Religion and Star Trek

[The Wormhole]

Sometimes, though, with Chakotay's Vision Quests,

On the surface, Chakotay's vision quests seem surprisingly metaphysical for Star Trek, particularly when he chatting with his dad, a character is actually communicating with the dead in the afterlife. But, particularly with the scene in the episode Basics, I kind of get the impression they are trying to imply, or at least leave the matter open-ended that rather than a genuine metaphysical experience it's more just a dream or something. After all, all Chakotay's dad really did was remind Chakotay of his own beliefs and values.

 

[2takesfrakes]

Religion is a means of finding the Truth about ourselves, just as Science is a means of finding the Truth about our Universe. Science has limitations, despite being incredibly useful, in other ways. And Faith-based systems have them, too. For one thing, unlike Science, it's entirely subjective, but that's what we want. So, Chakotay's Vision Quests can't really about Life unfolding its unsolved mysteries that he wasn't even aware of, yet. Not at all.

What they're about is helping him with navigating through current challenges and uncertainties that he's experiencing and directly exposed to. And that means that he's always, at least, partially in control of his own Vision Quests, even if it's at the subconscious level. So, playing the Vision Quests as though they're open to interpretation, as opposed to being an absolute, is entirely appropriate.

They're not really about being given direct and obvious answers as much as they are about unraveling knots. In Chakotay's mind, he's stuck somehow, somewhere ... he's snagged on some issue, unable to just move on from it, entirely. A full, qualified answer isn't really necessary to do that. Sometimes, a simple, generic arrow pointing in a given direction more than suffices. And that's what Vision Quests are often about finding, for Chakotay.

 

[Trek Survivor]

I'm a Christian, and feel that there is plenty of "room for me in Star Trek". It's a great show, great concept and I enjoy it very much. The basic value of mutual respect is so simple, yet so powerful. The quote in my signature applies (or should) to theological viewpoints as well.

As others have said, I feel there's plenty of spiritual content in many of the shows (I love that scene from "Where Silence Has Lease" - indeed, the whole episode), but even if there wasn't, there's plenty of other interesting things it offers to think about. Aside from the odd exception, I find the show very respectful of all cultures and beliefs and that can only be a good thing?

Not all fans are as tolerant and respectful of others beliefs as others, but on the whole, both the franchise and the community is pretty good with inclusion.

 

[stardream]

To be honest I don't think about it that much. I don't go to fictional TV shows for affirmation concerning my spiritual beliefs no more than I would by reading Lord of the Rings or Watership Down. It's not something I do. I understand and accept the show was created by an atheist with a certain view of the future but that doesn't diminish my enjoyment of it.

I think the Trek view of the future is great...especially the parts about post feminism. I have a dream that someday women will be free from harassment, violence and exploitation. It's something to hope for.

 

[Serin117]

(hey, I disagree with LGBT behavior, but people who think differently about controversial topics shouldn't be hated, ostracized, or tried to convert their beliefs to mind.

There's a place, buts its more likely with the J'naii who couldn't accept Soren, rather than with the Federation and its philosophy of Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combination.
That's my bluntness done - obviously it is just a story and no one can 'kick' anyone out. If anything I think its a brilliant and often heartfelt format for changing minds. (It'd be great if the anti-gmo crowd watched Trek more, for instance)

Trek is at its finest when it is questioning beliefs, challenging injustices with reason and compassion and espousing a humanity that has moved past its apparent love for causing suffering for those who are different.
These things seem quite anathema to fundamentalism at the least, and whilst very few watch Trek for its secular Humanist ideals I certainly think its interesting that anyone who opposes those ideals strongly would want any part of it.
But then I suppose many who are obsessed with strict interpretations of marriage watch any number of the so-called reality tv shows that mock marriage more than anything the terrible gays could do to it.

That said, I do have a friend who is apparently some form of christian who is greatly interested in Trek and scifi as a genre. He's even proffered advice for my fan fiction so... people, they're an oddly confusing bunch.

 

[uniderth]

Wow. I had never drawn the parallel between "The Book" in "A Piece of the Action" and the bible. Learn something new everyday.

I have to say I really enjoyed the religious aspect of Deep Space Nine. It was nice to see religion treated respectfully and presented from so many different angles. I would like if we could see human religions dealt with in the same way, though I can see why that would be problematic.

Growing up Mormon, the ideas of extraterrestrial life and even God as an alien (of some sort), fit well within my belief structure. There is a common belief among Mormons that our earth is just one of many inhabited worlds that God created. Additionally, there is a belief in God being a more advanced form of ourselves. In a way that presents God in a more tangible way, similar to the God as an alien presented in Star Trek.

It would be interesting to see Star Trek present crew members with different (non)religious and still be able to get along, be friends, and get the job done. There's so much hate right now from all sides. Probably the best message we need is that yes, you can disagree, but you can get along too.

 

[at Quark's]

I don't think Star Trek is against religion. Doesn't it teach us God(s) actually exist?

Though it does encourage us to get suspicious, when it turns out He wants your starship.

 

[Shawnster]

You can see the religious underpinning in Star Trek. Gene Roddenbury was an atheist and a very progressive one. It seems like with Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, we finally had some possibility that materialism is the only true religion (which I do consider it a religion, it explains the metaphysics of the universe.)

Roddenberry's atheism grew over time. There is the story about Gene Roddenberry making sure his son was baptized in the top 3 major religions of the Earth (well, baptized may be the wrong word for Judism and Buddhism). Gene and Majel were married in a Shinto-Buddhist ceremony.

1960s Star Trek reflected America's acceptance of Judaeo-Christian beliefs while still being sure footed in science. "Bread and Circuses" has Kirk and the Enterprise crew almost beaming with pride and awe that the message of the "Son of God" was spreading among the stars. In "Gem" the Starfleet officer on the video playback quotes the Bible right after the seismic tremor. Daystrom in "Ultimate Computer" talks about God and how murder is wrong in God's eyes and man's. In "Who Mourns for Adonis" Kirk states that "we find the one [God] sufficient."

1980s and beyond Trek reflects the shift in the spiritual mindset of America. Picard is either agnostic or atheist. Many find "Who Watches the Watchers" to be a statement against religion. While Kira's worship of the Prophets is tolerated or accepted, it's clear that they are just advanced aliens and not gods deserving of worship. Religion is more and more treated as something only suited for cultural differences and not meant to be a guiding force in peoples lives.

Trek will continue to reflect the times. It's not so much correct to ask if Star Trek has room for a Christian, it's more appropriate to ask if a Christian has room for Star Trek. Look at the reactions we've already seen in this post. It's quite clear where the culture and community is heading in regards traditional Christians values and morals. Star Trek is going to continue to reflect this trend. If that offends someone, then they won't have room for Star Trek in their life. If the viewer is willing to accept or, at the very least, tolerate or ignore the shift in the moral climate, then they may be able to continue as a Star Trek fan. It's really up to the viewer to decide.

I'm guessing their reverence for "The Book"...but that's quite a stretch.

In 40 years of Star Trek watching I've never made that connection. Glad to see I'm not alone.

 

[TwoJakes]

Roddenberry's atheism grew over time.

At the time of the scripting and filming of TMP, Roddenberry belief was in (iirc) "The All." This was mentioned in the TMP novelization as a Vulcan belief, and was referred to in the novel Spock's World.

Humans tend to be depicted being secular-humanists

Not my impression, while there does seem to be Humanism, it isn't secular-Humanism. Especially during TOS. What people like Riker, LaForge, really most people on the show embrace, isn't spelled out.

Picard, poster boy for 24th-century humanity, isn't an atheist, but an agnostic

That scene painted Picard as more spiritual than agnostic.

Sometimes, though, with Chakotay's Vision Quests, and some of Bajor's religion, it got a little silly

And Vulcans with their shrines, temples, monasteries, priests, priestesses.

I wouldn't have minded seeing Judeo/Christian beliefs feature more prominently, in STAR TREK.

This and more. Hopefully the next series will show that Humans continue to have faith (of the heart?). The vast majority of Humans have religions, spritualities, or metaphysical beliefs. The majority of Humans of the future should as well, as mentioned show them co-existing peacefully.

 

[TheGoodStuff]

In an episode that I otherwise consider to be spottily written and directed at best comes this striking scene, which asserts that Picard, poster boy for 24th-century humanity, isn't an atheist, but an agnostic:

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

I would disagree with that part. I think Picard is an atheist. The issue, is you are mistaking the question he was asked as a religious one. He is simply asked what he thinks death is. He explicitly states that he does not think either 'click: gone' or 'magical lands' are real.

His answer is actually quite scientific especially when you factor in the universe that he inhabits. He achknowledges the vast complexity of the universe and how little we [they] understand it. Even now, on 21st century Earth there are a multitude of theories on death [this is a simulation, there are infinite universes in which we exist etc, extra dimensions to existence] and Picard is rather echoing them.

I certainly think the man who said:

Could be safely considred Atheistic in his thinking.

 

[fireproof78]

This and more. Hopefully the next series will show that Humans continue to have faith (of the heart?). The vast majority of Humans have religions, spritualities, or metaphysical beliefs. The majority of Humans of the future should as well, as mentioned show them co-existing peacefully.

I really should avoid threads like this, but this point mirrors my own. I won't force my beliefs upon others, but I would like Star Trek to at least showcase and ecumenical relationship and peaceful.

Given current political climates that might be just as optimistic as TOS multiethnic crew.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

To me, it's okay to disagree with people on progressive topics, so long as you do not interfere with anyone's right to live their own life the way they choose or try to deny anyone services because you disagree with them.

There is a big diff between saying 'I disapprove of X' and saying 'I will refuse to treat X people with respect'.

The point of Star Trek isn't 'Religion is stupid', just 'Killing over religion is stupid'. So long as you are willing to coexist amicably with those you disagree with, you have a place in Trek.

 

[uniderth]

faith (of the heart?).

Bad TwoJakes. Bad.

*squirts with squirt bottle*

 

[Joanna McCoy-Kirk]

I remember when the Southern Baptist Convention denounced Star Trek because McCoy indirectly refers to the Biblical account of creation as a "myth" in ST: The Wrath of Khan. Even though I am a Christian Star Trek fan, I thought that was pretty ridiculous. Maybe a hard-core, right-wing fundamentalist Christian might have a problem with Star Trek, but I for one do not (I am a moderate Baptist.)

 

[fireproof78]

I remember when the Southern Baptist Convention denounced Star Trek because McCoy indirectly refers to the Biblical account of creation as a "myth" in ST: The Wrath of Khan. Even though I am a Christian Star Trek fan, I thought that was pretty ridiculous. Maybe a hard-core, right-wing fundamentalist Christian might have a problem with Star Trek, but I for one do not (I am a moderate Baptist.)

I resent that

 

[uniderth]

My interpretation of the word myth.

Myth = sacred narrative
Myth =/= Lie

Unfortunately, most people use it to mean lie or falsehood.

 

[BillJ]

Myth =/= Lie

Or "didn't happen". I think that fits most of the religious texts the best. Men using the fear of fire and brimstone to keep the populace under control.

 

[borgboy]

I thought it was interesting that when Voyager's crew was spending their free time in the rural 19th century Irish village Fair Haven on the holodeck, the Doctor was the town priest, and discussed that he was working on his sermon, and told Paris and Kim he expected them to attend his sermon, which was met with eye rolls.
I think there's something interesting about the holographic Doctor playing at being a priest. Does that make him a Christian hologram? I don't think so, as it seemed more like he was playing a part, although the Doctor seriously exploring spirituality could've been interesting.
I found it strange that the crew was so enamored of a primitive culture - much like Vic's casino on DS9. At least Kassidy Yates expressed discomfort with being in an environment where in real life she'd have been unwelcome in reality as a black woman, although the holo-environment was clearly scrubbed clean of any prejudice. Sisko countered that they were enjoying it as it should have been, not the way it was. I'd still be uncomfortable celebrating an environment that was historically rife with bigotry, and think cleaning up the unpleasant reality doesn't do service to the people who lived thru those harder times. But I may be too serious. As a gay man I'd be unwelcome in either of those environments, at least openly, so I identify with Kassidy's initial pov.

 

[velour]

I read the episode as a kind of parody on the dangers of organizing an entire society around a single book, like the Bible. They even call the book about the mafia "the book".

The mob boss Oxmyx spoke of "the Book" in very reverential tones. However, I don't know if the writer of that episode meant for "the Book" to be a metaphor for the Bible, or for anything else for that matter. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't.

I, too, have never made that connection between "the Book" and the Bible. But a viewer is free to project his/her own thoughts about what the writer intended or unintended.

I know it's an even longer stretch, but maybe "the Book" was a metaphor for Marx's Das Kapital or Mao's little red book. God knows, there have been totalitarian, atheistic (atheistic in terms of the official regime policy) societies built around the ideas in those books.

 

[fireproof78]

I thought the book was a reference to "Mobsters of Chicago" left behind.