Failure to Commit

[EnriqueH]

So I'm halfway through Season 7, a season that is surprisingly better than I expected after the see-saw quality of the Season 6 shows.

But what's frustrating the HELL out of me is the storyline's failure to commit to change.

We have a PHENOMENAL episode in "Attached" with Picard and Beverly. Action, suspense, romance and FINALLY it seems like they're going to hook up...and nothing. Beverly says something about "we should be afraid", and they go back to the status quo.

Then we have another great episode in "Eye of the Beholder". Probably the best Troi episode ever, interesting and entertaining. They have a GREAT "hook up" scene between her and Worf...but it was a hallucination.

What the hell?

This kind of "status quo" thinking plagued the TNG movies as well.

Some GREAT episodes tarnished by playing it safe.

 

[Shawnster]

TNG was still suffering from the episodic formula mindset. Nothing changes. Everything is status quo. You're able to watch the episodes out of order and not be confused.

DS9 is really the first Trek that tried the story arc format. Really the only Trek. Voyager's story arc was just the basic premise of being lost far from home. Even at that the only changes were with Kes departure, Seven's addition and the Paris/Torres relationship.

 

[2takesfrakes]

I am probably in the minority in that I prefer the episodic presentation over story arcs. For one thing, it's not any more satisfying to me, as it just drags out an inevitable conclusion to a story. They suffer from the same budgetary problems as a single episode, which only gets bolded and underscored due to the fact that it's the never-ending story.

Oh! Look! There's this huge war going on, but the budget can only handle very contained and controlled situations. The drama is still bracketted by the same conditions that applied to the single episode format and because the story lingers, its flaws and shortcomings become increasingly apparent - especially towards the end.

And if I realise early enough into it that there's nothing really all that special about this story arc, well ... it's going to be a month, or whatever, until this turd comes all the way out. With episodic shows, that same month could have a series entertain me in a variety of ways, which I'd prefer to being subjected to one half-assed idea for its supposed Cool Factor.

 

[MacLeod]

All formats of story telling have their pros and cons, but in terms of episodic aren't we really talking about continuity, that events of one episode aren't forgotton about X episodes later. Sure that problem can exisit in the more serialised approach as well but you don't need serialised to have continuity.

And certain premises lean more towards one format than the other, take a procedual like the long running L&O works great as an episodic format.

 

[Shawnster]

I am probably in the minority in that I prefer the episodic presentation over story arcs. For one thing, it's not any more satisfying to me, as it just drags out an inevitable conclusion to a story. They suffer from the same budgetary problems as a single episode, which only gets bolded and underscored due to the fact that it's the never-ending story.

I felt the same way over X-Files. Never ending story. Only deeper and deeper layers that ultimately had no point.

 

[RandyS]

I am probably in the minority in that I prefer the episodic presentation over story arcs. For one thing, it's not any more satisfying to me, as it just drags out an inevitable conclusion to a story. They suffer from the same budgetary problems as a single episode, which only gets bolded and underscored due to the fact that it's the never-ending story.

Oh! Look! There's this huge war going on, but the budget can only handle very contained and controlled situations. The drama is still bracketted by the same conditions that applied to the single episode format and because the story lingers, its flaws and shortcomings become increasingly apparent - especially towards the end.

And if I realise early enough into it that there's nothing really all that special about this story arc, well ... it's going to be a month, or whatever, until this turd comes all the way out. With episodic shows, that same month could have a series entertain me in a variety of ways, which I'd prefer to being subjected to one half-assed idea for its supposed Cool Factor.

Then I'm in the minority too. I also prefer the episodic format over story arcs. It makes the show easier to follow, and you don't have to know 17 different things going into any given episode.

That said though, story arcs do have their charms. Particularly when, as you said, the story is good.

In my opinion, ENTERPRISE did this best in it's fourth season. Multiple three, or two parters mixed in with standalone episodes. The third season though....ugh. Not only did the Xindi arc outlast it's welcome, it was a moronic story to begin with.

 

[Makarov]

I felt like Crusher/Picard and Worf/Troi paid off in All Good Things. One-off romances like Lessons bothered me more than those pairings.

But I'd rather have full reset button than long arcs that always hit the reset button *cough* BSG *cough*. To really do long arcs I would want it to be fully committed and actually have things change, like LOST did. With TNG I just find the episodic nature part of it's charm.

 

[Ghrakh]

But what's frustrating the HELL out of me is the storyline's failure to commit to change.

I'm not sure why they needed to? But maybe there would have been more dramatic changes in S8.

Anyway, another vote for the episodic TNG.

TNG was still suffering from the episodic formula mindset. Nothing changes. Everything is status quo. You're able to watch the episodes out of order and not be confused.

"Suffering"? How? And there are many "arcs" and references which carry across multiple (but non-sequential) episodes, even across different seasons, and watching them out of order might indeed confuse some.

 

[Lance]

All formats of story telling have their pros and cons, but in terms of episodic aren't we really talking about continuity, that events of one episode aren't forgotton about X episodes later. Sure that problem can exisit in the more serialised approach as well but you don't need serialised to have continuity.

And certain premises lean more towards one format than the other, take a procedual like the long running L&O works great as an episodic format.

Aye, people tend to get confused when they discuss 'episodic' versus 'story arc'. One can have continuity without necessarily having an arc based format, and TNG did tend to have a lot of continuity... what the OP is describing is really the frustrating "having it both ways" thing they had about pairing people up, but not wanting to change the status quo to do so. So we get things like Worf and Troi getting all snuggly with each other in alternate realities and such, but don't really do so in the 'real' verse, not even in "All Good Things...", when you think about it.

 

[Melakon]

But maybe there would have been more dramatic changes in S8.

I don't know where this Season 8 business comes from. I've never read anything official saying Paramount wanted a Season 8, they had decided that 7 seasons was optimum for maximum return in syndication.

 

[2takesfrakes]

I'm glad to see that I'm not alone in the minority! Another aspect about arcs versus episodic that doesn't sit well with me is that it's actually kind of lazy, milking a single theme episode after episode. The writing staff gets paid, do they not? Work these people! But I understand the use of cliff-hangers between seasons, though. And an occassional two-parter can do much to shake things up, a bit. Over-reliance on any one thing, whether it be a single, narrative thread, or CGI, or the celebrity of a certain actor is no fun for the audience, however ... or, at least not for me!

 

[Forbin]

While I love both formats, episodic is easier if you like to pop in an episode to watch while you're relaxing or doing something. Babylon 5 is a masterpiece, but it's kinda hard to pick out an episode to toss into the deck and watch during lunch.

 

[Mudd]

So-called "arc storytelling" on TV is a dodge in almost all cases. The day after the finales of most arc-driven shows, the Internet is consumed by fans wailing that the producers screwed the pooch.

We can name exceptions because they're notable as exceptions - Breaking Bad seems to be one.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

I am probably in the minority in that I prefer the episodic presentation over story arcs. For one thing, it's not any more satisfying to me, as it just drags out an inevitable conclusion to a story. They suffer from the same budgetary problems as a single episode, which only gets bolded and underscored due to the fact that it's the never-ending story.

Oh! Look! There's this huge war going on, but the budget can only handle very contained and controlled situations. The drama is still bracketted by the same conditions that applied to the single episode format and because the story lingers, its flaws and shortcomings become increasingly apparent - especially towards the end.

And if I realise early enough into it that there's nothing really all that special about this story arc, well ... it's going to be a month, or whatever, until this turd comes all the way out. With episodic shows, that same month could have a series entertain me in a variety of ways, which I'd prefer to being subjected to one half-assed idea for its supposed Cool Factor.

I'm not against episodic shows (I started a thread about this debate in the TV & Media section), but if you're going to be so episodic that no action of any episode can have any long term effect at all, then it's hard to care about the result of an episode.

Like, it's fine to make all the action of an episode self contained, but let characters find fulfilling relationships once in a while. Let characters develop as human beings then actually remember the lesson they learned later. Hands off the reset button. Not like having arcs made it harder to just watch any single episode in Parks & Recreation.

 

[CoveTom]

I can like both types of shows. I love Law & Order, which was so plot-driven and episodic that we hardly ever got to know the characters beyond their jobs. I also love Buffy the Vampire Slayer where comments made in the pilot episode don't pay off until the series finale. Both have their pros and cons.

That said, I think TNG was fine the way it was... episodic. It worked well. And I don't think that meant there was no character development. I'm sorry, but the Picard of "Encounter at Farpoint" was not at all the same man as the Picard of "All Good Things..." Events such as his assimilation by the Borg, his re-connecting with his family, his imprisonment and torture by the Cardassians, and his "life" in "The Inner Light" all impacted him over the long term.

Simply because characters did not enter sustained, long-term romantic relationships does not mean that the characters were static or had no development.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

I can like both types of shows. I love Law & Order, which was so plot-driven and episodic that we hardly ever got to know the characters beyond their jobs. I also love Buffy the Vampire Slayer where comments made in the pilot episode don't pay off until the series finale. Both have their pros and cons.

That said, I think TNG was fine the way it was... episodic. It worked well. And I don't think that meant there was no character development. I'm sorry, but the Picard of "Encounter at Farpoint" was not at all the same man as the Picard of "All Good Things..." Events such as his assimilation by the Borg, his re-connecting with his family, his imprisonment and torture by the Cardassians, and his "life" in "The Inner Light" all impacted him over the long term.

Simply because characters did not enter sustained, long-term romantic relationships does not mean that the characters were static or had no development.

Yeah, but if you're going to write an episode that is obviously leading toward a relationship, having them not enter one at the last minute under the pretense that they decided together to make the mature decision is a cheat.

If you don't want your characters to enter long term romantic relationships, avoid stories that have them as the logical result.

 

[Ghrakh]

^Some might call it a predictable result...

 

[Ithekro]

Because commitment to a long term relationship in science fiction often leads to one of the characters dying for the sake of drama.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

Not just in science fiction, in episodic shows in general, I despise storylines where they tease a romantic relationship between mains for years that never goes any place.

For those of you who watch Orange Is The New Black, I would call it analogous to Larry's 'Edging'. It's frustrating to the fans and a cheap, easy way to create enticing teasers. If they have no intention of getting leads together until the last episode I'd rather them just not do those storylines.

 

[Forbin]

I call it the Little Joe Effect - in an episode of Bonanza, Little Joe met a woman, fell in love, married her, and she was killed by the end of the episode. Next week he was back to normal.