihilation.

Light.

The nearest drones just evaporated, as soon as tremendous wave of X-ray radiation hit them. The more distant ones weren't vaporised entirely, but the impulse shock from ablation explosion crushed and ripped apart their tiny hulls. The most distant drones were left intact, because the X-ray front exausted itself, but it matters nothing: the neutron radiation from the blast instantly killed their organic pilots and shorted every bit of electronic onboard.

A second passed, and all that remained from the great swarm was only a quickly dissipated mass of lifeless debrees. A few machines still showed some ability to move; it took nearly a second for the "Enterprise" phasers to destroy them all.

On the brige of great starship, Spock turned to captain.

- Captain, the whole enemy force have been neutralized.

- By the single blast? - it seemed that Kirk himself could not believe in what just happened.

- Apparently so. The data that our sensors collected indicated that the enemy units wasn't probably the decidated warships, due to the lack of shielding, low acceleration abilities and clearly... disadvantageous tactics.

- Disadvantageous? - McCoy snorted, - My God, Jim, they just run toward us in tight crowd, like the roman legion against the machinegunner! They haven't got even a glimmer of chance...

- Captain! - Uhura called from her control station, - I pick up the transmission, aimed on our ship.

- On screen.

- ...aptain Kirk! Please, listen to me! - the face of humanoid on the screen seemed quite a bit worried, - It was a terrible mistake! I assure you, all our attack was just a terrible mistake!

- Who the hell are you? - Kirk asked politely.

- It was... uh? Kraal! My name is Kraal! Please, understood - this was only a really terrible mistake! I... my peoples bear no hostility against you at all...

 

[Romulan_spy]

Now ask yourself how many times Star Trek has depicted space combat in a realistic way?

Oh I know.