CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[JoeZhang]

Not to steal from Star Wars, but surely there is something good in Axanar that folks could discuss, rather than pile on, to dissuade CBS from using the fullest extent of the law, and to preserve the Axanar production - with changes - to set the line which should not be crossed and remove the threat to all fan productions.

Nothing will dissuade CBS from that, certainly nothing here and actually why should they be dissuaded?

 

[Amaris]

Not to steal from Star Wars, but surely there is something good in Axanar that folks could discuss, rather than pile on, to dissuade CBS from using the fullest extent of the law, and to preserve the production - with changes.

Each opinion will be different, but I support CBS in taking down Axanar. I wanted to see the film, but with the things being brought to light as they are, if they are true, there's no way the production itself doesn't deserve this. I feel bad for the fans, for the crew, but not for Peters, and in his haste to be vindicated, he tries to drag other productions down with him? Hell no.

 

[Squiggy]

For what it's worth, someone in the TrekMovie comics just posted some of Axanar's other salaries.

EXPENSES
Salaries
1099 $17,420.00
Alec Peters $38,166.57
Diana Kingsbury Deferred till 2016
Robert Burnett $5,000.00
Curtis Laseter $9,800.00
Salaries $48,042.31

Yeah. That should be enough to end all discussion right there. Salary isn't a word that should be associated with fan productions at all.

Peters seems to be the type who likes to leap before looking.

Many times, unfortunately. Much of which is easy enough to go back into the archives of pages and find.

I can't seem to find it. What FB page is it on? Searching for "Star Trek" alone yields far too many pages to sift through. A link would be most helpful.

Point 3.

Cochrane on a cracker. I don't know how much more of this his attorney would be willing to take on if it is pro bono.

Not to steal from Star Wars, but surely there is something good in Axanar and Alec that folks could discuss, rather than pile on, to dissuade CBS from using the fullest extent of the law, and to preserve the Axanar production - with changes - to set the line which should not be crossed and remove the threat to all fan productions.

Why the hell would they? It seems pretty evident at this point that Peters isn't willing to play by the rules of even common sense, much less whatever new rules CBS might set up.

 

[JWPlatt]

Not to steal from Star Wars, but surely there is something good in Axanar that folks could discuss, rather than pile on, to dissuade CBS from using the fullest extent of the law, and to preserve the production - with changes.

Each opinion will be different, but I support CBS in taking down Axanar. I wanted to see the film, but with the things being brought to light as they are, if they are true, there's no way the production itself doesn't deserve this. I feel bad for the fans, for the crew, but not for Peters, and in his haste to be vindicated, he tries to drag other productions down with him? Hell no.

You often see the best people go defensive and make mistakes when backed into a corner. The mob generally doesn't acknowledge itself. That's why police wrongly believe people are always guilty when they run. Well, it's that or submit to the mob.

I think there's a positive solution so long as folks are willing to consider it.

 

[Amaris]

Not to steal from Star Wars, but surely there is something good in Axanar that folks could discuss, rather than pile on, to dissuade CBS from using the fullest extent of the law, and to preserve the production - with changes.

Each opinion will be different, but I support CBS in taking down Axanar. I wanted to see the film, but with the things being brought to light as they are, if they are true, there's no way the production itself doesn't deserve this. I feel bad for the fans, for the crew, but not for Peters, and in his haste to be vindicated, he tries to drag other productions down with him? Hell no.

You often see the best people go defensive and make mistakes when backed into a corner. The mob generally doesn't acknowledge itself. That's why police wrongly believe people are always guilty when they run. Well, it's that or submit to the mob.

All indications point to these issues taking place over a period of time, not all of a sudden to where Peters was backed into a corner. CBS said "don't do this," and they did it anyway. Peters, even now, says he will continue to produce Axanar. He's not running from a mob, he created the mob and expects them to protect his shortsightedness.

 

[Squiggy]

You often see the best people go defensive and make mistakes when backed into a corner.

I'm still waiting for him to do something that isn't a mistake.

Every single thing he's said so far has either been legally, ethically, morally questionable (at best) or flat out arrogant and above the law.

And if his hope is to say childish shit online and then delete it then he doesn't understand how the internet works. When he posts something to Star Trek's offical Facebook page, a LOT of people at CBS and Paramount are getting a notification that they've been called out.

Essentially, he's poking the prosecution in the eye and expects to get away with it.

The first rule of Lawsuit Club: DON'T. TALK. ABOUT. LAWSUIT. CLUB.

 

[JWPlatt]

Each opinion will be different, but I support CBS in taking down Axanar. I wanted to see the film, but with the things being brought to light as they are, if they are true, there's no way the production itself doesn't deserve this. I feel bad for the fans, for the crew, but not for Peters, and in his haste to be vindicated, he tries to drag other productions down with him? Hell no.

You often see the best people go defensive and make mistakes when backed into a corner. The mob generally doesn't acknowledge itself. That's why police wrongly believe people are always guilty when they run. Well, it's that or submit to the mob.

All indications point to these issues taking place over a period of time, not all of a sudden to where Peters was backed into a corner. CBS said "don't do this," and they did it anyway. Peters, even now, says he will continue to produce Axanar. He's not running from a mob, he created the mob and expects them to protect his shortsightedness.

I'm writing that the mob can determine whether this can be a positive or negative outcome, depending on their actions. I'm more interested in seeing discussion about how this could be turned into something positive instead of making it into something destructive.

You often see the best people go defensive and make mistakes when backed into a corner.

I'm still waiting for him to do something that isn't a mistake.

Every single thing he's said so far has either been legally, ethically, morally questionable (at best) or flat out arrogant and above the law.

And if his hope is to say childish shit online and then delete it then he doesn't understand how the internet works. When he posts something to Star Trek's offical Facebook page, a LOT of people at CBS and Paramount are getting a notification that they've been called out.

Essentially, he's poking the prosecution in the eye and expects to get away with it.

The first rule of Lawsuit Club: DON'T. TALK. ABOUT. LAWSUIT. CLUB.

Everything you wrote describes mistakes made.

Wouldn't it be better for the Axanar case to set precedent (and consequences) and make clear rules from CBS that preserve all Star Trek fan productions, including Axanar?

 

[Amaris]

All indications point to these issues taking place over a period of time, not all of a sudden to where Peters was backed into a corner. CBS said "don't do this," and they did it anyway. Peters, even now, says he will continue to produce Axanar. He's not running from a mob, he created the mob and expects them to protect his shortsightedness.

I'm writing that the mob can determine whether this can be a positive or negative outcome, depending on their actions. I'm more interested in seeing discussion about how this could be turned into something positive instead of making it into something destructive.

It has already become destructive. By his actions he has placed every fan project under heavy scrutiny, and instead of being contrite and willing to work with CBS, he has openly defied them, inciting others to push back against CBS and boycott their wholly legitimate Star Trek film, because of legal action taken towards his unlicensed, unendorsed use of their IP.

You want positive? Okay, I'm positive that he's fucking things up for every other production out there, and that they're all scared as shit about what may happen to their hard work because of this knucklehead. This is a lawsuit CBS is bringing out, and an injunction is following rapidly on its heels. We're beyond "let's play nice and smooth things over."

 

[Squiggy]

If it's not the norm, then it's a mistake.

If it IS the norm, then it's just how he is.

 

[Squiggy]

I'm writing that the mob can determine whether this can be a positive or negative outcome, depending on their actions. I'm more interested in seeing discussion about how this could be turned into something positive instead of making it into something destructive.

The mob has no say in the matter and copyright law is pretty clear. If he IS trying to get the mob to sway the jury, then guess what - that's jury tampering!

Axanar is dead and it's only by the grace of god that CBS allowed it to go on as long as it did. The best outcome out of this is that CBS allows the other fanfilms to keep on keepin' on.

The worst is that Alec keeps on doing what he's doing and forces CBS's hand to shut them all down. At which point he'll be persona non grata not only in Hollywood, but at conventions and on other fan sets as well.

So far, Peters seems to be fine to watch the world burn because he can't get everything he wants. Fuck that. If you want to defend that sort of person then feel free.

 

[mos6507]

Wouldn't it be better for the Axanar case to set precedent and make clear rules from CBS that preserve all Star Trek fan productions, including Axanar?

Absolutely! But that's about being nice. Hollywood doesn't run on "nice". They don't care about fans unless the bean-counters tell them they should because it will impact the bottom-line. It's just dollars and cents to them. I'm not saying that in order to adopt Alec's "stick it to the man" attitude, but that's generally how it is. And it's not just about fans. There are plenty of cases of people who worked directly in Hollywood who had to sue for redress over being mistreated. Roy Huggins' career is very educational on this point. So it's not like everyone in Hollywood plays by the rules. They use the law as a tool to get what they want.

 

[Squiggy]

If someone steals my car to rob a bank, I'm not going to be nice about it and let them continue to steal my car to rob other banks because they spent all the money from the first robbery on flapjacks and hookers.

 

[JWPlatt]

All indications point to these issues taking place over a period of time, not all of a sudden to where Peters was backed into a corner. CBS said "don't do this," and they did it anyway. Peters, even now, says he will continue to produce Axanar. He's not running from a mob, he created the mob and expects them to protect his shortsightedness.

I'm writing that the mob can determine whether this can be a positive or negative outcome, depending on their actions. I'm more interested in seeing discussion about how this could be turned into something positive instead of making it into something destructive.

It has already become destructive. By his actions he has placed every fan project under heavy scrutiny, and instead of being contrite and willing to work with CBS, he has openly defied them, inciting others to push back against CBS and boycott their wholly legitimate Star Trek film, because of legal action taken towards his unlicensed, unendorsed use of their IP.

You want positive? Okay, I'm positive that he's fucking things up for every other production out there, and that they're all scared as shit about what may happen to their hard work because of this knucklehead. This is a lawsuit CBS is bringing out, and an injunction is following rapidly on its heels. We're beyond "let's play nice and smooth things over."

That sounds like the same stupidity as the Cold War in microcosm. The sarcasm won't help your other fan productions. People coming together to offer positive solutions might. Does anything you say help bring a solution to the problem, or is it simply said to complain? The former is constructive, the latter not.

If it's not the norm, then it's a mistake.

If it IS the norm, then it's just how he is.

Then he is as mistaken as anyone else who intentionally does something self-destructive. The pile-on won't change his behavior for the better.

 

[CRM-114]

I've read through this whole thread. How Axanar has responded to all this is absurd. But maybe there's a deeper reason than we've considered.

My theory: Peters knows he's screwed. He can't beat CBS at their own game. If he can't win, he goes down swinging and makes himself a martyr for the fans, thus satiating his alleged big ego.

Thoughts?

 

[Squiggy]

He's damaging a thing I care about. I'll pile on as I see fit. I don't owe him anything.

If he has a problem he can come in here and defend himself like he has so aptly done these past two days. I'm sure it will be cogent and legally thought-out.

 

[SFC3]

I'm writing that the mob can determine whether this can be a positive or negative outcome, depending on their actions. I'm more interested in seeing discussion about how this could be turned into something positive instead of making it into something destructive.

It has already become destructive. By his actions he has placed every fan project under heavy scrutiny, and instead of being contrite and willing to work with CBS, he has openly defied them, inciting others to push back against CBS and boycott their wholly legitimate Star Trek film, because of legal action taken towards his unlicensed, unendorsed use of their IP.

You want positive? Okay, I'm positive that he's fucking things up for every other production out there, and that they're all scared as shit about what may happen to their hard work because of this knucklehead. This is a lawsuit CBS is bringing out, and an injunction is following rapidly on its heels. We're beyond "let's play nice and smooth things over."

That sounds like the same stupidity as the Cold War in microcosm. The sarcasm won't help your other fan productions. People coming together to offer positive solutions might. Does anything you say help bring a solution to the problem, or is it simply said to complain? The former is constructive, the latter not.

If it's not the norm, then it's a mistake.

If it IS the norm, then it's just how he is.

Then he is as mistaken as anyone else who intentionally does something self-destructive. The pile-on won't change his behavior for the better.

Please elaborate how exactly you could change his behavior "for the better." Peters' has been under constant scrutiny, even before Axanar became a big thing.

The only thing I can think of is this current lawsuit being a wake up call for him. But that's a stretch.

 

[JWPlatt]

Wouldn't it be better for the Axanar case to set precedent and make clear rules from CBS that preserve all Star Trek fan productions, including Axanar?

Absolutely! But that's about being nice. Hollywood doesn't run on "nice". They don't care about fans unless the bean-counters tell them they should because it will impact the bottom-line. It's just dollars and cents to them. I'm not saying that in order to adopt Alec's "stick it to the man" attitude, but that's generally how it is. And it's not just about fans. There are plenty of cases of people who worked directly in Hollywood who had to sue for redress over being mistreated. Roy Huggins' career is very educational on this point. So it's not like everyone in Hollywood plays by the rules. They use the law as a tool to get what they want.

I would tend to agree about Hollywood suits. But the pile-on just gives them permission from one of their bottom-line concerns - the fan pocketbook.

 

[Mark 2000]

My theory: Peters knows he's screwed. He can't beat CBS at their own game. If he can't win, he goes down swinging and makes himself a martyr for the fans, thus satiating his alleged big ego.

Thoughts?

If you've ever met Peters in a comments section under any of his user names you'll know he's like this all the time to everyone. Not saying it makes him guilty, but this isn't a strategy. It's him.

 

[Amaris]

That sounds like the same stupidity as the Cold War in microcosm. The sarcasm won't help your other fan productions. People coming together to offer positive solutions might. Does anything you say help bring a solution to the problem, or is it simply said to complain? The former is constructive, the latter not.

Let's hope Peters hasn't condemned every other fan production with his illegal actions. Kumby-motherfucking-ya.

Wouldn't it be better for the Axanar case to set precedent and make clear rules from CBS that preserve all Star Trek fan productions, including Axanar?

Absolutely! But that's about being nice. Hollywood doesn't run on "nice". They don't care about fans unless the bean-counters tell them they should because it will impact the bottom-line. It's just dollars and cents to them. I'm not saying that in order to adopt Alec's "stick it to the man" attitude, but that's generally how it is. And it's not just about fans. There are plenty of cases of people who worked directly in Hollywood who had to sue for redress over being mistreated. Roy Huggins' career is very educational on this point. So it's not like everyone in Hollywood plays by the rules. They use the law as a tool to get what they want.

I would tend to agree about Hollywood suits. But the pile-on just gives them permission from one of their bottom-line concerns - the fan pocketbook.

No, their IP being used to build capital towards a for-profit studio gives them permission. The use of their trademarks and copyrights gives them permission. They are completely in the right here. You can say being mean to them gives CBS permission but it would be wrong. They already had permission.

 

[JWPlatt]

I've read through this whole thread. How Axanar has responded to all this is absurd. But maybe there's a deeper reason than we've considered.

My theory: Peters knows he's screwed. He can't beat CBS at their own game. If he can't win, he goes down swinging and makes himself a martyr for the fans, thus satiating his alleged big ego.

Thoughts?

My thought is that amateur psychoanalysis of someone from whom you want cooperation is never constructive.

He's damaging a thing I care about. I'll pile on as I see fit. I don't owe him anything.

If he has a problem he can come in here and defend himself like he has so aptly done these past two days. I'm sure it will be cogent and legally thought-out.

How will that help all the other productions?