Justin Lin is directing Star Trek XIII
- Thread starter Hythlodeus
- Start date
Not every movie can be a great movie, but a great movie can come from anywhere.
This next film will come under the same irrational criticism as the last two, and those who defend their criticism will not listen to reason or logic. That is okay, because twice so far, we've been given world class films.
I was worried when Bob Orci was outed from the director's chair, I do not know Justin Lin (or the F&F series or Community) and I wanted somebody who was passionate about his work to handle it. But now I think that we're in good hands and that once again, we will not only get another great Trek film, but a great film, period.
This next film will come under the same irrational criticism as the last two, and those who defend their criticism will not listen to reason or logic. That is okay, because twice so far, we've been given world class films.
I was worried when Bob Orci was outed from the director's chair, I do not know Justin Lin (or the F&F series or Community) and I wanted somebody who was passionate about his work to handle it. But now I think that we're in good hands and that once again, we will not only get another great Trek film, but a great film, period.
What an odd statement. Throwing out all the character work the series did and trying to make them into frenetic action movies instead of playing to the cast's strengths was "very similar to the TV series"? I don't see it.
Their strengths were their repertoire and sense of family that was already there, that was the point of making TNG films. Just as WOK was to TOS, FC was to TNG. Action films with our favorite characters, and that's okay! Star Trek comes in many forms, and it's "highbrow" concepts shouldn't take center stage. Outside of "Chain of Command," I've never seen a film or episode of similar intensity or "depth" as "12 Years a Slave" or "Lincoln."
Science fiction isn't that, not even 2001 or Interstellar.
Science fiction isn't that, not even 2001 or Interstellar.
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He's right, though. The movies were made more action oriented, but they were still tailored to fans of the TNG era. For example, the way Data behaves and how the crew reacts to it. People who are steeped in TNG episodes knows Data's habits, but anyone watching outside of that influence may be confused by their responses to his behavior.
But it is a continuation of his character arc from TNG. Without the TNG background, the emotion chip is meaningless.
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Followed up by vague references to Dr. Soong, and his penchant for naming his creations. Who the hell is Dr. Soong?
For that matter, who the hell are the Dominion and why are you guys at war with them? No one goes into that at all. Also, what's Ketracel White? Why is it bad?
TNG was very popular and I think a movie the likes of TWOK could even be as popular or more popular. Its been years since weve seen these guys on the big screen except as repeats.
And when I say the "likes of TWOK" I don't mean the same story as TWOK but the same tone. Not letting Stewart or Spiner having too much control.
You could have some DS9 or VOY appearances too. Just a good story but not so much reliance on quirky Data or the special effects. The trouble is that I can't see it making hundreds of millions at the box office without switching to a younger cast Its never going to be a Transformers or Star Wars type popular. But it could do well as say a B type movie.
Nope.
Nemesis was aimed at the action movie base, presumably to draw in more than the core audience. That is why we have blatant Prime Directive violations, poor decision making and giant explosions...IN SPACE
I do. Let's take a single example: Generations. Not only do they re-use the TV sets, props and uniforms (which is a good and a bad thing at once), but they get lost in techno babble as if they're talking to the TV audience, and refer to the show's obscure moments (the emotion chip, Farpoint station, etc.)
It's clear that Generations was meant to pander to Trek fans, especially given the two time period crossover, which casual viewers don't give a toss for. The other three movies aren't any better in that respect.
Followed up by vague references to Dr. Soong, and his penchant for naming his creations. Who the hell is Dr. Soong?
For that matter, who the hell are the Dominion and why are you guys at war with them? No one goes into that at all. Also, what's Ketracel White? Why is it bad?
Is a TV to movie adaptation supposed to not have any references? You'd think if it was pandering to a core base that there'd be a lot more minutia. You can comb these forums to find tons of unanswered nuggets, which means that the TNG movies in that regard aren't much different than the TOS movies (and yes, even these new movies) in that they kept what seemed like broad strokes without explaining things to us.
I'm pretty sure they were aiming at wider audiences while trying to maintain the existing one. That's not the easiest line to walk, especially just months after the series ended.
Chuckle. It also helped that in the interim there had been two successful motion pictures featuring the TOS characters that helped prove that there was still a market for Star Trek. One motion picture introduced us to a newly redesigned U.S.S. Enterprise, and the next focused on a superhuman villain named Khan.
Sound familiar?
Let's get that fourth nuTrek outta the way then!
Exactly so.
The TNG TV series had its "frenetic action" stories which were - not coincidentally - among its most popular and best remembered. "Best Of Both Worlds" and "Yesterday's Enterprise" come easily to mind. For TNG to have a chance of competing on the big screen it was absolutely necessary to follow and to try to scale up those kinds of stories, just as the TOS movies found their success by jettisoning the kind of pretensions seen in TMP in favor of stories which almost always featured a lot of shooting, fighting and space battles. The shining exception is The Voyage Home, which succeeds in the mold of a fish-out-of-water comedy of the kind that were popular in the 1980s.
But The Voyage Home kind of proves that you don't really need shooting per se. What they did was sort of balance all the elements of Trek pretty well. Yes there was action, but it was by far the one with the most character moments, it got a lot of the season two style humor in there, it tackled an issue, used a science fiction premise, and did it all without killing anyone or even blowing anything up. Though TUC is my favorite of the TOS films, I think TVH is the perfect model for a Trek film, not TWOK. TVH is kind of what TMP should have been.
The Voyage Home works because you don't have to have a ton of information about the characters to enjoy it. It was a mainstream hit. I'm sure there were fans calling it lowest-common denominator fare back in 1986. That Trek had been dumbed-down to sell tickets.
TVH was a one-off and couldn't be the model for an ongoing series. It's a comic film riffing off the by-then-established pop culture familiarity of Star Trek almost far enough at moments to approach Galaxy Quest territory, while leaning hard into a subgenre of comedy that was big at the time (in fact, Big would eventually be one film exemplifying it): Fish Out Of Water.
It's easy to believe the story that Eddie Murphy was an early casting idea for TVH, given his own success with the similar Beverly Hills Cop.
There were.
It's easy to believe the story that Eddie Murphy was an early casting idea for TVH, given his own success with the similar Beverly Hills Cop.
There were.
I think it's a mistake to think that a film is lowest-common denominator because you don't need to know anything about the characters going into it.
I also don't think it's dumbing the film down to make that particular concession. Not only that, but I bet there were some people who went in thinking "Wait, I thought this Kirk guy was captain of a ship called Enterprise. What's this tiny green bird of prey thing?"
It's the job of the movie to show the audience who the characters are during the movie, not who they were before before the movie.
Maybe TVH was a one-off, but it showed that Trek movies can at least be more like the show in that it's about problem solving and character interacting, rather than fighting a vengeful villain.
I also don't think it's dumbing the film down to make that particular concession. Not only that, but I bet there were some people who went in thinking "Wait, I thought this Kirk guy was captain of a ship called Enterprise. What's this tiny green bird of prey thing?"
It's the job of the movie to show the audience who the characters are during the movie, not who they were before before the movie.
Maybe TVH was a one-off, but it showed that Trek movies can at least be more like the show in that it's about problem solving and character interacting, rather than fighting a vengeful villain.