• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Things I Have Noticed on a TOS Rewatch

InklingStar

Fleet Captain
Fleet Captain
I grew up in the '80s, and do not remember a time when there was no Star Trek. My mother had it on and I became familiar with the show before I could understand it. A few months ago, I began a production order rewatch with my wife, who has only seen a few minutes of the show in her life. I have done beginning-to-end watches of TNG, DS9, and ENT but never the original series, so this has proven to be interesting.

Here are some things I have noticed:

* The average quality of the first dozen or so episodes is top-notch. Unlike the other shows, TOS hit the ground running.

* The main characters, at least through the first season and a half, were just Kirk, Spock, and McCoy. There was a rotating cast of background characters that included Sulu, Scotty, and Uhura, but also Chapel, Rand, DeSalle, Galloway, Kelowitz, Kyle, and a few others. Sulu, Scotty, Uhura, and later Chekov seemed to emerge as the main supporting cast gradually, unlike later shows where there were seven or eight main roles defined from the pilot.

* Watching in production order, I see how the characters evolve naturally, especially in the early part of season 1. The show is obviously extremely episodic, but some patterns emerge. For example, Kirk loses a woman he loves and his brother within two consecutive episodes. Also, the arguments between McCoy and Spock grow more vicious early in season 2, and they increasingly snipe at each other in "The Deadly Years", "I, Mudd", and "The Trouble With Tribbles" before having a heart-to-heart in the jail cell in "Bread and Circuses". Their interaction in the following episode, "Journey to Babel", is much friendlier.

* After a while, Kirk really has the "talk a computer to death" routine down pat. After figuring it out on the fly with Ruk and then Landru, he goes straight for the logical contradictions with Norman, Nomad, and the M5.

* Early Kirk comes across as much more bookish and nerdy than the popular conception we have of him as a shoot-from-the-hip womanizer. He has some old flames (the older woman Ruth, and the equally bookish Janet Wallace and Areel Shaw, among others) but in the first season he is somewhat awkward around women. He seems to learn the art of seduction, however, using Lenore Karidian and later Shahna and Kelinda to accomplish his goals. (It seems unfortunate that the Abrams movies emphasized the characterization of Kirk as the brash womanizer rather than the nerd that his best friend Gary Mitchell called a "stack of books with legs". That would have been more interesting, in my opinion.)

* "The Omega Glory" is not bad, until the American flag appears at the end, that is. Then it is just silly.

* "Spock's Brain" is not bad either, once you get past the premise. My wife rolled her eyes and laughed every time the words "Spock's brain" were spoken though, which was often.

* Speaking of "Spock's Brain", the scene at the beginning with McCoy standing beside Spock's brainless body reminded me of ST3-TSFS where McCoy will once again stand by an empty shell of Spock, only this time with his katra stuck inside himself.

* Sulu's absence for most of season 2 is really noticeable. It gave Chekov the chance to develop as a character, however.

* Since we are watching on Netflix, I am seeing a lot of the remastered episodes for the first time. There are a lot of beautiful new shots of Enterprise, as well as some gorgeous planets. The colors and sets stand out nicely, and aside from the fashions it looks like it could have been made today.

* We are only four episodes in to season 3, but the absence of Gene Coon, DC Fontana, and Gene Roddenberry is noticeable as well. The episodes are not as tightly scripted or edited as in previous seasons.

More to come as we continue to boldly go...
 
I like some of your observations, such as Kirk learning to talk computers to death and the Nimoy/McCoy relationship.

* Early Kirk comes across as much more bookish and nerdy than the popular conception we have of him as a shoot-from-the-hip womanizer. He has some old flames (the older woman Ruth, and the equally bookish Janet Wallace and Areel Shaw, among others) but in the first season he is somewhat awkward around women. He seems to learn the art of seduction, however, using Lenore Karidian and later Shahna and Kelinda to accomplish his goals. (It seems unfortunate that the Abrams movies emphasized the characterization of Kirk as the brash womanizer rather than the nerd that his best friend Gary Mitchell called a "stack of books with legs". That would have been more interesting, in my opinion.)

JJ Kirk is Bennett/Meyer Kirk crossed with pop-culture Kirk; all three of which aren't really TOS Kirk, for instance, I don't think TOS Kirk would have ever cheated on the Kobayashi Maru.
 
* "And the Children Shall Lead" was not as bad as I remember. So far, the problems in season 3 seem to arise mostly from carelessness in scripting and editing. Scenes go on much longer than they should, and important information (how did Kirk know that Melvin Belli was named 'Gorgan'?) gets lost in the process.
 
... for instance, I don't think TOS Kirk would have ever cheated on the Kobayashi Maru.
Certainly not the same way as alternate Kirk did. I just can't see original Kirk destroying the Klingon ships like he was playing a video game, Kirk was shown to be a man of mercy, he wouldn't fire on defenseless ships, even if they were Klingons.

:)
 
... for instance, I don't think TOS Kirk would have ever cheated on the Kobayashi Maru.
Certainly not the same way as alternate Kirk did. I just can't see original Kirk destroying the Klingon ships like he was playing a video game, Kirk was shown to be a man of mercy, he wouldn't fire on defenseless ships, even if they were Klingons.

:)

That's misreading that scene. He's dissing the test because he doesn't believe in it. He's mocking it by treating it so cavalierly.
 
... for instance, I don't think TOS Kirk would have ever cheated on the Kobayashi Maru.
Certainly not the same way as alternate Kirk did. I just can't see original Kirk destroying the Klingon ships like he was playing a video game, Kirk was shown to be a man of mercy, he wouldn't fire on defenseless ships, even if they were Klingons.

:)

That's misreading that scene. He's dissing the test because he doesn't believe in it. He's mocking it by treating it so cavalierly.

I think many people overlook one very important aspect of Kirk's cheating on the test—"Oh, he made it possible to rescue the ship." And he was given a commendation for original thinking for flipping one or two small variables in the computer sim code?

Kirk did way more than that. There was no ship to rescue! Kobayashi Maru was a trap set by the Klingons. (Should have been Romulans, as the two Neutral Zones are different. This has been addressed before.) In THE WRATH OF KHAN notice that the very moment the Klingon ships appear, Uhura states she lost the Kobayashi Maru's signal, not that it was jammed. There was no ship to rescue. That's the test of character—that your ship and crew are screwed because you were duped by a childishly simple ploy right at the border of a no-man's land with a deadly enemy. Duh!

And that's why Starfleet was so surprised at Kirk's test.

(The JJTrek version of the scene was terrible; Kirk the Jerk.)
 
Kirk did way more than that. There was no ship to rescue! Kobayashi Maru was a trap set by the Klingons. (Should have been Romulans, as the two Neutral Zones are different. This has been addressed before.) In THE WRATH OF KHAN notice that the very moment the Klingon ships appear, Uhura states she lost the Kobayashi Maru's signal, not that it was jammed. There was no ship to rescue. That's the test of character—that your ship and crew are screwed because you were duped by a childishly simple ploy right at the border of a no-man's land with a deadly enemy. Duh!

And that's why Starfleet was so surprised at Kirk's test.

(The JJTrek version of the scene was terrible; Kirk the Jerk.)
nuKirk did the test 3 times.
Why on the second try didn't he/everyone sit on the sidelines chewing an apple saying its a trick - I'm not sending my ship in?
I, like Kirk sort of don't understand why you would do the test more than once unless there's a possibility of winning.

You could see the test of character from the first test.

For instance some captains would be so by-the-book that they would never ever enter the Neutral zone no matter what. The test seems to be aimed at getting rid of these types of captains. Yet nukirk gets kicked to the curb for disobeying 'the rules' on Niburu.
 
...the arguments between McCoy and Spock grow more vicious early in season 2, and they increasingly snipe at each other in "The Deadly Years", "I, Mudd", and "The Trouble With Tribbles" before having a heart-to-heart in the jail cell in "Bread and Circuses". Their interaction in the following episode, "Journey to Babel", is much friendlier.
That's something I also noticed during my production order rewatch a few years ago. To be honest their sniping had got really spiteful and Spock was being borderline childish at times, so I was incredibly glad when they finally had it out in Bread And Circuses. Afterwards there was much more wit to their exchanges and the mutual respect from Season 1 had been restored. :)
 
The main characters, at least through the first season and a half, were just Kirk, Spock, and McCoy. There was a rotating cast of background characters that included Sulu, Scotty, and Uhura, but also Chapel, Rand, DeSalle, Galloway, Kelowitz, Kyle, and a few others. Sulu, Scotty, Uhura, and later Chekov seemed to emerge as the main supporting cast gradually, unlike later shows where there were seven or eight main roles defined from the pilot.

It's an interesting approach, I like that there is the instability and experimenting early on but also that they did eventually sort out who would be the recurring supporting characters.

Also, the arguments between McCoy and Spock grow more vicious early in season 2, and they increasingly snipe at each other in "The Deadly Years", "I, Mudd", and "The Trouble With Tribbles" before having a heart-to-heart in the jail cell in "Bread and Circuses". Their interaction in the following episode, "Journey to Babel", is much friendlier.

Interesting that "Bread and Circuses" was made at the middle of season 2 but was the second-to-last aired.
 
In my last TOS rewatch (in production order) a couple of months back, I noticed that I loved the natural character/relationships development, but I felt it was especially noticeable with Mr. Spock.

In fact, after spending about 34-35 of my 38 years watching TOS, it wasn't until this last rewatch that I felt that I finally kinda got to know Spock a bit better.

I also felt Season 3 was nowhere near as bad as its reputation though its budgetary constraints are much, much more evident with lack of location shooting and smaller, more minimalist sets. (Though as pointed out, certain episodes like "The Empath" and "Spectre of the Gun" were able to use minimalism to its storytelling advantage.)

I also felt Season 3 had some choice (and not so choice moments) for the characters, but I'm focusing on the positive here: McCoy in The Empath had to be one his finer moments in the franchise. The way he pushed The Empath away while she attempted to sacrifice herself for him spoke volumes about McCoy's bravery and character, choosing to let her live and endure his own lingering suffering.

"Requiem for Methuselah" was an episode that eluded me for years, and I finally saw it as the last remaining TOS episode that I had not seen. When I finally saw it, I thought I remembered seeing it as a very small boy because certain scenes had a vague familiarity to them, but anyway: the ending of this episode. Wow. I never saw Kirk quite like that before.
 
Kirk did way more than that. There was no ship to rescue! Kobayashi Maru was a trap set by the Klingons. (Should have been Romulans, as the two Neutral Zones are different. This has been addressed before.) In THE WRATH OF KHAN notice that the very moment the Klingon ships appear, Uhura states she lost the Kobayashi Maru's signal, not that it was jammed. There was no ship to rescue. That's the test of character—that your ship and crew are screwed because you were duped by a childishly simple ploy right at the border of a no-man's land with a deadly enemy. Duh!

And that's why Starfleet was so surprised at Kirk's test.

(The JJTrek version of the scene was terrible; Kirk the Jerk.)
nuKirk did the test 3 times.
Why on the second try didn't he/everyone sit on the sidelines chewing an apple saying its a trick - I'm not sending my ship in?
I, like Kirk sort of don't understand why you would do the test more than once unless there's a possibility of winning.

You could see the test of character from the first test.

For instance some captains would be so by-the-book that they would never ever enter the Neutral zone no matter what. The test seems to be aimed at getting rid of these types of captains. Yet nukirk gets kicked to the curb for disobeying 'the rules' on Niburu.

I've tended to assume the KM is a real ship within the simulation, but it's not possible to rescue anyone aboard it without getting your own ship destroyed in the process and/or initiating a war with the Klingons.

If we assume that Kirk in either universe doesn't believe in the no-win scenario, then I would assume he took it three times because he was trying different approaches, hoping to come up with something the developers of the test hadn't thought of. And if we assume he cheated the third time around, then he only "really" took it twice anyway.

Hell, if I'd gone through SF Academy I'd probably want another shot at it, as much from curiosity to see how the computer might react to unorthodox approaches as anything else. I might or might not bring an apple on further tests. And hell, one's willingness to go through the simulation again even knowing it's supposed to be a no-win scenario may itself reflect positively upon the tester. Starfleet likes officers who don't just take the first no for an answer, right?

What I thought was unfortunate was the TNG command test which I thought was intended to hearken back to this (might be wrong), where winning was simply a matter of ordering a holographic simulation of a real person to kill itself. How does that prove anything? It's unfortunate that there wasn't any way to set things up so that Troi believed the simulation was real and she was ordering the actual Geordi to kill himself.
 
What I thought was unfortunate was the TNG command test which I thought was intended to hearken back to this (might be wrong), where winning was simply a matter of ordering a holographic simulation of a real person to kill itself. How does that prove anything? It's unfortunate that there wasn't any way to set things up so that Troi believed the simulation was real and she was ordering the actual Geordi to kill himself.

They did a much better job of it with Wesley's Starfleet entrance exam in "Coming of Age".
 
My take on Kirk's KM solution prior to '09 was that he must have done something very clever that impressed his instructors...possibly programming it to offer more realistic options that showed a grasp of what it was really like out there.
 
Kirk did way more than that. There was no ship to rescue! Kobayashi Maru was a trap set by the Klingons. (Should have been Romulans, as the two Neutral Zones are different. This has been addressed before.) In THE WRATH OF KHAN notice that the very moment the Klingon ships appear, Uhura states she lost the Kobayashi Maru's signal, not that it was jammed. There was no ship to rescue. That's the test of character—that your ship and crew are screwed because you were duped by a childishly simple ploy right at the border of a no-man's land with a deadly enemy. Duh!

And that's why Starfleet was so surprised at Kirk's test.

(The JJTrek version of the scene was terrible; Kirk the Jerk.)
nuKirk did the test 3 times.
Why on the second try didn't he/everyone sit on the sidelines chewing an apple saying its a trick - I'm not sending my ship in?
I, like Kirk sort of don't understand why you would do the test more than once unless there's a possibility of winning.

You could see the test of character from the first test.

For instance some captains would be so by-the-book that they would never ever enter the Neutral zone no matter what. The test seems to be aimed at getting rid of these types of captains. Yet nukirk gets kicked to the curb for disobeying 'the rules' on Niburu.

Kirk Prime took the test three times, also.

"As I recall, you took the test three times yourself. Your final solution was, shall we say, unique."
 
Kirk had no issue of showing up people he didn't respect (Niles Baris). So I have no doubt that he broke the Kobayashi Maru in a manner similar to what we see in Star Trek 2009 to prove a point.

How could he reprogram it to make it more realistic? A programmer is going to know exactly how to beat a program when he has access to the code. Kirk had programming skills, per "Court Martial".

"Well, he programmed it to make it more realistic", is just people trying to excuse Kirk's actions. He violated the Starfleet Academy honor code by his actions. I, for one, have no issues with it. Young men often think they know best.
 
I agree that Prime Kirk reprogrammed the scenario in a different way than Kirk '09 did. Remember, Kirk said he made it so it was possible to rescue the ship, not definite. I'd imagine that the KM scenario still had enough variables in it that losing was still a possibility. As I understand it, that was the premise of the Strange New Worlds story "A Test of Character".
 
In the TOS novel "Kobayashi Maru", IIRC Kirk reprograms the simulation so that the Klingons fear/respect him, so he hails them and pretty much defuses the situation that way.
 
I think that may have been a story that was more about the journey than the destination, but I'd honestly have to reread it to have a qualified opinion.
 
Kirk had no issue of showing up people he didn't respect (Niles Baris). So I have no doubt that he broke the Kobayashi Maru in a manner similar to what we see in Star Trek 2009 to prove a point.

How could he reprogram it to make it more realistic? A programmer is going to know exactly how to beat a program when he has access to the code. Kirk had programming skills, per "Court Martial".

"Well, he programmed it to make it more realistic", is just people trying to excuse Kirk's actions. He violated the Starfleet Academy honor code by his actions. I, for one, have no issues with it. Young men often think they know best.

I thought that nuKirk 'reprogrammed' the Maru by seducing a girl. No programming skills there just seduction skills required.
Of course that was in a deleted scene.
 
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top