CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[Mudd]

Entertaining definitely. Showing Trek fans in a good light? I'm not so sure.

The Internet by its nature doesn't show Trek fans in a good light; too many post.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

That is assuming that he was authorized. Why didn't the announcement come from CBS/Paramount? Why have there been no other announcements from their offices confirming this? Why would the announcement come "a few weeks" before its finality? Just because he's produces the Star Trek movies, doesn't make him an authorized spokesperson.

I'll believe it when the suit is dropped or it comes from CBS, Paramount, or L & L

You're forgetting that he said this at an official Paramount event, while on the Paramount lot, where he is representing Paramount as much as his own production company in respect of a soon to be release Paramount movie.

Sure, he may not be authorised, but do you honestly think a man of the experience of Abrams, who is about to release a movie with Paramount (that he has a major financial stake in) is really going to upset the apple cart and risk getting himself sued, just to appease a small minority of 10k or so Trek fans?

I find that highly unlikely. I think some folks are clutching at straws and while certain scenarios may still be possible, in all honestly are pretty unlikely.

 

[Red Shirt]

Basically, I suspect JJ doesn't care. He's so far above it all, it's no skin off his nose.

I can't speak to the point of knowing JJ's mind, that wasn't my point. AP went well out of his way looking down his nose at JJ & CBS/P so he could drum up support for donor money bringing the world Tru-Trek. AP has also sneered and scoffed at fan films trying to throw them under the bus. Now he's doing a 180 grasping for straws reaching out to anyone that will listen to his carefully orchestrated narrative. That's just about the most two-faced b.s. I've ever seen.

 

[mos6507]

All I'm saying is that for their own sanity I think it is time for some on the anti-Axanar side to bow out and devote their energies to better pursuits

Well said!

If AP had gotten taken down the way most here hoped, it would have also deterred other fan-films. Witness the drop-off in STC fundraising. The best possible outcome would be for CBS/P to find a way to formally allow fan-films to exist rather than have them keep operating in this constant cloud of fear. It looks to me like that will happen, and that's more important for the fan community than the cheap satisfaction of seeing AP's pride get crushed.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Well said!

If AP had gotten taken down the way most here hoped, it would have also deterred other fan-films. Witness the drop-off in STC fundraising. The best possible outcome would be for CBS/P to find a way to formally allow fan-films to exist rather than have them keep operating in this constant cloud of fear. It looks to me like that will happen, and that's more important for the fan community than the cheap satisfaction of seeing AP's pride get crushed.

For the most part I agree, but I can understand the frustration. Peters has given me bad vibes from the start. I suspect he is exactly what people say he is, and if, one day, he gets his comeuppance I can't say I'll be crying into my cornflakes. I suspect that in all likelhood he is a hoodwinker and untrustworthy/difficult to work with or for. That's without his lashings of obvious hubris.

But what you say is true. Is seeing his destruction really in the interests of fandom at large? I'll be honest, I've never been a big fan film person and I originally couldn't care if he took the whole lot down with him. But the more I've thought about it the more I've realised that my own personal view of fan films isn't the point. Fans like making them and other fans enjoy watching them....and why the hell not? Those aren't the fans trying to get rich out of the whole thing.

I feel now that it's a lose/lose for some fans however this case plays out. On the one hand what you say happens if this settles is that Peters becomes a gloating and detestable martyr, which will be hard to stomach. On the other hand if he were to be destroyed then it would indeed mean he'd likely take a lot of fan films productions down with him, which surely isn't what most of the anti-Axanar people want to see? So really the only winner in the first scenario is Peters and the only winners in the second is those who have a personal vendetta against him (we know why they are) and just want to see him ruined at all costs. So I think either outcome comes bundled with it's own downside for most fans.

 

[CaptGrumpy]

You're forgetting that he said this at an official Paramount event, while on the Paramount lot, where he is representing Paramount as much as his own production company in respect of a soon to be release Paramount movie.

Sure, he may not be authorised, but do you honestly think a man of the experience of Abrams, who is about to release a movie with Paramount (that he has a major financial stake in) is really going to upset the apple cart and risk getting himself sued, just to appease a small minority of 10k or so Trek fans?

I find that highly unlikely. I think some folks are clutching at straws and while certain scenarios may still be possible, in all honestly are pretty unlikely.

So why hasn't there been confirmation from the plaintiffs or the plaintiffs lawyers?

 

[CaptGrumpy]

I feel now that it's a lose/lose for some fans however this case plays out. On the one hand what you say happens if this settles is that Peters becomes a gloating and detestable martyr, which will be hard to stomach. On the other hand if he were to be destroyed than it would indeed mean he'd likely take a lot of fan films productions down with him, which surely isn't what most of the anti-Axanar people want to see? So really the only winner in the first scenario is Peters and the only winners in the second is those who have a personal vendetta against him (we know why they are) and just want to see him ruined at all costs. So I think either outcome comes bundled with it's own downside for most fans.

It all depends on the settlement. The terms of the settlement may be something he doesn't like, but may have to accept.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

So why hasn't there been confirmation from the plaintiffs or the plaintiffs lawyers?

There's no reason or obligation for them to comment. If pressed, their spokespeople would almost certainly say that it's an ongoing matter in litigation and they can't comment.

It all depends on the settlement. The terms of the settlement may be something he doesn't like, but may have to accept.

Peters' lawyers can't make him accept a settlement he doesn't want to accept. They work for him, not vice versa. They can recommend he accept it and plead the case for accepting, but if he doesn't agree to the settlement terms, there's no settlement.

 

[MikeH92467]

So why hasn't there been confirmation from the plaintiffs or the plaintiffs lawyers?

uh....because it's Saturday?

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Regardless of how one feels about the ultimate outcome, this is really better for everyone. People go about their business. Let sour grapes be sour grapes.

 

[jespah]

That is assuming that he was authorized. Why didn't the announcement come from CBS/Paramount? Why have there been no other announcements from their offices confirming this? Why would the announcement come "a few weeks" before its finality? Just because he's produces the Star Trek movies, doesn't make him an authorized spokesperson.

I'll believe it when the suit is dropped or it comes from CBS, Paramount, or L & L

Agreed. This is not the authorized source.

As for Abrams's motivations for talking, it's hard to say. Of course we're not in the man's head, but this was a PR event and that means a message was being sent about Beyond. The event was to make fans happy and give them a taste of the new film, far as I am aware.

Even if Abrams was somehow, for some bizarre reason, authorized to talk about Axanar (Why? He's not in Legal or Licensing), then why then? How incredibly odd at best.

It is also rather telling that even Axanar, even AP, had no idea this was going to be said.

It's also - even giving everybody 100% of the benefit of the doubt - a premature announcement if nothing else.

Why then?

It is odd. Odd stuff makes my antennae wave.

 

[CaptGrumpy]

There's no reason or obligation for them to comment. If pressed, their spokespeople would almost certainly say that it's an ongoing matter in litigation and they can't comment.



Peters' lawyers can't make him accept a settlement he doesn't want to accept. They work for him, not vice versa. They can recommend he accept it and plead the case for accepting, but if he doesn't agree to the settlement terms, there's no settlement.

OK, I meant that it might not be the settlement he wants, but the lesser of 2 evils. Sorry I wasn't clear about that.

 

[urbandefault]

Wasn't it specified in the judge's timeline that court-ordered settlement negotiations should be starting right about now? It seems to me that this is all moving right on schedule. Unless a settlement is reached, response to the suit from the defendant is still due in a few days.

At that point, if no settlement is reached, discovery begins. Right?

I think this is still a long way from being over.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

Abrams is more than just a mere producer for the film, he's the owner and head of Bad Robot. I imagine he has a better idea of what's going on with the Axanar thing than any of us.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

So why hasn't there been confirmation from the plaintiffs or the plaintiffs lawyers?

Supposedly there has been, at least in terms of the settlement negotiations.

https://twitter.com/adambvary/status/733886588371931140

I believe that 1701News also asked them and got a similar response.

http://1701news.com/node/1201/abrams-axanar-lawsuit-going-away.html

I find it unlikely that the studio would mention fan film guidelines if they had no intention of settling the case and creating a way for fan films to continue. Surely they'd just have said "we have no comment to make at this time"?

Look, I find the turnabout as surprising as the next man, and from a legal point of view quite disappointing. But my common sense tells me that Abrams is much more likely to have gone through the appropriate channels before saying anything than he not having done.

At the very least, even in the unlikely scenario that Abrams didn't have authorisation and this does somehow continue on to trial, is it really worthy hanging on to such faint hope? Unless a person is a donor and has a financial stake in it, I don't see the point.

 

[CaptGrumpy]

Abrams is more than just a mere producer for the film, he's the owner and head of Bad Robot. I imagine he has a better idea of what's going on with the Axanar thing than any of us.

Your logic is faulty. I'm not saying that the statement is unauthorized (although I personally don't believe that he is),
but, because he is owner of Bad Robot by itself doesn't make him an authorized Paramount spokesman. It certainly doesn't make him an authorized spokesman for a seprate company: CBS

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Wasn't it specified in the judge's timeline that court-ordered settlement negotiations should be starting right about now? It seems to me that this is all moving right on schedule. Unless a settlement is reached, response to the suit from the defendant is still due in a few days.

At that point, if no settlement is reached, discovery begins. Right?

I think this is still a long way from being over.

ADR doesn't oblige parties to make statements like those made by Abrams or (allegedly) the studio. Plus, I think the fact that this seemingly took Peters by surprise suggests to me that this is more about discussions in house between Abrams, Lin and the studio about the vaolue of continuing that it has been about discussions between the parties to the litigation. I don't think Peters would be using phrases like "cautiously optimistic" if yesterday's announcement by Abrams had come as a result of the ADR process.

 

[CaptGrumpy]

Supposedly there has been, at least in terms of the settlement negotiations.

https://twitter.com/adambvary/status/733886588371931140

I believe that 1701News also asked them and got a similar response.

http://1701news.com/node/1201/abrams-axanar-lawsuit-going-away.html

I find it unlikely that the studio would mention fan film guidelines if they had no intention of settling the case and creating a way for fan films to continue. Surely they'd just have said "we have no comment to make at this time"?

Look, I find the turnabout as surprising as the next man, and from a legal point of view quite disappointing. But my common sense tells me that Abrams is much more likely to have gone through the appropriate channels before saying anything than he not having done.

At the very least, even in the unlikely scenario that Abrams didn't have authorisation and this does somehow continue on to trial, is it really worthy hanging on to such faint hope? Unless a person is a donor and has a financial stake in it, I don't see the point.

A settlement doesn't mean the suit is being dropped. The suit is dropped if the plaintiff finds that it can't win and they chose not to pursue it.

 

[BigJake]

CBS have confirmed they're settling the suit. (See the sixth paragraph of that report.) It seems probable to me that Abrams' remarks about what this means will prove accurate, unless of course Axanar refuses to settle and demands to go to court for some reason. (I guess it's still just in the realm of the possible they could do that, though given the circumstances it would be baffling.)

 

[Red Shirt]

You know, as much as I loath Peters and the whole Axanar enterprise (no pun intended), and as much as I personally think settling this case is a mistake on the part of the studio, I find the reaction to this news very sad on the part of a lot of Anti-Axanar folks. I think it betrays their attitudes somewhat.

Let's be honest. Some individuals associated with some of the Anti-Axanar groups have taken this way too seriously. Those individuals, often whose names tends to appear most frequently on any kind of talkback or group associated with Axanar where Axanar criticism is permitted, have been obsessing over every little detail day after day after day. Sometimes this has gotten a little sour. The explanation has always been about protecting IP rights and artist's interests. In some cases journalism and free speech has been used to justify it....and Peters, with his arrogant and dismissive approach and use of immature labels like "haters", has helped to legitimise such claims by quite simply behaving far worse than anyone on the other side. I'm sure those people do care about those elements, but you just don't invest the kind of time and energy in this sort of thing unless you have an axe to grind, either through obsession or grudge. Often these people aren't even Axanar donors. Some of the behaviour has included character assassinations and targeting people they have deemed to be guilty by association with Peters. Sometimes it has been out and out nasty and vitriolic. The nature of it all has been such that from January onward I have felt less and less inclined to participate in Axanar related discussions as some of the anti-Axanar people have felt like pack hounds out for blood. For all their stupidity and delusions, I haven't found the Axanar supporters to quite as obsessive.

Now we have this announcement and some of the behaviour of the anti-Axanar people in the past 24 hours has been very telling, from desperate speculation about just how the settlement might undermine Peters to clearly emotional sore loser blog posts and now I've even seen speculation in certain places that Paramount will bow out of the litigation but CBS will continue. Anti-Axanar people are also not now holding back with throwing any label Peters way, such as shyster and con artist. It all seems to be motivated by a sense of denial and chagrin that Peters may come out of this living to see another day when, let's face it, at least a percentage of the Anti-Axanar folks wanted to see the man ruined, whether they want to admit it publicly or not. Even if Axanar still doesn't get made and Peters has to repay the donors, the reality is that a settlement that also sees guidelines set for fan film use, that has arisen out of pressure from Lin and Bad Robot, is unlikely to be of the kind that significantly penalises Peters. If it is an out of court settlement then we won't know the full details. Even if it is settlement by way of a consensual court order, it may not be in the form that will satisfy those who want to see the comeuppance of Peters. I think if some where honest with themselves they know this to be true, and they know that no matter what they say the inevitable gloating of Lord Peters and his cult members is going to happen come what may.

All I'm saying is that for their own sanity I think it is time for some on the anti-Axanar side to bow out and devote their energies to better pursuits. For others maybe it's time to take a break, at least until more details or settlement and/or guidelines come through. Quite simply the influence of Abrams & Lin and the decision not to pursue the litigation outstrips anything anyone on the anti-Axanar folks can do, whether Peters seemingly getting away with his behaviour is justified or not. I think maybe it's time to be graceful in what in all likelihood is defeat. Only time will tell now whether or not Axanar gets made and Peters can fulfill his obligation to the donors. Let Peters be the author of his own downfall, which he likely will be one day, if not any time soon. With that in mind I don't see any benefit to continuing to push for division among fans if the studio themselves no longer feel it's in their interests to go after Peters.

Just my two cents. .

No. People here have been diligent pointing out some lines shouldn't be crossed during the thread topic discussion. Also, your post pointing out the awful negatives as you see them are full of specious generalities about the people posting on this thread. What's your point? Try to shame people into silence? Make them feel bad for having a discussion?