CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[KennyB]

Not posted for a while.

I'll echo what was posted way, way back in the thread - its heartwarming to find that a good 95% of the posters in this thread are in total agreement and that CBS had every right to protect their IP. I was expecting fireworks but nothing of the sort.

I feel the same way..........I kinda left the board for the past 8 or 9 years...would just pop in when something BIG was going on. I was SURE it would be like facebook here.....was so happy when every one was civil and level headed. Kinda freaked me out.

 

[Jon1701]

Not posted for a while.

I'll echo what was posted way, way back in the thread - its heartwarming to find that a good 95% of the posters in this thread are in total agreement and that CBS had every right to protect their IP. I was expecting fireworks but nothing of the sort.

I feel the same way..........I kinda left the board for the past 8 or 9 years...would just pop in when something BIG was going on. I was SURE it would be like facebook here.....was so happy when every one was civil and level headed. Kinda freaked me out.

I just find it bizarre that the Axanar people can't grasp what is going on. Clearly, they are too close to the project. If they just stood back and looked...

I understand that you can be passionate about something but they really did try to do too much too soon. This "we know trek better than they do" and "they are alienating the fan base" is ludicrous.

I was mildy intruiged by the prelude thing. Mildy.

I prefer actual Star Trek though myself...

 

[Mark 2000]

Looks like Roddenberry.com is taking a stance on this. A really odd one too.
https://www.facebook.com/roddenberr...39143388143/10153272651953144/?type=3&theater

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Looks like Roddenberry.com is taking a stance on this. A really odd one too.
https://www.facebook.com/roddenberr...39143388143/10153272651953144/?type=3&theater

No offense to Rod, but he doesn't speak for his parents. I don't take much notice of what he says either way.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Not posted for a while.

I'll echo what was posted way, way back in the thread - its heartwarming to find that a good 95% of the posters in this thread are in total agreement and that CBS had every right to protect their IP. I was expecting fireworks but nothing of the sort.

I feel the same way..........I kinda left the board for the past 8 or 9 years...would just pop in when something BIG was going on. I was SURE it would be like facebook here.....was so happy when every one was civil and level headed. Kinda freaked me out.

I just find it bizarre that the Axanar people can't grasp what is going on. Clearly, they are too close to the project. If they just stood back and looked...

I understand that you can be passionate about something but they really did try to do too much too soon. This "we know trek better than they do" and "they are alienating the fan base" is ludicrous.

I was mildy intruiged by the prelude thing. Mildy.

I prefer actual Star Trek though myself...

The thing is that I am anti-JJTrek and I am less that excited about a Trek series with Kurtzman at the helm, but that doesn't prevent me from seeing what is going on here. I think the whole notion of Axanar appealing to the anti-Abrams crowd is a fallacy. At the end of the day all Axanar has offered us so far is war, destruction and phasers - which is one of the chief criticisms of JJtrek.

 

[drt]

Looks like Roddenberry.com is taking a stance on this. A really odd one too.
https://www.facebook.com/roddenberr...39143388143/10153272651953144/?type=3&theater

No offense to Rod, but he doesn't speak for his parents. I don't take much notice of what he says either way.

2001 "invented" the thing before TNG anyway.

 

[SeerSGB]

Looks like Roddenberry.com is taking a stance on this. A really odd one too.
https://www.facebook.com/roddenberr...39143388143/10153272651953144/?type=3&theater

No offense to Rod, but he doesn't speak for his parents. I don't take much notice of what he says either way.

I don't know what sort of person Gene was in his private life, but everything I've read about Gene as a businessman and a TV producer leads me to think he'd already sued most of this big fan productions (such as Axanar) into the ground.

Rod, no offense to him, makes his trade---so to speak---on keeping the Great Bird Of The Galaxy mythos around his father alive and selling to the faithful.

 

[SeerSGB]

Looks like Roddenberry.com is taking a stance on this. A really odd one too.
https://www.facebook.com/roddenberr...39143388143/10153272651953144/?type=3&theater

No offense to Rod, but he doesn't speak for his parents. I don't take much notice of what he says either way.

2001 "invented" the thing before TNG anyway.

Let's be blunt for a minute, a lot of stuff that Trek "invented" was around be Trek---Trek just gave a catchy name.

I love Trek, have as long as I can remember. Trek has been good to me in many ways. But I've grown a distaste mythos and hype that surrounds the franchise.

 

[Campe]

I feel the same way..........I kinda left the board for the past 8 or 9 years...would just pop in when something BIG was going on. I was SURE it would be like facebook here.....was so happy when every one was civil and level headed. Kinda freaked me out.

I just find it bizarre that the Axanar people can't grasp what is going on. Clearly, they are too close to the project. If they just stood back and looked...

I understand that you can be passionate about something but they really did try to do too much too soon. This "we know trek better than they do" and "they are alienating the fan base" is ludicrous.

I was mildy intruiged by the prelude thing. Mildy.

I prefer actual Star Trek though myself...

The thing is that I am anti-JJTrek and I am less that excited about a Trek series with Kurtzman at the helm, but that doesn't prevent me from seeing what is going on here. I think the whole notion of Axanar appealing to the anti-Abrams crowd is a fallacy. At the end of the day all Axanar has offered us so far is war, destruction and phasers - which is one of the chief criticisms of JJtrek.

The only difference between JJTrek and Axanar is that Peters says it takes place in the prime universe. The design elements of the starships take away from that quite a bit. As I've said elsewhere, there is a cultish fanaticism here some of it towards Axanar itself. Some towards Peters. Peters, to many of the Axanar fans, is the second coming of Roddenberry because he "gets" Trek... Which, like you say, is oddly the same thing the official productions are doing. They can't seem to see the forest from the trees.

 

[SeerSGB]

I just find it bizarre that the Axanar people can't grasp what is going on. Clearly, they are too close to the project. If they just stood back and looked...

I understand that you can be passionate about something but they really did try to do too much too soon. This "we know trek better than they do" and "they are alienating the fan base" is ludicrous.

I was mildy intruiged by the prelude thing. Mildy.

I prefer actual Star Trek though myself...

The thing is that I am anti-JJTrek and I am less that excited about a Trek series with Kurtzman at the helm, but that doesn't prevent me from seeing what is going on here. I think the whole notion of Axanar appealing to the anti-Abrams crowd is a fallacy. At the end of the day all Axanar has offered us so far is war, destruction and phasers - which is one of the chief criticisms of JJtrek.

The only difference between JJTrek and Axanar is that Peters says it takes place in the prime universe. The design elements of the starships take away from that quite a bit. As I've said elsewhere, there is a cultish fanaticism here some of it towards Axanar itself. Some towards Peters. Peters, to many of the Axanar fans, is the second coming of Roddenberry because he "gets" Trek... Which, like you say, is oddly the same thing the official productions are doing. They can't seem to see the forest from the trees.

Well don't you know TOS was all about big space battles, death, and referring to female officers as "Bitch"*. It's the true heart of Star Trek.

* -- the VFX in prelude, while good, are nothing special. But the whole "Bitch" line turned me off pretty much right then and there. And I'm not a prude by far, but it just felt wrong. Have the same problem with STVI when Scotty calls Aztibar one.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

I just find it bizarre that the Axanar people can't grasp what is going on. Clearly, they are too close to the project. If they just stood back and looked...

I understand that you can be passionate about something but they really did try to do too much too soon. This "we know trek better than they do" and "they are alienating the fan base" is ludicrous.

I was mildy intruiged by the prelude thing. Mildy.

I prefer actual Star Trek though myself...

The thing is that I am anti-JJTrek and I am less that excited about a Trek series with Kurtzman at the helm, but that doesn't prevent me from seeing what is going on here. I think the whole notion of Axanar appealing to the anti-Abrams crowd is a fallacy. At the end of the day all Axanar has offered us so far is war, destruction and phasers - which is one of the chief criticisms of JJtrek.

The only difference between JJTrek and Axanar is that Peters says it takes place in the prime universe. The design elements of the starships take away from that quite a bit. As I've said elsewhere, there is a cultish fanaticism here some of it towards Axanar itself. Some towards Peters. Peters, to many of the Axanar fans, is the second coming of Roddenberry because he "gets" Trek... Which, like you say, is oddly the same thing the official productions are doing. They can't seem to see the forest from the trees.

"Getting Trek" is about telling a thoughtful and intelligent story. I've seen no indication of that from Axanar so far. For all the atrocious acting and casting, I think Continues and New Voyages have come far closer to that.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

The thing is that I am anti-JJTrek and I am less that excited about a Trek series with Kurtzman at the helm, but that doesn't prevent me from seeing what is going on here. I think the whole notion of Axanar appealing to the anti-Abrams crowd is a fallacy. At the end of the day all Axanar has offered us so far is war, destruction and phasers - which is one of the chief criticisms of JJtrek.

The only difference between JJTrek and Axanar is that Peters says it takes place in the prime universe. The design elements of the starships take away from that quite a bit. As I've said elsewhere, there is a cultish fanaticism here some of it towards Axanar itself. Some towards Peters. Peters, to many of the Axanar fans, is the second coming of Roddenberry because he "gets" Trek... Which, like you say, is oddly the same thing the official productions are doing. They can't seem to see the forest from the trees.

Well don't you know TOS was all about big space battles, death, and referring to female officers as "Bitch"*. It's the true heart of Star Trek.

* -- the VFX in prelude, while good, are nothing special. But the whole "Bitch" line turned me off pretty much right then and there. And I'm not a prude by far, but it just felt wrong. Have the same problem with STVI when Scotty calls Aztibar one.

Profanity doesn't bother me, as long as the script has substance.

 

[starburst]

What use are sets and production materials (such as scripts) if seized ?

Obviously useful to other fanfilms, but I'd think most other fanfilms will be giving anything tainted by Axanar a wide berth....

What use are sets and production materials (such as scripts) if seized ?

Obviously useful to other fanfilms, but I'd think most other fanfilms will be giving anything tainted by Axanar a wide berth....

I was thinking more of unused materials and equipment of value, like cameras, sound equipment and so on. Built sets will be worthless for all intents and purposes.

If someone bought the sets and could have them moved, rebuilt and finished I guess it depends on whether it would be worth it with the risk of CBS shutting down fan films no matter how they aquire their budget.

The bridge set obviously screams Star Trek as it is but someone with some imagination could take what is there and develop it into something which is scifi but not necessarily Trek especially as so many other shows in the past have used a similar formula.

As for the recording equipment, if a Trek or other fanfilm can get hold of kit at a better cost that they could have ordinarily who would really care who it originally belonged to? Would you refuse to watch a NV or Continues episode because you found out scenes were recorded with a camera that once belonged to Axanar?

Hypothetical Question...

If Peters should at this point pull the plug on Axanar, dismantle the sets, pull the plug on the studio, shut down his company, refund the backers as far as is possible to the point that Axanar doesn't exist anymore, and cannot be easily restarted, would ParaCBS still have a lawsuit? Would the trailer and Prelude be enough for them to continue, or would they be back at square one when it comes to setting a precedent for fan films?

Yes - the infringement has already occurred.

Take the four minute prelude and trailer together - CBS want $150,000 per infringement.

You have got:

* ships (federation)
* Klingons (Klingon)
* uniforms
* Vulcans
* Klingons
* Garth
* Soval
* Robert April

That is off the top of my head - each is a seperate infringement...

If we are ignoring the money making aspect of the case entirely, then every fan film out there has to worry about this list as the TOS shows would owe over a million $ for just the use of the 7 main characters.

 

[KennyB]

Looks like Roddenberry.com is taking a stance on this. A really odd one too.
https://www.facebook.com/roddenberr...39143388143/10153272651953144/?type=3&theater

I don't know if I would call that a stance........Just a meme. Until I see an actual statement I'll let it good as that.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

If we are ignoring the money making aspect of the case entirely, then every fan film out there has to worry about this list as the TOS shows would owe over a million $ for just the use of the 7 main characters.

Yes, which is why the toleration of these productions, and therefore their ability to make them, has been a privilege, not a right. Axanr has just pushed that tolerance too far.

 

[Campe]

The thing is that I am anti-JJTrek and I am less that excited about a Trek series with Kurtzman at the helm, but that doesn't prevent me from seeing what is going on here. I think the whole notion of Axanar appealing to the anti-Abrams crowd is a fallacy. At the end of the day all Axanar has offered us so far is war, destruction and phasers - which is one of the chief criticisms of JJtrek.

The only difference between JJTrek and Axanar is that Peters says it takes place in the prime universe. The design elements of the starships take away from that quite a bit. As I've said elsewhere, there is a cultish fanaticism here some of it towards Axanar itself. Some towards Peters. Peters, to many of the Axanar fans, is the second coming of Roddenberry because he "gets" Trek... Which, like you say, is oddly the same thing the official productions are doing. They can't seem to see the forest from the trees.

"Getting Trek" is about telling a thoughtful and intelligent story. I've seen no indication of that from Axanar so far. For all the atrocious acting and casting, I think Continues and New Voyages have come far closer to that.

Agreed 1000%.

 

[USS Triumphant]

But the whole "Bitch" line turned me off pretty much right then and there. And I'm not a prude by far, but it just felt wrong. Have the same problem with STVI when Scotty calls Aztibar one.

I agree. Regarding the Scotty line, though - cut scenes included as extras on the discs aren't canon, are they?

 

[starburst]

I love Trek, have as long as I can remember. Trek has been good to me in many ways. But I've grown a distaste mythos and hype that surrounds the franchise.

Same here, I grew up on TNG etc as well as reruns of TOS (and early TNG as I would likely have been too young) and even though I still love watching the show its the fans which time and time again leave a bad taste in my mouth with some of their opinions, rants and beliefs that they and only they alone know the one true path to Star Treks past, present and future.

I just find it bizarre that the Axanar people can't grasp what is going on. Clearly, they are too close to the project. If they just stood back and looked...

I understand that you can be passionate about something but they really did try to do too much too soon. This "we know trek better than they do" and "they are alienating the fan base" is ludicrous.

I was mildy intruiged by the prelude thing. Mildy.

I prefer actual Star Trek though myself...

The thing is that I am anti-JJTrek and I am less that excited about a Trek series with Kurtzman at the helm, but that doesn't prevent me from seeing what is going on here. I think the whole notion of Axanar appealing to the anti-Abrams crowd is a fallacy. At the end of the day all Axanar has offered us so far is war, destruction and phasers - which is one of the chief criticisms of JJtrek.

The only difference between JJTrek and Axanar is that Peters says it takes place in the prime universe. The design elements of the starships take away from that quite a bit. As I've said elsewhere, there is a cultish fanaticism here some of it towards Axanar itself. Some towards Peters. Peters, to many of the Axanar fans, is the second coming of Roddenberry because he "gets" Trek... Which, like you say, is oddly the same thing the official productions are doing. They can't seem to see the forest from the trees.

To be fair I think the basic ship design of the JJ Trek ships do easily fit into the Prime timeline and is a thought that many JJ Trek haters have said they agree with (many not all). The design changes Tobais made have helped to root them to the original timeline along with adjustments to their scale... just my opinion on the ship designs though. I am a big ship lover especially with Trek ships which is something I think personally the designers on Axanar have done really well with.

As for the "second coming" tbh I have had enough of hearing people insist that whatever fan film they are talking about is the "real" Star Trek while the actual one made by the people who own it isn't (not just JJ as there are people on boards like this who insist the other shows aren't real Trek either).

If we are ignoring the money making aspect of the case entirely, then every fan film out there has to worry about this list as the TOS shows would owe over a million $ for just the use of the 7 main characters.

Yes, which is why the toleration of these productions, and therefore their ability to make them, has been a privilege, not a right. Axanr has just pushed that tolerance too far.

Yup agree completely

 

[SeerSGB]

The only difference between JJTrek and Axanar is that Peters says it takes place in the prime universe. The design elements of the starships take away from that quite a bit. As I've said elsewhere, there is a cultish fanaticism here some of it towards Axanar itself. Some towards Peters. Peters, to many of the Axanar fans, is the second coming of Roddenberry because he "gets" Trek... Which, like you say, is oddly the same thing the official productions are doing. They can't seem to see the forest from the trees.

Well don't you know TOS was all about big space battles, death, and referring to female officers as "Bitch"*. It's the true heart of Star Trek.

* -- the VFX in prelude, while good, are nothing special. But the whole "Bitch" line turned me off pretty much right then and there. And I'm not a prude by far, but it just felt wrong. Have the same problem with STVI when Scotty calls Aztibar one.

Profanity doesn't bother me, as long as the script has substance.

That is probably it in both causes. It doesn't serve the story or really add anything. It just there to try to add edge

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

I also find it quite hilarious that the Axanar facebook page is 95% skewed the other way

They're deleting dissenting posts for "trolling", despite Peters' claims of being open and willing to discuss.

I have had posts deleted, posts questioning whether or not monies from the Kickstarter went into the infrastructure of Ares Studios.... And by continuity pointing out that the whole non profit thing isn't a legal fair use thing, but a CBS line in the sand for fan productions, so to me it seems his salary crosses that line... I have been banned....