It's been a couple of years, but I don't think Jonathan ever actually said that. Clark asked him if he should have let the kids die and Jonathan replied along the lines of "I don't know. Maybe."
Spoilers Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice - Grading & Discussion
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It's been a couple of years, but I don't think Jonathan ever actually said that. Clark asked him if he should have let the kids die and Jonathan replied along the lines of "I don't know. Maybe."
Which is the whole problem, Jonathon Kent shouldn't have suggested, on any level, that Clark should have let a bus full of kids drown. "I don't know, maybe," is not only disgustingly non committal on the event, it also very much suggests that it would have been okay if Clark did nothing and let the kids on the bus die.
And I say again: Fuck Frank Miller.
And I say again: Fuck Frank Miller.
Batman was still angry, he just redirected his anger. He's a pretty smart guy and once Lois helped him put two and two together, he realized he was being manipulated all along. Then in the final fight, Superman's sacrifice made him realize that he had been wrong about Superman all along and was inspired to change his outlook. At the end of the movie, even though we only saw him once, he was much more the "traditional" Batman.
A world of this. His response should have been, "Of course not, son. If you see people in trouble, you have a responsibility to help them. You did the right thing. Just be careful."
Nah, Bruce Wayne is not well known for having childhood tragedy drastically effect the rest of his life.
Hell they even replayed the relevant parts of the origin flashback.
<<Black Widow had a face changing device which pretty much made the first hour and a half of The Winter Soldier pointless because they could've just used that to avoid having to go on the run and could've infiltrated Hydra at their convenience.>>
Oh my god, I never thought of that before
Did she have the device early in the film though?
In a similar scene in a recent episode of "Supergirl" young Kara, during her first days on earth, hears a woman calling for help from a nearby car accident. She rushes over and saves the mother and baby passengers of the burning car moments before it explodes. Later we see her talking to her Earth father (played by Dean Cain) who sits with her and says he was able to manage an excuse for her to pull off the feat, given that she wasn't too highly witnessed, saying she got lucky. He tells her what she did was good and right, but the excuse he came up with can only work once and she needs to be more careful from now on and that the world has its hero (Superman.) He doesn't tell her to maybe next time let the kid and mother die, just that there's heroes out there to do these things and right now she needs to me more careful about protecting herself and those close to her (since finding out about her could open up her and her family to scrutiny.)
(Though I quibbled, that the way he phrases this "sort of" suggests there's a "man" out there doing these things and she need not concern herself with these things. I don't think the show meant to suggest that this is what he's saying but it could maybe be seen that way.)
The Supergirl show, as I keep saying, is doing the notion of "Super" right.
Just because some things suck in other movies, doesn't mean it's OK for more things to suck in newer movies.
I thought John Schneider played a great Pa Kent so the movie was a little jarring to me.
The music can be made to fit, just like all the seventies rock in "A Knight's Tale." There was no classic rock in the middle ages.
Kor
I find superman more interesting if he chooses to do right to a certain degree instead of being straight up told it's his obligation to be a hero by his dad, but that's just me. The smallville dad even wanted him to be safe rather than a hero even in the first episode when he rescues Lex from the car.
I saw the movie yesterday in IMAX 3D. Let me start by saying there are genre movies that I think the complete opposite of than most people or most critics..some examples: After Earth, Transcendence (possibly the most misunderstood movie in history), Day the Earth Stood Still(remake).
Let me further say I collected comics up until 1989, then sold them all. I read Dark Knight when it came out, and saw John Byrne's re-creation of the Man of Steel. I re-entered the "comic world" with digital copies that I read from time to time, though not constantly a few years ago. I'm aware of The Death of Superman but only read the central story, not the follow ups. Also, since returning, I've noticed that in the comic book world, DC has since far surpassed Marvel in both artwork and stories
Having established that, it's pretty clear to me that the world of Superman Vs Batman (BvS) is not just directly related but almost exclusively from those sources. Dialogue is repeated verbatim. While it is often established in media outlets that psychologists consider Bruce Wayne/Batman as mentally disturbed in almost EVERY incarnation, the Dark Night/BvS Batman is ready and willing to kill, use guns and battle Superman face to face. He's extreme. In Dark Knight, as well as some other stories, Superman is often compared to a god, aloof, somewhat impersonal, but still with the weight of the world on his shoulders. I believe this is what we see in BvS. It does make for a less "fun" Superman, perhaps a less "fun" movie in the Marvel sense, but it's not unprecedented. I feel Superman will be more of a "team" player and less dark in Justice League, but who can say if Darksied is the central villain..Apokalips is pretty dreary.
Far from Snyder and company not understanding the characters, he is giving us the most extreme version from the source material itself. While some critics acknowledge this, it's possibly not really understood well enough.
As far as the critics go. They have a few points. Yes, it's darker than MoS, possibly a little too much so. Yes, DC tries to put too much into the running time of ONE movie, but the sum of what was attempted for the greater DC movie universe, is really not much different than we've seen in any one or two Marvel Universe movies. We could have lost one or two dream sequences from the movie for tighter editing, but they don't really harm the movie too much. Some of the scenes will certainly pay off in other DCU movies, much like Babylon 5 or other Marvel films.
I boils down to being entertained by the movie, because in reality BvS isn't solving the world's problems. So yes, the movie entertained me. It was epic in scale, introduced us to the Justice League members, foreshadowed Darkseid, and gave us very good live action versions of the comics, including a nice performance by Affleck and Gadot as Wonder woman. I felt it was a better movie than Deadpool.
A-
Let me further say I collected comics up until 1989, then sold them all. I read Dark Knight when it came out, and saw John Byrne's re-creation of the Man of Steel. I re-entered the "comic world" with digital copies that I read from time to time, though not constantly a few years ago. I'm aware of The Death of Superman but only read the central story, not the follow ups. Also, since returning, I've noticed that in the comic book world, DC has since far surpassed Marvel in both artwork and stories
Having established that, it's pretty clear to me that the world of Superman Vs Batman (BvS) is not just directly related but almost exclusively from those sources. Dialogue is repeated verbatim. While it is often established in media outlets that psychologists consider Bruce Wayne/Batman as mentally disturbed in almost EVERY incarnation, the Dark Night/BvS Batman is ready and willing to kill, use guns and battle Superman face to face. He's extreme. In Dark Knight, as well as some other stories, Superman is often compared to a god, aloof, somewhat impersonal, but still with the weight of the world on his shoulders. I believe this is what we see in BvS. It does make for a less "fun" Superman, perhaps a less "fun" movie in the Marvel sense, but it's not unprecedented. I feel Superman will be more of a "team" player and less dark in Justice League, but who can say if Darksied is the central villain..Apokalips is pretty dreary.
Far from Snyder and company not understanding the characters, he is giving us the most extreme version from the source material itself. While some critics acknowledge this, it's possibly not really understood well enough.
As far as the critics go. They have a few points. Yes, it's darker than MoS, possibly a little too much so. Yes, DC tries to put too much into the running time of ONE movie, but the sum of what was attempted for the greater DC movie universe, is really not much different than we've seen in any one or two Marvel Universe movies. We could have lost one or two dream sequences from the movie for tighter editing, but they don't really harm the movie too much. Some of the scenes will certainly pay off in other DCU movies, much like Babylon 5 or other Marvel films.
I boils down to being entertained by the movie, because in reality BvS isn't solving the world's problems. So yes, the movie entertained me. It was epic in scale, introduced us to the Justice League members, foreshadowed Darkseid, and gave us very good live action versions of the comics, including a nice performance by Affleck and Gadot as Wonder woman. I felt it was a better movie than Deadpool.
A-
I don't see what the fuss is.
This was a really good movie. It's not the best movie I've ever seen but I was without a doubt entertained, had a ton of fun and held in a piss for way too long because I didn't want to miss a second of it.
I admit I was worried about Affleck being Bats, but he pulled it off well - I would love to see a solo Batman movie now. Wonder Woman, apart from being a total hot mess, was very good. I've always held that Cavill is the best Superman and he maintained that in this movie. Lex was just so-so. Jeremy Irons was also good.
The editing was a bit choppy but as a whole the movie looked really slick and well choreographed. That fight scene where Batman rescues Martha and takes out all the dudes guarding her is one of the coolest things I've ever seen in a movie. Think that may be my favorite Batmobile, the thing kicked ass. I loved the end and how it set up the path to the Justice League.
I dunno, maybe people's expectations were too high because finally after all these years two of the world's most popular comic bros were in a movie together. I get that.
Or maybe they can show us on the doll where Zack Snyder touched them:
Solid 8/10
This was a really good movie. It's not the best movie I've ever seen but I was without a doubt entertained, had a ton of fun and held in a piss for way too long because I didn't want to miss a second of it.
I admit I was worried about Affleck being Bats, but he pulled it off well - I would love to see a solo Batman movie now. Wonder Woman, apart from being a total hot mess, was very good. I've always held that Cavill is the best Superman and he maintained that in this movie. Lex was just so-so. Jeremy Irons was also good.
The editing was a bit choppy but as a whole the movie looked really slick and well choreographed. That fight scene where Batman rescues Martha and takes out all the dudes guarding her is one of the coolest things I've ever seen in a movie. Think that may be my favorite Batmobile, the thing kicked ass. I loved the end and how it set up the path to the Justice League.
I dunno, maybe people's expectations were too high because finally after all these years two of the world's most popular comic bros were in a movie together. I get that.
Or maybe they can show us on the doll where Zack Snyder touched them:
Solid 8/10
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By far those most accurate measure of a good movie!!
I think part of the "fuss" is a lot of Marvel and Marvel fan backlash. Whole sites have dedicated themselves to the SvB backlash. It's almost comical. I think they are being threatened by DCU because they are finally making a move into thier "territory". DC is already better than Marvel in comics and on TV, now they are putting considerable money into the movies.
https://deadline.com/2016/03/batman-v-superman-200-million-box-office-1201729199/
Second highest ever Wednesday in March
Second highest ever Wednesday in March
I think another fundamental problem I had with the movie was that it didn't give you any clear person to really root for. In MOS I found myself rooting for Superman all the way through, whether it was against the school bullies or the obnoxious trucker or against Zod and his soldiers at the end as he fought so hard against them.
But for the vast majority of BvS it's not clearly who the heck you're supposed to root for. You watch Batman go through all his preparations to stop Superman, but it's not exactly like you want to see him succeed at that. And the same goes for Superman stopping Batman.
It all just feels so muddled, and even worse you know you're just watching two great heroes be duped and manipulated by a weaselly villain the entire time.
But for the vast majority of BvS it's not clearly who the heck you're supposed to root for. You watch Batman go through all his preparations to stop Superman, but it's not exactly like you want to see him succeed at that. And the same goes for Superman stopping Batman.
It all just feels so muddled, and even worse you know you're just watching two great heroes be duped and manipulated by a weaselly villain the entire time.
I think the question is supposed to be up for debate...until a mutual threat and understanding takes over. Too many people want a clear cut answer. There isn't one.
RAMA
According to Deadline, the projected profit on this project from all revenue streams is expected to be around 200 million. Global box office is projected at about 925 million; Deadline reports that any figure above 800 million would have been considered by Warners to be a good launch for their DC movie sked.
http://deadline.com/2016/03/batman-v-superman-opening-weekend-box-office-records-1201726300/
http://deadline.com/2016/03/batman-v-superman-opening-weekend-box-office-records-1201726300/
I saw it last night and was pleasantly surprised by how good it was. Some of the set up for other movies could have been left out and replaced with that clip of Steppenwolf that's going around the net but overall it was really fun.
Snyder's take on the characters is certainly not my personal take but there has never been a version of Batman or Superman on screen that matches exactly how I feel about the character. I liked the fact that they were both fooled by Lex throughout the movie and didn't even realize that it was him pulling the strings--it shows that he's an intellectual match for Batman. What's interesting for me is that Lex basically wins at the end of the movie, even though we don't feel like he's won. He's killed Superman and opened the door for Darkseid to come to Earth; presumably Lex is planning to be rewarded somehow for all of this.
Snyder's take on the characters is certainly not my personal take but there has never been a version of Batman or Superman on screen that matches exactly how I feel about the character. I liked the fact that they were both fooled by Lex throughout the movie and didn't even realize that it was him pulling the strings--it shows that he's an intellectual match for Batman. What's interesting for me is that Lex basically wins at the end of the movie, even though we don't feel like he's won. He's killed Superman and opened the door for Darkseid to come to Earth; presumably Lex is planning to be rewarded somehow for all of this.