John Hoyt vs. Paul Fix: Battle of the Doctors

[EnriqueH]

Marsden inspired me to write this thread with these comments in the Majel Barret thread:

Colt.


And Dr. Boyce was good, too. I'm surprised they didn't like John Hoyt. I thought his was the best acting of the whole group, including Hunter...but Hoyt really has emotion in his voice without overdoing it, speaking with sincerity and conviction.

When he's talking to Jeff toward the begining is one of the best scenes of the episode, and his contribution to the breifing room scene really makes him sound like more than just the doctor but also a senior officer. (Doctors are not usually in the chain of command, although there are exceptions)

To which I'd like to add:

I *love* "The Cage" and it just occurred to me that the scene between Pike and Boyce is one of my favorite scenes, as well, and I think their chemistry has everything to do with it.

I really liked Boyce and would've liked to have seen more of him. He was an older man, but he seemed to have enough personality and strength to carry the role.

I never cared for Piper. In fact, over the years, I've even had trouble remembering him at all when thinking about this episode, except for him standing on the bridge kinda lamely.

I can understand why he was replaced. He was probably chosen because of his experience (I did some minor investigating into his work and I seem to remember that he had quite a few credits to his name.)

So anyway, I thought Boyce was by far the best of the two.

 

[BillJ]

Boyce. But part of that is he had better material to work with. Piper never really seemed necessary to "Where No Man...".

 

[The Old Mixer]

No contest, easily Boyce. I like Fix on The Rifleman, but he does nothing for WNMHGB, getting lost in-between Boyce and McCoy.

 

[EnriqueH]

I don't think Boyce was integral to the action, he was present, but not a major part of the action. He was integral to Pike's character development, however.

 

[The Old Mixer]

I just realized that the most memorable things about Piper are his pills and his pointed peaks...very alliterative.

 

[EnriqueH]

Colt vs. The WNMHGB yeoman. Colt had more memorable moments, but the Where No Man yeoman was hotter.

I prefer Where No Man Spock to The Cage Spock

 

[Marsden]

Wow, EnriqueH you read my posts.

Well, I voted Boyce, you kind of had me in the thread before I got here. Sometimes it's nice to be sick, it gives more time for posting.

Well, let me try to add some value here instead of my usual goofiness.

A quick check of chakotey.net on the two episodes in question using really simplistic methods reveals Boyce had 20 lines and Piper had 8.

A little further analysis shows the only scene where Piper has and significance is when he's reviving Jim and Jim says not to wake up Spock yet.

PIPER: It hit me, too, whatever it was. Kelso is dead, strangled. At least Spock's alive.
KIRK: Doctor Dehner?
PIPER: She went with Mitchell.
KIRK: Don't give him a pill until after I'm gone. It's my fault Mitchell got as far as he did. Did you see their direction?
PIPER: Yes, there was some morning light. They were headed across the valley, to the left of the pointed peaks. There's flatlands beyond.
KIRK: When Mister Spock recovers, you'll both transport up immediately to the Enterprise.
PIPER: But Captain
KIRK: If you have not received a signal from me within twelve hours, you'll proceed at maximum warp to the nearest Earth base with my recommendation that this entire planet be subjected to a lethal concentration of neutron radiation. No protest on this, Mark. That's an order.

Four of his 8 lines, and none of these is too spectacular. His other 4 lines introduce Dehner, tell how Gary is recovering and just kind of give him a reason to be there, but not a reason to be him, anyone could have delivered them.

Now, this was only one episode, but if Piper stayed, the doctor would not have been the "third main character", maybe Scotty or someone else.

Now, back to Boyce, he has 13 lines in that conversation with Pike in his quarters, although one is "Boyce here" he still has at least two very profound lines an several other good lines.

A man either lives life as it happens to him, meets it head-on, and licks it, or he turns his back on it and starts to wither away.

(That was my sig line for a long time.)

Take your choice. We both get the same two kinds of customers. The living and the dying.

Just on that there's no fair comparison, but then from the briefing room,

It was a perfect illusion. They had us seeing just what we wanted to see, human beings who'd survived with dignity and bravery, everything entirely logical, right down to the building of the camp, the tattered clothing, everything. Now let's be sure we understand the danger of this. The inhabitants of this planet can read our minds. They can create illusions out of a person's own thoughts, memories, and experiences, even out of a person's own desires. Illusions just as real and solid as this table top and just as impossible to ignore.

My memory was faulty, I didn't remember that being one line, but what a line, and he delivered very well.
I wonder why Boyce delivered this analysis and not Spock, both were there. Spock's role wasn't strictly defined as science officer, was it? If he was he really should have made some of these observations.

I wonder why Hoyt wasn't retained, as I said in that thread.

But, my conclusion is, poor old Piper didn't even get a chance to stand out. Maybe he could have been more memorable with what he was given but that runs the risk of all those bad things like scene hogging and overacting, he did what he was supposed to.

 

[EnriqueH]

I noticed that both Hoyt and Fix died in the 1980s and 1990s, so did they ever talk about their Star Trek experiences?

 

[ZapBrannigan]

When "The Cage" was rejected and Star Trek had to be re-tooled, I think NBC said or implied, "Make it like a Western!" And Paul Fix was a fixture in TV Westerns, so they cast him, as silly as that sounds.

Some of the music score for "Where No Man," especially parts that didn't make it into the syndicated episode, sound just like full-blown horse opera.

 

[Melakon]

Colt vs. The WNMHGB yeoman. Colt had more memorable moments, but the Where No Man yeoman was hotter.

Hotter for you, perhaps. Not for me. Yeoman Smith had hardly any participation in the story at all, she was set dressing and that's it.

 

[Tim Walker]

John Hoyt appeared in a Twilight Zone episode, "Will The Real Martian Please Stand Up?" Kind of a fun episode.

I liked Hoyt in The Cage. But, again, I thought that his character was looking too old to go on rigorous missions of exploration.

 

[Melakon]

Hoyt always looked old though, even 13 years earlier in 1951's When Worlds Collide when he was 46, as the mean wheelchair bound industrialist who finances the rocket project.

 

[BillJ]

Hoyt always looked old though, even 13 years earlier in 1951's When Worlds Collide when he was 46, as the mean wheelchair bound industrialist who finances the rocket project.

Great movie.

 

[Push The Button]

John Hoyt didn't have a lot to work with, but he turned in one of the best performances in The Cage. I always enjoy watching Boyce's pep talk with Pike, just a nice glimpse of the Trek that might have been. I wish he had been brought back to guest star in the series, maybe as Admiral Boyce of the Starfleet Medical Corps.

 

[Melakon]

Hoyt gives an interesting performance in The Outer Limits: The Bellero Shield, unrecognizable under heavy makeup (one of my favorite designs) as a peaceful alien. Sally Kellerman co-stars.

 

[scotpens]

Hoyt gives an interesting performance in The Outer Limits: The Bellero Shield, unrecognizable under heavy makeup (one of my favorite designs) as a peaceful alien.

He also spoke his lines in an odd falsetto. I would never have known it was John Hoyt if I hadn't seen his name in the credits.

 

[bbailey861]

John Hoyt did a much better job than Paul Fix as a one-shot Star Trek doctor simply because he had a much better script to work with. The writers didn't really give Fix anything to work with and it shows. Marsden is right, anyone could have delivered Fix's lines. I also agree with ZapBrannigan as to the reason Fix was hired in the first place. Paul Fix had a far longer career than Hoyt - almost a hundred more credits to his name, starting back in the silent era, worked in B westerns in the '30s before he did any TV westerns, and was in over two dozen films with John Wayne. Although only a few years apart in age, Fix looked a lot older as well which probably didn't help his case, either. In the end, I'm quite happy that neither man got the part of ship's doctor and the role ended up going to De.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

I *love* "The Cage" and it just occurred to me that the scene between Pike and Boyce is one of my favorite scenes, as well, and I think their chemistry has everything to do with it.

I really liked Boyce and would've liked to have seen more of him. He was an older man, but he seemed to have enough personality and strength to carry the role.

Hoyt was a solid actor no matter the part, so his understanding of what GR wanted turned his doctor into someone earthy and blunt--clearly the successful mold used for McCoy, as opposed to Fix.

I never cared for Piper. In fact, over the years, I've even had trouble remembering him at all when thinking about this episode, except for him standing on the bridge kinda lamely.

Well, Fix was not Roddenberry's choice--he wanted Kelly, but Goldstone pushed for Fix. As near-perfect as the second pilot was, Fix just drags around like a man called out of a 20 year retirement to serve on one more mission....not enjoying a moment of it.

Colt vs. The WNMHGB yeoman. Colt had more memorable moments, but the Where No Man yeoman was hotter.

I cannot argue with that. Colt looked like a befuddled tomboy.

 

[mb22]

I noticed that both Hoyt and Fix died in the 1980s and 1990s, so did they ever talk about their Star Trek experiences?

Hoyt was interviewed in the December 1986 (#113) issue of Starlog.
https://archive.org/stream/starlog_magazine-113/113#page/n0/mode/2up

 

[telerites]

No contest, easily Boyce. I like Fix on The Rifleman, but he does nothing for WNMHGB, getting lost in-between Boyce and McCoy.

I agree. Fix will always stand out to me as more of a Western actor as that is how I have unfortunately stereotyped him.

Hoyt was on a couple of Rifleman episodes himself and several Hogan's Heroes. Along with a plethora of other shows but I picked those two because I am fan of both and would see him other roles so I had no specific inclination to a genre for him.

But above all, the scene with Pike in his cabin was enough to put Boyce far ahead.