Axanar found 100K to cut from their budget....

[SuperSpaceMan]

http://www.axanarproductions.com/captains-log-nov-12th-2015/

Then a 10:00am budget meeting with Line Producer Mike DeMerrit. As you all know, Mike worked on Star Trek Voyager and Enterprise. His first budget pass came in at $ 676,000 for the first half of the script. Now, we only have $ 400,000, so that was a shock! But we quickly eliminated $ 100,000 just from correcting errors and eliminating some really basic things we don’t need. Rob and I are reviewing the budget now to get that down even more. This is the way budgeting goes.

That's convenient. I am not quite sure how you overshoot your budget by almost 20%

 

[Maurice]

Interesting, I guess. But I've seen producers who've completely misbudgeted before. Some people are better at it than others.

But does this really require its own thread?

 

[Karzak]

http://www.axanarproductions.com/captains-log-nov-12th-2015/

Then a 10:00am budget meeting with Line Producer Mike DeMerrit. As you all know, Mike worked on Star Trek Voyager and Enterprise. His first budget pass came in at $ 676,000 for the first half of the script. Now, we only have $ 400,000, so that was a shock! But we quickly eliminated $ 100,000 just from correcting errors and eliminating some really basic things we don’t need. Rob and I are reviewing the budget now to get that down even more. This is the way budgeting goes.

That's convenient. I am not quite sure how you overshoot your budget by almost 20%

There must be more conventions to attend.

 

[YJAGG]

I know there is a lot of jargon in the industry, but don't you need "really basic things"?

 

[Karzak]

I wonder if perhaps Peters' clumsiness as a writer is at play here -- he says the first budget was for $676,000 for the first half of the film. Is it possible the $400,000.00 he refers to is likewise for just the first half?

They're definitely spending money though - most notably on the promotional elements of going to every convention under the sun, it seems, and if they're paying their crew standard rates that's also obviously going to be eating up the budget fast. But Peters' past comments seem to reflect that many on the crew are working pro bono; at least below-the-line. If that's the case, I'm not sure where all that money has gone.

That said, Burnett as much as admitted that he was getting paid for his work over in the comments section of that The Wrap article a few weeks ago:

So, from these comments we can infer then that Peters is paying himself as well. The actors are probably being paid some rate. DeMerritt and others from the professional realm may be too. That's where the budget is going. They're paying themselves to make half of a fan film.

Perhaps Red Omega will drop in and elaborate some on this for us?

 

[JoeZhang]

http://www.axanarproductions.com/captains-log-nov-12th-2015/

Then a 10:00am budget meeting with Line Producer Mike DeMerrit. As you all know, Mike worked on Star Trek Voyager and Enterprise. His first budget pass came in at $ 676,000 for the first half of the script. Now, we only have $ 400,000, so that was a shock! But we quickly eliminated $ 100,000 just from correcting errors and eliminating some really basic things we don’t need. Rob and I are reviewing the budget now to get that down even more. This is the way budgeting goes.

That's convenient. I am not quite sure how you overshoot your budget by almost 20%

Most of the most common things in project plans and project planning - I'm not actually saying that anything particular about Axanar but what is described here is not abnormal.

 

[Jedi_Master]

Nothing really to see here folks. A budget is really just a collection of best guesses, and it can be revised upwards and downwards with relative ease.

 

[Campe]

Yeah, I'm not too concerned about the budgeting issues. Nor do I really care about Peters paying his employees. That's fair. He's hired professional actors and crew in order to work for this production so it makes sense. But I am going to ask this simple question:

Is he paying himself?

Isn't it fairly standard practice in business that the owner of said business would be the last person to see a paycheck? I'm really not trying to pile on Peters here but I am looking at this from an ethical perspective.

Peters has probably got a handful of employees including Diana and Burnett at present. Should they be paid? Yeah. Probably. Depends upon their actual roles in production and where the money used comes from. Are they considered owners of Ares Studios? EPs on Axanar? I don't know the answer to those questions.

But what about his promise to his investors? Yes, the independent film Axanar, by copyright laws cannot incur profit. Yes, it seems that their goal was clear from the get go to build a studio and then make the film. He has an obligation to his investors to make this movie.

Therefore, ethically, I have to ask, by cutting part of this $100k? If he's paying himself, is he taking a pay cut? Might not be much, but at this point for them, I think every dollar will help them reach their goal.

 

[Jedi_Master]

Once you giveth the money, you cannot sayeth how they (legally) spend it...

 

[Campe]

I'm not speaking legally. I'm speaking ethically.
As someone who works in health care law, believe me I know: There is a HUGE difference.

 

[JoeZhang]

Is he paying himself?

Isn't it fairly standard practice in business that the owner of said business would be the last person to see a paycheck?

a management academic and small business owner asks - where you get that weird idea from?

 

[Campe]

Just for a long time I've heard that if you own a business it may be years before you cut yourself a paycheck.

That's why I'm asking the question. I really don't know. And Google has not been the most helpful with links taking both stances.

 

[JoeZhang]

Just for a long time I've heard that if you own a business it may be years before you cut yourself a paycheck.

That's why I'm asking the question. I really don't know. And Google has not been the most helpful with links taking both stances.

Well it's a nice rhetorical position and its a lovely narrative that people push around the idea of company founder as hero but as actual practice I'm sure it happens but it wouldn't be the default position.

 

[GSchnitzer]

Perhaps Red Omega will drop in and elaborate some on this for us?

Red Omega got the boot a couple of months ago. (Dual of Loken.)

 

[Campe]

Then I withdraw my statement. Thank you for setting me straight.

 

[Bagofmostlywatr]

Just for a long time I've heard that if you own a business it may be years before you cut yourself a paycheck.

That's why I'm asking the question. I really don't know. And Google has not been the most helpful with links taking both stances.

Speaking in my professional capacity, as someone who owns one business and a share in another.

**** that for a notion - If it don't make money, it don't make sense.

 

[YJAGG]

Once you giveth the money, you cannot sayeth how they (legally) spend it...

If you give money to a specific campaign or project ou can specify how the funds are to used when you give it it becomes a more formal contract, than jsut giving away a few dollars. You can also request proof of how the funds were spend.

Otherwise funds go into a general operating fund.

 

[Tom]

Ha, this a just a PR move plain and simple. With the announcement of the new official series and a slow moving Indiegogo Indemand drive, it is going to be almost impossible (or take a couple more years at least) to raise 660k more to film the second half of Axanar. They see the writing on the wall, and know they're in trouble. So, what to do? Let's magically cut 100k from the budget to make the film's funding goal goes a little more obtainable. Except another big cut to come soon as well.

I now you guys will say that budgets can get over estimated, and that is true to a degree, but not this much. Also remember that Alec has only 'professionals' working on the film, so how could his 'professionals' make such a unprofessional over estimate? hmm

Well at least Alec got his new studio business up and running from the fans who just want him to make film already.

 

[Jedi_Master]

Ha, this a just a PR move plain and simple. With the announcement of the new official series and a slow moving Indiegogo Indemand drive, it is going to be almost impossible (or take a couple more years at least) to raise 660k more to film the second half of Axanar. They see the writing on the wall, and know they're in trouble. So, what to do? Let's magically cut 100k from the budget to make the film's funding goal goes a little more obtainable. Except another big cut to come soon as well.

I now you guys will say that budgets can get over estimated, and that is true to a degree, but not this much. Also remember that Alec has only 'professionals' working on the film, so how could his 'professionals' make such a unprofessional over estimate? hmm

Well at least Alec got his new studio business up and running from the fans who just want him to make film already.

Tom, you are making me defend Axanar - and that means I hate you now.

I can see the PR angle, of course, but his project - like yours - is open ended. If someone wandered by and handed you a million bucks you better believe you guys would revise your budget in a hurry - adding additional costs for additional scenes, actors, and effects. If for some reason your costs decided to skyrocket or you had to close your fundraising efforts early then you would revise your budget downwards - removing costs for scenes you can no longer shoot, actors you can no longer hire, and effects you can no longer afford.
There is no obligation on you to make a specific product at a specific quality level.

The same goes for Axanar. There is no obligation for them to make a specific product at a specific quality level. So if they need to/want to change the budget - more power to them.

Again - a budget is a best guess. Even the budget I create for the condo that I run is based on some facts, some guesses and can be wiggled and jiggled based on numerous factors without ever crossing an ethical or legal line.

 

[JoeZhang]

Once you giveth the money, you cannot sayeth how they (legally) spend it...

If you give money to a specific campaign or project ou can specify how the funds are to used when you give it it becomes a more formal contract, than jsut giving away a few dollars. You can also request proof of how the funds were spend.

Otherwise funds go into a general operating fund.

Not sure where you get this from?

If you take their indiegogo campaign - if you pledge $15, you get a copy of the script in PDF form. If they don't make the film - what is you haven't received?

there are a couple of things like being an extra that you *might* be about to complain about if the film didn't get made but the vast majority of rewards have nothing to do with a film being made or released.

there is certainly nothing there that would give you the control you mention.