It was? 
Ok.
Ok.
Spoilers STAR TREK BEYOND
- Thread starter Khan 2.0
- Start date
Karl Urban's portrayal of McCoy is widely praised for being faithful and authentic while avoiding caricature. It's not damned.
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Depends on who you ask. It comes very close to caricature to some people.
Generally, I have noticed that it's mainly tos purists fans and reboot haters that prefer Urban, but then many of those still don't get it's another reality and years later, they still lobby for the reboot to 'restore' the prime verse because they think it was rewritten..
My problem is, if you like this Mccoy because he is faithful to the original fine but proposing him as the 'best' and an example to follow for the other actors is unfair because, in the end, these people were NEVER asked to make an impersonation and thus, basically, the others are doing what was asked to them more than Urban. If he doesn't get that his character is an alternate version rather than just a younger version of Deforest fine, but it's not the context of the trek he works into. Quinto, instead, is fully cognizant of that fact and, no doubt because he got Nimoy's blessings too, makes an effort to create another version of Spock that makes sense in his own context and is, also, more contemporany (let's not forget he represents mixed people. Watch how mixed people were represented in the 60s compared to nowadays where they are not portrayed as people who have to choose only the 'white parent' anymore)
But like I said before, Urban is kind of justified making an impersonation because his character is underdeveloped and the writers, themselves, added nothing new to him (unlike Spock, Kirk and Uhura). There is really nothing that critics can use to diversify him from the other, no new facet or layer added to him that might people go 'the alternate reality gives us a pretext to see a side of him we never saw before' (which is something often said about Spock)
Quinto can't do that because for him, for his character, it would mean turning Spock into a caricature. Also, people (the audience of these movies that like them) have for the most part praised and embraced his Spock already and the differences give them something to talk about, and make him less predictable too.
The fact people have no idea what Quinto is talking about in terms of Spock in stb and don't know what is done with his character is good.
My problem is, if you like this Mccoy because he is faithful to the original fine but proposing him as the 'best' and an example to follow for the other actors is unfair because, in the end, these people were NEVER asked to make an impersonation and thus, basically, the others are doing what was asked to them more than Urban. If he doesn't get that his character is an alternate version rather than just a younger version of Deforest fine, but it's not the context of the trek he works into. Quinto, instead, is fully cognizant of that fact and, no doubt because he got Nimoy's blessings too, makes an effort to create another version of Spock that makes sense in his own context and is, also, more contemporany (let's not forget he represents mixed people. Watch how mixed people were represented in the 60s compared to nowadays where they are not portrayed as people who have to choose only the 'white parent' anymore)
But like I said before, Urban is kind of justified making an impersonation because his character is underdeveloped and the writers, themselves, added nothing new to him (unlike Spock, Kirk and Uhura). There is really nothing that critics can use to diversify him from the other, no new facet or layer added to him that might people go 'the alternate reality gives us a pretext to see a side of him we never saw before' (which is something often said about Spock)
Quinto can't do that because for him, for his character, it would mean turning Spock into a caricature. Also, people (the audience of these movies that like them) have for the most part praised and embraced his Spock already and the differences give them something to talk about, and make him less predictable too.
The fact people have no idea what Quinto is talking about in terms of Spock in stb and don't know what is done with his character is good.
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I really like nuMccoy and nuKirk
I like nuSpock, nuUhura, and nuScotty.
I can give or take nuSulu
And then there's Checkov
I like nuSpock, nuUhura, and nuScotty.
I can give or take nuSulu
And then there's Checkov
I like all the cast of New Trek
There's quite a difference between "finding new facets of a character" and "entirely putting the character into the bin and give a new character the olriginal name".
I think they did a great job with Kirk. It was a new spin on the character, the acting was wildly different from Shatner's mannerisms, but Pine was immediately recognizable as "Kirk".
Quinto just looks like Spock (and hell, he looks almost identical to Spock), but his whole personality and characterisation is wrong. It's a delicate question: How much can you change an existing character, before he ceases to be this character and becomes a new one? What if you take away the core elements of a character? What if Superman randomly starts killing people and acting out of revenge? What if Sherlock Holmes is suddenly dense and solves crimes purely through luck? What if James Bond suddenly feels inadequate around women and has a "no-killing" rule? And what if Spock suddenly is an emotional rage machine?
Again, all those changes may actually make sense if the story is correctly crafted around those changes. But for me personally, that's just not the original character anymore, but a cheap cashgrab to pull the name recognition of a popular character to your own creation.
But I find the traits of Abrams Spock totally recognizable as Spock. The only difference is that we don't have 79 episodes to flesh the character out. The character is being dealt ordeals the original character didn't have to face.
I remain optimistic about Star Trek Beyond. After the ridiculous hype surrounding Into Darkness I think doing it this way is more sensible. I remember fans complaining 6 months before The Force Awakens that no full-length had been released. In today's world with people having a short attention span a late hype train/ marketing campaign is better. Star Trek Beyond will have relatively little competition anyway.
Interesting comparison of STID to STBs build up to release
http://trekmovie.com/2016/05/02/com...eyond-promo-lagging-way-behind-into-darkness/
http://trekmovie.com/2016/05/02/com...eyond-promo-lagging-way-behind-into-darkness/
There's barely any difference at all. 2 Trailers by April for a May release, and 2 trailers by May for a July release. 15 photos compared to 10? I'm still trying to figure out what all the fuss is about.
RAMA
I think it has been pointed out that Quinto's Spock is far closer to some aspects of TOS Spock than the films Spock, which is the far more familiar face. The films' Spock is far more at peace with himself, and has decades to refine his duel nature of half-human and half-Vulcan.
Quinto's Spock, like Pine's Kirk, still have the raw material to come similar to their Prime counterparts, but they are taking a much more rough and intense path than in Prime.
But, this is the nature of marketing these days. There is an expectation to have as much info on a film as possible prior to its release. The production companies face the thankless task of trying to balance too much information too soon and too little too late in order to generate the appropriate amount of hype for their film.
Just because it has Star Trek in the name doesn't mean that they still are not worried about marketing too early. It is money they are investing after all.
Again I must ask the question, who do you think Spock is? Because I very much see the Spock in the new films as Spock. The character isn't as much changed as facing challenges that force different aspects of the character to the surface. What's boiling beneath Spock's cool, logical and emotionless exterior is where the core of the character lies. What he does when that veneer of logic is stripped away offers insight into the character, be it from Pon Far, spores, timey whimey nonsense, emotional trauma or something else. It can be something as simple as in "Galileo Seven" where he abandons logic for a long shot gamble. Of course he denies it was an illogical emotional choice when confronted about it, because that's also who Spock is. One thing that Star Trek doesn't do is promote the Vulcan way as a "positive". Humanity, with all it's flaws, emotions and gut feelings is the better way and Spock's devotion to logic and emotional control makes him a semi-tragic character. One that looks at humans with a certain envy.
I found Quinto's Spock to be more emotional than any other character on the Enterprise in the first two reboot films, and kind of cold or just... mean. And yes, I know, planet destroyed blah blah mother dead blah blah blah not so friendly best friend because they're friends in TOS killed by evil superman blah blah blah.
These aren't faults in Quinto's performance though, just the usual Orci/Kurtzman/Lindelof shenanigans. Nimoy's Spock is incredibly likeable from the onset and is much warmer.
I did like what I'd seen of Quinto's Spock in the Beyond trailer though, it was very reminiscent of classic Spock. I think he was a great casting choice, along with the rest of the cast.
These aren't faults in Quinto's performance though, just the usual Orci/Kurtzman/Lindelof shenanigans. Nimoy's Spock is incredibly likeable from the onset and is much warmer.
I did like what I'd seen of Quinto's Spock in the Beyond trailer though, it was very reminiscent of classic Spock. I think he was a great casting choice, along with the rest of the cast.
Nobody's forgetting anything.
Spock smiling in two out of 79 episodes, one of them being a pilot with virtually no resemblance to the rest of the series in terms of characters, doesn't prove much
Spock smiling in two out of 79 episodes, one of them being a pilot with virtually no resemblance to the rest of the series in terms of characters, doesn't prove much
Nobody's forgetting anything.
Spock smiling in two out of 79 episodes, one of them being a pilot with virtually no resemblance to the rest of the series in terms of characters, doesn't prove much
You do realize that there is a lot more where that came from?
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