Last Classic Who Story you watched

[diankra]

Liz has a (improbably) large number of PhDs to her name, given her age, only one of which is a medical qualification.
In Britain at least, insisting on being known as Dr Whatever unless you're medical is seen as a bit of a sign of insecurity and self-importance, while senior medical doctors also drop the title in favour of Mr/Miss on reachign Consultant.
So Liz being a medical doctor but calling herself Miss is consistent with her having made it up to consultant. She's very young for that, but then anyone who's got all the degrees and PhDs the Brig mentions in Spearhead by that age is clearly capable of getting a qualification that take normal high-fliers several years within six months...

 

[Volpone]

Interesting. That is definitely different than in the USA. Here, if you've got a doctorate and people are paying you to use it, you'd want them to call you Doctor.

As an aside, it is interesting to see the different ways The Doctor addresses his title--ranging from the "Who's on first?" approach ("Doctor who?" "Quite.") to arrogant ("What are you a doctor of?" "Practically everything.") to the humble ("My title is purely honorary.")

I've considered calling myself "Doctor", but my German blood prevents it when it isn't true, so I've considered going the Hunter S. Thompson route and getting ordained by the Universal Life Church. And goddammit, for $13.99 they'll make me a Doctor of Space and Time.

 

[Timewalker]

I watched the first episode of City of Death yesterday, and its the most padded episode of Classic who I've seen since I finished Jon Pertwee's last seven parter. I swear, of the first episode of City of death, there is 5 minutes of story and 20 minutes of wandering around Paris. Since I'm not watching Doctor Who to watch Tom Baker get paid to be a tourist in Paris, this was pretty boring. I've heard a lot of good things about this serial, but it had better ramp up the story and cut out the wandering around Paris stuff next episode. As it is, so far its barely keeping me awake.

This is one of my favorites, precisely because of the location. It's a welcome change from the same gravel pit story after story.

Didn't you feel the tiniest emotion (humor, exasperation, bemusement) at Romana's first impression of the Mona Lisa: [Romana II voice]"Why hasn't she got any eyebrows?"[/Romana II voice]?

That's the sort of question a child might ask, but it's also the sort of question an alien might ask, or at least someone who is totally unfamiliar with such a famous work of art.

The "wandering around Paris" serves two purposes: Doctor Who is on location, and that's no cheap thing - why not show as much as possible? And the second is that the Doctor is showing Romana around a part of his favorite planet. He's been to Paris before, after all, in at least one of his previous regenerations.

How do folks feel about Turlough's revelation in Frontios about the Tractatots destroying his home planet, and then having a Trion Civilization in Planet of Fire? I didn't ntice anything necessarily directly contradictory, but, it would've been nice had they made some mention of Trion being a new home Planet.

I never thought there was much about Frontios that made sense, and have to wonder if they'd even thought about any consistency to Turlough's story beyond the Black Guardian arc.

Bluffing by making the enemy think that the hat stand was some sort of exotic weapon was good, though.

I wish they hadn't made Liz such a pushover. She's a real, actual Doctor, for goodness sake--the best UNIT could get on earth. Then this...alien comes in and steals her job. And he doesn't even have the decency to call her "Doctor."

I understand that it could have been problematic to have 2 "doctors," but I think they could have made it work. The first time he calls her "Liz" and sends her off to answer phones or make coffee, she should have corrected him and pointed out it is "Dr. Shaw."

I assume the producers/writers felt it would be too confusing to have both the leads with the title of "Doctor."

Harry Sullivan pointed out that he's a doctor, but it didn't do much good as the Doctor only acknowledged it maybe once, and in a rather offhand way.

Something they sort of did with the McCoy stories is that the novelizations (Done for most Doctor Who stories back then) were actually far more detailed than the actual TV stories, and in some cases could get away with elements that couldn't be used on TV. Rememberance of the Daleks is a good example of this.

I have most of the novelizations, and the ones by Ian Marter are especially good for adding in extra stuff here and there.

 

[kirk55555]

This is one of my favorites, precisely because of the location. It's a welcome change from the same gravel pit story after story.

Didn't you feel the tiniest emotion (humor, exasperation, bemusement) at Romana's first impression of the Mona Lisa: [Romana II voice]"Why hasn't she got any eyebrows?"[/Romana II voice]?

That's the sort of question a child might ask, but it's also the sort of question an alien might ask, or at least someone who is totally unfamiliar with such a famous work of art.

The "wandering around Paris" serves two purposes: Doctor Who is on location, and that's no cheap thing - why not show as much as possible? And the second is that the Doctor is showing Romana around a part of his favorite planet. He's been to Paris before, after all, in at least one of his previous regenerations.

Honestly, its been a week and I haven't had the slightest urge to watch anymore of that serial. Tom Baker's later years really haven't been very good, so I don't know when I'll get back to the Fourth Doctor.

 

[pteal1979]

Remembrance of the Daleks,

I still remember watching it when it was first broadcast back in '87

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

For me my last one was Logopolis..... Good story though I still don't understand all the Watcher stuff, as it's never happened before or after..

 

[Volpone]

No. Although, as I've pointed out before, up to this point, regeneration wasn't a routine thing. 1 regenerated naturally from old age. 2 had a regeneration imposed on him by the Time Lords in (what we assume) was a very controlled environment. 3 was dying and may or may not have regenerated before he was helped along by a much older and more powerful Time Lord. Speaking of which...

Said Time Lord was living in a wizened form at the end of his current life with a young apprentice--that turned out to be a projection of himself that he regenerated into. So in that regard, the Watcher is a bit like Cho Jee in "Planet of the Spiders"--although given that The Doctor is probably quite a bit younger than his mentor, the Watcher isn't as fully realized as the Cho Jee projection was.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

No. Although, as I've pointed out before, up to this point, regeneration wasn't a routine thing. 1 regenerated naturally from old age. 2 had a regeneration imposed on him by the Time Lords in (what we assume) was a very controlled environment. 3 was dying and may or may not have regenerated before he was helped along by a much older and more powerful Time Lord. Speaking of which...

Said Time Lord was living in a wizened form at the end of his current life with a young apprentice--that turned out to be a projection of himself that he regenerated into. So in that regard, the Watcher is a bit like Cho Jee in "Planet of the Spiders"--although given that The Doctor is probably quite a bit younger than his mentor, the Watcher isn't as fully realized as the Cho Jee projection was.

Ah,, fair enough... Didn't think of that...

 

[diankra]

For me my last one was Logopolis..... Good story though I still don't understand all the Watcher stuff, as it's never happened before or after..

Also, it could be that the Watcher stage is there in every regeneration, but so momentarily that he's not noticeable. It's only because he's somehow pulled back in time to co-exist with the Doctor in the run-up to the regeneration that we get a clear look at him this time.

 

[Timewalker]

This is one of my favorites, precisely because of the location. It's a welcome change from the same gravel pit story after story.

Didn't you feel the tiniest emotion (humor, exasperation, bemusement) at Romana's first impression of the Mona Lisa: [Romana II voice]"Why hasn't she got any eyebrows?"[/Romana II voice]?

That's the sort of question a child might ask, but it's also the sort of question an alien might ask, or at least someone who is totally unfamiliar with such a famous work of art.

The "wandering around Paris" serves two purposes: Doctor Who is on location, and that's no cheap thing - why not show as much as possible? And the second is that the Doctor is showing Romana around a part of his favorite planet. He's been to Paris before, after all, in at least one of his previous regenerations.

Honestly, its been a week and I haven't had the slightest urge to watch anymore of that serial. Tom Baker's later years really haven't been very good, so I don't know when I'll get back to the Fourth Doctor.

Well, if you don't like the standalones, why not try the E-space trilogy? And if it's Romana II you don't like, she leaves at the end of Warriors' Gate and there's still Keeper of Traken and Logopolis to watch.

 

[kirk55555]

I like Romana II well enough, although I liked Romana I better. Its just that, overall, Tom Baker's run post Leela has really gone down hill. I gave up on The Key to Time because it got very bad, and I think the writing has just kind of given up. I don't know if its just that Tom Baker stayed way too long, or if they just ran out of ideas or good writers, but my interest in post-Season 15 Tom Baker is practically non existent.

I wish Romana had been a companion earlier, when the writing would have made better use of her. As it is, the 4th Doctor seems to have run out of good stories, so I'm done for now. For completions sake I might go back, and I'm sure I'll watch his last few episodes if I decide to start with the 5th Doctor, but right now I don't feel like watching any more of the 4th Doctor.

 

[Volpone]

Well it continues down hill for the rest of the classic series. By 6 & 7, they're doing things that make you wish for late 4th Doctor stories. (But I agree "...Fang Rock" is the beginning of the end,IMO.

 

[kirk55555]

Well it continues down hill for the rest of the classic series. By 6 & 7, they're doing things that make you wish for late 4th Doctor stories. (But I agree "...Fang Rock" is the beginning of the end,IMO.

I love the 6th Doctor, I think Timelash is probably the only 6th Doctor story I might not watch again. I'd say a few 6th Doctor serials, like The Two Doctors or Attack of the Cybermen are better than even my favorite 4th Doctor stories. So, I don't really agree that Doctor Who doesn't pick back up after Tom Baker, although I'm aware that not many people share my love of the 6th Doctor.

Now, the 7th Doctor is a different story, but while the 7th Doctor has a few of the worst Doctor Who stories I've ever seen and a bunch of mediocre stuff, the 4th Doctor has had some stinkers that are almost as bad.

 

[Timewalker]

I like Romana II well enough, although I liked Romana I better. Its just that, overall, Tom Baker's run post Leela has really gone down hill. I gave up on The Key to Time because it got very bad, and I think the writing has just kind of given up. I don't know if its just that Tom Baker stayed way too long, or if they just ran out of ideas or good writers, but my interest in post-Season 15 Tom Baker is practically non existent.

I wish Romana had been a companion earlier, when the writing would have made better use of her. As it is, the 4th Doctor seems to have run out of good stories, so I'm done for now. For completions sake I might go back, and I'm sure I'll watch his last few episodes if I decide to start with the 5th Doctor, but right now I don't feel like watching any more of the 4th Doctor.

Well, the second E-space story, State of Decay, was originally written for when Leela was the Companion...

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

I freaking love that the Time Lords went to war with vampires and that the leaders were so big you needed a ship with a steel bolt to kill them.. That would be bloody awesome to have witnessed.

 

[kirk55555]

Well, the second E-space story, State of Decay, was originally written for when Leela was the Companion...

Well, maybe it could be near pre-season 15 quality, but I'm not going to watch the first or last E-Space serial, so it would probably be pointless to see it. There is a lot of Classic Who serials from Doctors 1-3 and 5 that I haven't seen yet. I'm only watching periodically anyway between all my other stuff. Its not like I'll never watch another 4th Doctor serial, its just that post-season 15 4th Doctor is the lowest priority when it comes to my classic Doctor Who viewing.

 

[Doctorwhovian]

Part of the reason the later Tom Baker seasons are different was due to the production changes-Phillip Hinchcliffe left and was replaced by Graham Williams, who upped the humor (partially due to Tom Baker) and scaled back the violence and frightening monsters. The look of the show I think suffered a bit, some of the model work improved but the sets and monsters suffered, with a few exceptions.

 

[The Four Doctor]

Don't forget the spiralling inflation of the late 1970s. The DW budget was substantially smaller in terms of purchasing power and continued to shrink in real terms - by 1983 DW had less than a third of the purchasing power in its' budget than it had had under Hinchliffe and the whole budget of S 26 couldn't have paid for two episodes of Star Trek: TNG. That's a big factor in what killed it i think - It was obviously much lower budgeted than TNG.

 

[Doctorwhovian]

Which is kind of interesting because the McCoy era-and Trial Of A Time Lord-has some of the better creatures and model FX (at least for the time and compared to other classic Who). Of course there were still some low-budget looking elements of course, and the console room set being phased out is also very noticeable as well.


Then again, maybe it was due more to better technology being available rather than any higher budget.

 

[Timewalker]

Well, the second E-space story, State of Decay, was originally written for when Leela was the Companion...

Well, maybe it could be near pre-season 15 quality, but I'm not going to watch the first or last E-Space serial, so it would probably be pointless to see it. There is a lot of Classic Who serials from Doctors 1-3 and 5 that I haven't seen yet. I'm only watching periodically anyway between all my other stuff. Its not like I'll never watch another 4th Doctor serial, its just that post-season 15 4th Doctor is the lowest priority when it comes to my classic Doctor Who viewing.

Well, the only thing you need to know for the backstory for this episode is that Adric stowed away in the TARDIS at the end of Full Circle (his brother had died fighting the Marshmen, so Adric had no other family ties among his own people and was a misfit anyway), and the TARDIS is stuck in E-space.

State of Decay is a creepy, gothic tale involving vampires, ancient Gallifreyan folklore, and there's a scene with bats that always gives me the creeps every time I watch this one. So of all the E-space stories, this is actually the best in terms of "creepy monster-ness", costumes, and the story makes sense. From what I've noticed of the stories you've discussed, you've certainly stuck with a lot that are far, far worse.

State of Decay is worth your time, unless vampires aren't something you're into.