CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[Smoked Salmon]

Who remembers the uproar when Bob Orci told someone to "fuck off"?

Where is the from? Who was it sent to?

 

[The Transformed Man]

Not sure if anyone linked this, the court summons for Mr. Peters:

http://skipoliva.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/031122636857.pdf

Maybe Axanar can make a quick buck and send out framed copies for a generous donate of $100.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Adding together all the itemized salaries brings you to $70,386.57. The $48,032.41 are "miscellaneous" salaries that Axanar hasn't bothered to identify on this very transparent report.

Correct. A comment on Alec's cries of poverty and uncompensation for 60 hour work weeks and what not. Looking over the report it is difficult to see how that 38k went to anything but his personal living expenses. His travel was treated as a "business expense", promotional materials were also treated a business expense, all of the equipment and materials used in his day job were acquired by using donor funds, so there really isn't much else for that 38k to be spent on other than his personal expenses. It also doesn't take a genius to understand how easy it would be for Boomer the cat to get a portion of the $48k spent on "misc. salaries"
So, the long and short is that Mr. Peters hasn't exactly been a starving artist. He hasn't made a great living off of this project, but he has made a living, and one he is unlikely to want to give up.

I find it laughable that he cries about making only $38,000 for 60 hour weeks. I worked as newspaper reporter for far less than that and worked more than 60 hour weeks. And I live in the Bay Area, one of the most expensive areas in the US.

 

[Earthrise]

But it is fair to ask CBS and Paramount why they allowed Axanar to dig itself into this deep of a whole before acting. I have yet to find a credible explanation for why they didn't put a stop to Peters the minute he announced Ares Studios.

You don't use a sledgehammer on a flea. Big studios have budgets too, and they have to balance the cost of legal fees (even if they have attorneys on retainer there are additional costs for filings, trials, etc.) with the potential threat of the copyright infringement.
At some point Axanar's flagrant behavior crossed a line and some manager was able to justify the cost to his/her boss.
Keep in mind that CBS/Paramount will undoubtedly want the defendants to pay the legal fees, but if the defendant goes bankrupt, those fees may be hard to recover, and most firms want their clients to pay the fees, and then they refund them after they recover from the defendant.

So the CBS legal department had to justify the up front cost.

The problem with that line of reasoning is that by waiting until after Peters' raised his $1 million, you've now hit him when he's backed into a corner and is more likely to fight until the bitter end.

Is it possible they were waiting until Peters was fully committed to the project? There would be a much better paper trail at this point then back when Ares Studios was first announced.

 

[oswriter]

Not sure if anyone linked this, the court summons for Mr. Peters:

http://skipoliva.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/031122636857.pdf

Maybe Axanar can make a quick buck and send out framed copies for a generous donate of $100.

Yes, I would be the one who posted that.

Actually, if we get as far as discovery, Burnett can produce a "Special Edition DVD" containing all of the documents Axanar is forced to turn over.

 

[The Transformed Man]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

 

[oswriter]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

Yeah, I saw that too. And the Propworx bankruptcy is a whole other ball of wax.

 

[BillJ]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

How can someone really be that inept?

 

[oswriter]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

How can someone really be that inept?

It's possible Propworx is paying rent to Axanar Productions, Inc. But there's nothing about that in the annual report. Indeed, the annual report includes no income except for the Kickstarter funds.

 

[seigezunt]

I will bet anything that Alec is reading all these posts, you can wave to him if you like. His 'marines' are not going to come here because they will hopelessly out numbered and out reasoned with.

That moment when you realize you've been deployed outside the echo chamber.

 

[Karzak]

Adding together all the itemized salaries brings you to $70,386.57. The $48,032.41 are "miscellaneous" salaries that Axanar hasn't bothered to identify on this very transparent report.

Correct. A comment on Alec's cries of poverty and uncompensation for 60 hour work weeks and what not. Looking over the report it is difficult to see how that 38k went to anything but his personal living expenses. His travel was treated as a "business expense", promotional materials were also treated a business expense, all of the equipment and materials used in his day job were acquired by using donor funds, so there really isn't much else for that 38k to be spent on other than his personal expenses. It also doesn't take a genius to understand how easy it would be for Boomer the cat to get a portion of the $48k spent on "misc. salaries"
So, the long and short is that Mr. Peters hasn't exactly been a starving artist. He hasn't made a great living off of this project, but he has made a living, and one he is unlikely to want to give up.

I find it laughable that he cries about making only $38,000 for 60 hour weeks. I worked as newspaper reporter for far less than that and worked more than 60 hour weeks. And I live in the Bay Area, one of the most expensive areas in the US.

Well hell's bells. I live in the valley, not too far from where (allegedly) Alec and Diana live. I make about $25k a year and I can barely afford to feed myself, this town is so expensive.

I do know that if I had nearly $40k at my disposal, I'd be able to live a much more comfortable life than I live now, so I call bullshit on Peters' cries of poverty.

Maybe Prokofiev should have called it "[Alec] Peters & the Wolf"

 

[The Transformed Man]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

Yeah, I saw that too. And the Propworx bankruptcy is a whole other ball of wax.

Speaking of which it would be interesting to find out how Alec sucured a lease agreement, or who signed the lease as he has a Chapter 7 hanging over his head.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

A business that formerly went bankrupt under his watch.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

Fascinating.

 

[BillJ]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

Fascinating.

What if Peters owns all or part of that property?

 

[The Transformed Man]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

How can someone really be that inept?

It's possible Propworx is paying rent to Axanar Productions, Inc. But there's nothing about that in the annual report. Indeed, the annual report includes no income except for the Kickstarter funds.

That's it. I'll bet Propworx basically pays the rent for the studio and his mortage/lease on his home... Axanar is nothing but pocketed money. You can live pretty well on nearly 40 grand a year with no rent or mortgage hanging over your head.

 

[oswriter]

WHOA HOLD THE EFFIN' PHONE. Maybe I'm late to the party, but this is way beyond a no-no. Has anyone bothered to look at Alec's other "business" Propworx???? Check out the address:

http://www.propworx.com/about/contact-us/

So he's basically not only crowd funded a "studio" for his film, but business offices and convenient warehouse space for his other gig.

Yeah, I saw that too. And the Propworx bankruptcy is a whole other ball of wax.

Speaking of which it would be interesting to find out how Alec sucured a lease agreement, or who signed the lease as he has a Chapter 7 hanging over his head.

The Propworx bankruptcy was actually closed without a discharge. I found this note on the court docket:

Chapter 7 Trustee's Report of No Distribution: I, James J Joseph (TR), having been appointed trustee of the estate of the above-named debtor(s), report that I have neither received any property nor paid any money on account of this estate; that I have made a diligent inquiry into the financial affairs of the debtor(s) and the location of the property belonging to the estate; and that there is no property available for distribution from the estate over and above that exempted by law. Pursuant to Fed R Bank P 5009, I hereby certify that the estate of the above-named debtor(s) has been fully administered. I request that I be discharged from any further duties as trustee. Key information about this case as reported in schedules filed by the debtor(s) or otherwise found in the case record: This case was pending for 2 months. Assets Abandoned (without deducting any secured claims): $ 139467.00, Assets Exempt: Not Available, Claims Scheduled: $ 401466.00, Claims Asserted: Not Applicable, Claims scheduled to be discharged without payment (without deducting the value of collateral or debts excepted from discharge): $ 401466.00. Filed by Trustee James J Joseph (TR) (RE: related document(s) Meeting of Creditors with 341). (Joseph (TR), James) (Entered: 10/01/2012)

 

[Jedman67]

I really wish CBS had issued some official guidelines for these productions as it would have eliminated this. But then again, I don't think CBS ever envisioned a production crowdfunding over a million dollars.

My biggest concern is that crap rolls downhill, and it could sweep up other productions that HAVE BEEN playing by the rules. Ultimately Peters' Folly could be the death knell of a very creative outlet for fans, which would be a shame.

The problem is: The moment CBS issues guidelines, they validate the project. I don't believe they can do that.

CBS can issue guidelines while stating that those "guidelines" do not offer permission or license to make fanfilms and are subject to revocation at their discretion. This could "allow" (i.e. intentionally ignore) fan films to be made while making it clear that 'toeing the line' does not make you immune to a C&D or lawsuit of your own.
Or they could do something like Star Wars and explicitly allow fanfilms with some limitations.

I think one of the biggest problems with Axanar is the professional angle.

You know, for all the debates about specific legalities, sometimes in law you have to take a look at the bigger picture. Did it look professional? Yes. Were the production values of a high standard in all areas? Yes. Was it going to be made out of a professional studio? Yes. Is it made by professionals? Yes. Does it use the IP substantially? Yes. And so on. It's clearly gone beyond a fan film.

For all the talk of non-profit status and so on, sometimes the question is as simple as, does it walk like a duck and talk like a duck?

I don't think a professionally made fan film is necessarily a problem; it's one that is competing with CBS/Paramount.
I did tacitly support Axanar before this lawsuit because it looked so professional. But now i realize the producers are anything but.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

If Propworx is trading then presumably Peters will draw a profit, sand therefore salary, from it's income.

It was certainly trading last year. http://trekmovie.com/2015/08/06/propworx-vi-auction-arrives-at-star-trek-las-vegas/

With that in mind, why does he need such a large salary from Axanar?

 

[Smoked Salmon]

I don't think a professionally made fan film

This is a contradiction.