MLP:FIM S5E25&26 - "The Cutie Re-Mark" - Grading & Discussion

[Peach Wookiee]

About Starlight's powers... one can assume that Twilight is still coming into her own as an alicorn. She's not at the level of the other three yet. And we can assume that Starlight studied different areas of magic than Twilight. I mean... how did Twilight not know about a spell that could remove cutie marks? Does Celestia know about such a spell? Do Luna or Cadance, for that matter? Did Starswirl know? Did Starswirl originate the spell? It doesn't seem like something the alicorn princesses would know about or use. It seems like forbidden magic. So how did Starlight come by it?

 

[Amaris]

About Starlight's powers... one can assume that Twilight is still coming into her own as an alicorn. She's not at the level of the other three yet. And we can assume that Starlight studied different areas of magic than Twilight. I mean... how did Twilight not know about a spell that could remove cutie marks? Does Celestia know about such a spell? Do Luna or Cadance, for that matter? Did Starswirl know? Did Starswirl originate the spell? It doesn't seem like something the alicorn princesses would know about or use. It seems like forbidden magic. So how did Starlight come by it?

That's a good question. When Starlight identified it as Starswirl's spell, my first thought was wondering how she got her hooves on it. Starswirl's spells are kept in the most restricted part of the castle, and I doubt Starlight Glimmer's on the guest list. My second thought was to wonder why even if she had it, how she made it work? Twilight completed a Starswirl spell and ascended. Starlight Glimmer modifies one, with success, and nearly destroys everything in the process. That didn't make sense to me, either.

 

[Peach Wookiee]

Hmmm... Starlight got pretty far into Canterlot... is it possible, given her magical abilities, that she has stealth that Twilight might not have learned how to use? It seems that Twilight is good with frontal assault and not spectacular with stealth.

 

[Kemaiku]

Sunset began her studies first and is implied to be even smarter than even Twilight, whose talent is literally magic. Both studied under Celestia directly (the only two to do so) and where students of the School for Gifted Unicorns, spending day and night researching all areas of magic.

Sunset raided the forbidden archies for weeks prior to leaving and learned a lot of forbidden magic that Twilight still does not know. Twilight knows about the time travel section of the Starswirl wing.

Moondancer went to that school and has shown abilities equal to Twilight only because of having constant access to all of Canterlots magical libraries but as we see in Amending Fences, access to a lot of advanced magical texts through Celestia's teaching.

Twilight has shown power no unicorn has ever matched when pushed. Starlight grew up in the middle of goddamn nowhere and scavanged an education. There is just no way she did all that without being on someponies radar as having gotten access to something she really shouldn't.

Celestia made a point that remaking magic was the final test to make Twilight an Alicorn, that nopony had ever done it before and only one in a generation may be capable, Sunset probably could have too only becaue of their nearly identical education, Starlight did not have that.

She's a shoehorned in marysue that just feels so out of place, ridiculously forced and making the entire mane6 act out of character that her presence just feels wrong.

 

[Amaris]

Hmmm... Starlight got pretty far into Canterlot... is it possible, given her magical abilities, that she has stealth that Twilight might not have learned how to use? It seems that Twilight is good with frontal assault and not spectacular with stealth.

Maybe, but Canterlot is populated by one Alicorn who is exceptional with stealth: Luna. There are two Alicorns in Canterlot, along with tons of guards who would be accustomed to dealing with unicorns of all types, including stealthy ones. I think they grabbed Starswirl's name because it was an easy reference. Unfortunately, it opens up a lockbox of worms.

 

[Kemaiku]

Twilight didn't even manage to sneak, the only reason she wasn't stopped in It's About Time is Celestia knew she was there and wasn't bothered.

Sunset wasn't able to sneak in the comic prequel either, Tia just hoped she'd 'stop it' eventually and didn't stop her.

If someone where in there that she didn't want to be, they wouldn't be.

 

[Amaris]

Twilight didn't even manage to sneak, the only reason she wasn't stopped in It's About Time is Celestia knew she was there and wasn't bothered.

Sunset wasn't able to sneak in the comic prequel either, Tia just hoped she'd 'stop it' eventually and didn't stop her.

If someone where in there that she didn't want to be, they wouldn't be.

Exactly. So where did she get it? Could it have been an illicit purchase, like with the Alicorn Amulet? There's just no answer to that. No one seemed to ask "where the hell did she get a ridiculously powerful (and likely forbidden) Starswirl spell?"

 

[Peach Wookiee]

^When she showed up and used it, it wasn't like there was much time to ask about that. What was known is that she had to be stopped. I still keep hearing "Temporal Wake" from First Contact when the rift is first opened.
ETA: Had the Mane Six all been caught up in the temporal wake... then they could've used the Elements, Rainbow Power... whatever!

 

[Kemaiku]

I'd say I hope this is all explained fully in season 6. But not only do I not feel like watching it, I know it likely won't be.

 

[Amaris]

^When she showed up and used it, it wasn't like there was much time to ask about that. What was known is that she had to be stopped. I still keep hearing "Temporal Wake" from First Contact when the rift is first opened.
ETA: Had the Mane Six all been caught up in the temporal wake... then they could've used the Elements, Rainbow Power... whatever!

Which is why Starlight got her alone. Starlight knew full well what she was doing, moreso than she let on. As for the explanation on where she got it from, a quick line about stealing it from somewhere, or gaining access to some rare artifact would have taken care of it, but in all honesty I doubt they bothered, because "Starswirl spell" was a good enough cover.

I'd say I hope this is all explained fully in season 6. But not only do I not feel like watching it, I know it likely won't be.

For what it's worth, if you decide not to watch, and they do explain it, I'd let you know. It does make me eager to see the next season, hoping they will explain everything in full, but if the hiatus really is a year long, this is going to well and truly suck.

 

[Taylirious]

SG was highly motivated and had beef with TS & Co. It is just me but I can take the leap there. I am not sure what the fuss is over they showed a time lapse of her mending fences. They had a serious discussion which probably took longer than what we saw before that. I am okay with everything regarding SG. I don't even SG knows how great she was with magic(in a positive way) being caught up in her emotions with being abandoned by her friend and then the Mane Six ruining her little town of equality.

 

[Amaris]

SG was highly motivated and had beef with TS & Co. It is just me but I can take the leap there. I am not sure what the fuss is over they showed a time lapse of her mending fences. They had a serious discussion which probably took longer than what we saw before that. I am okay with everything regarding SG. I don't even SG knows how great she was with magic being caught up in her emotions with being abandoned by her friend and then the Mane Six ruining her little town of equality.

I get that, and I'm glad you were able to make it work for you. I'm just saying I understand where Chemy is coming from. Even for myself, someone who is often more willing to let things slip even if I find them a stretch, the ending irked me a bit. Oh, I wanted Starlight Glimmer to be redeemed, but this was just too instant, like they ran too long and said "oh crap, we have to wrap this up in 5 minutes!"

 

[Taylirious]

SG was highly motivated and had beef with TS & Co. It is just me but I can take the leap there. I am not sure what the fuss is over they showed a time lapse of her mending fences. They had a serious discussion which probably took longer than what we saw before that. I am okay with everything regarding SG. I don't even SG knows how great she was with magic being caught up in her emotions with being abandoned by her friend and then the Mane Six ruining her little town of equality.

I get that, and I'm glad you were able to make it work for you. I'm just saying I understand where Chemy is coming from. Even for myself, someone who is often more willing to let things slip even if I find them a stretch, the ending irked me a bit. Oh, I wanted Starlight Glimmer to be redeemed, but this was just too instant, like they ran too long and said "oh crap, we have to wrap this up in 5 minutes!"

Almost every week they have enough story for a 90 minute movie!

ETA: And what about every time they revealed RD look in the alternate times!

 

[Amaris]

SG was highly motivated and had beef with TS & Co. It is just me but I can take the leap there. I am not sure what the fuss is over they showed a time lapse of her mending fences. They had a serious discussion which probably took longer than what we saw before that. I am okay with everything regarding SG. I don't even SG knows how great she was with magic being caught up in her emotions with being abandoned by her friend and then the Mane Six ruining her little town of equality.

I get that, and I'm glad you were able to make it work for you. I'm just saying I understand where Chemy is coming from. Even for myself, someone who is often more willing to let things slip even if I find them a stretch, the ending irked me a bit. Oh, I wanted Starlight Glimmer to be redeemed, but this was just too instant, like they ran too long and said "oh crap, we have to wrap this up in 5 minutes!"

Almost every week they have enough story for a 90 minute movie!

ETA: And what about every time they revealed RD look in the alternate times!

They really do! I usually find them quite good at balancing that limited time with the story. This time, though, I think they missed.

Also, yeah, Dashie looked awesome every time.

 

[Peach Wookiee]

SG was highly motivated and had beef with TS & Co. It is just me but I can take the leap there. I am not sure what the fuss is over they showed a time lapse of her mending fences. They had a serious discussion which probably took longer than what we saw before that. I am okay with everything regarding SG. I don't even SG knows how great she was with magic being caught up in her emotions with being abandoned by her friend and then the Mane Six ruining her little town of equality.

I get that, and I'm glad you were able to make it work for you. I'm just saying I understand where Chemy is coming from. Even for myself, someone who is often more willing to let things slip even if I find them a stretch, the ending irked me a bit. Oh, I wanted Starlight Glimmer to be redeemed, but this was just too instant, like they ran too long and said "oh crap, we have to wrap this up in 5 minutes!"

I can see where everyone's coming from and my brain is racing with possibilities.
I'd also love to know what happened to Twilight in the other timelines. We didn't see her with the girls...

 

[Count Zero]

They might have just introduced Realpolitik into our favourite nice children's show. Twilight realised how powerful Starlight's magic is - a talent she doesn't seem to be quite aware of, by the way. That's why Twilight's keeping her close, trying to make her an ally. Perhaps she even persuaded the ponies in Starlight's old town to be nice to her before they got there so Starlight wouldn't be upset.

As for Starlight being a super villain the episode is pretty clear about her not being aware how big the changes to the timeline are. Once she realises she gives in pretty quickly. I don't know, that doesn't strike me as particularly evil, especially compared to the likes of Nightmare Moon or Discord who didn't care about the consequences of their actions at the time.

Anyway, which of the post-apocalyptic scenarios did you like best? I liked the battle in the first one but I think I liked Nightmare Moon world the best. I just can't resist bat ponies and Rarity as Nightmare Moon's decorator.

 

[Peach Wookiee]

I think Discord's world looked amusing. It looks as if Celestia and Luna became fillies again.
And boy, they went there.... "We barely escaped with our lives"? They went there, people. It was true war with Sombra and the Changelings!

 

[Taylirious]

I liked the Nightmare Moon one best. I think they could have done a lot of fun stuff along with the more serious ones we saw.

 

[Amaris]

I can see where everyone's coming from and my brain is racing with possibilities.
I'd also love to know what happened to Twilight in the other timelines. We didn't see her with the girls...

Yeah, they've made questions they'll have to answer in the next season, and I hope there are answers.

They might have just introduced Realpolitik into our favourite nice children's show. Twilight realised how powerful Starlight's magic is - a talent she doesn't seem to be quite aware of, by the way. That's why Twilight's keeping her close, trying to make her an ally. Perhaps she even persuaded the ponies in Starlight's old town to be nice to her before they got there so Starlight wouldn't be upset.

As for Starlight being a super villain the episode is pretty clear about her not being aware how big the changes to the timeline are. Once she realises she gives in pretty quickly. I don't know, that doesn't strike me as particularly evil, especially compared to the likes of Nightmare Moon or Discord who didn't care about the consequences of their actions at the time.

It may be so that she didn't understand how badly she was screwing up the timeline, but I wouldn't say she cared too much. Like I said before, she had no problem forcing people to her will earlier in the season. That kind of malevolence doesn't just disappear.

Anyway, which of the post-apocalyptic scenarios did you like best? I liked the battle in the first one but I think I liked Nightmare Moon world the best. I just can't resist bat ponies and Rarity as Nightmare Moon's decorator.

The battle one was fascinating, because we got to witness modern Equestria at war with a truly deadly foe. It looked like they were calling back on some of the old WWII tropes, with the machinery and mindsets.

My favorite one, though, is definitely Nightmare Moon's timeline. To be honest, I uh... kind of wanted things to stay that way.

 

[Taylirious]

Equestria - Forever Night!