What Is Star Trek Really About?

[F. King Daniel]

I think it was David Gerrold who once called Trek "a buddy cop show in space", referring to Kirk and Spock.

The original pitch calls Trek "Action - adventure - science fiction" which is a pretty good fit, except for TNG which is more like "diplomacy - technobabble - speeches"

Some fans like to say things like "an exploration of the human condition" but for the life of me I don't have a clue what "the human condition" is.

 

[The Wormhole]

Some fans like to say things like "an exploration of the human condition" but for the life of me I don't have a clue what "the human condition" is.

And to be honest, I doubt half the people who say that know what "the human condition" is either. But it sound pretentious and philosophical, so people say it to sound intellectual.

 

[wulfio]

He's making a joke using the Yiddish term "mensch" as opposed to the German word "mensch".

I don't see how Star Trek is about the "Übermensch".

Listen to Gene Roddenberry talk about his vision of the future, and humanity, and then read Thus Spoke Zarathustra. From the Augments, to Federation ideals. The Trek universe is littered with references.

Not seeing it. The Augments are bad guys. The Federation's "ideals" are mutable and somewhat generically "good". GR was mostly believing his own hype.

I honestly don't think you have read the book.

Well for starters, there's the misconception that the Ubermensch implied eugenics. For example, Hitler, master Aryan race, ww2. For star trek reference, Khan, the augments, eugenics wars.

Then we have egalitarianism in relation to the Ubermensch. Federation with an idealistic society.

The federation also embodies the notion that god is dead. Where purpose and values are not found through other worldly influences, but through our own goals and the common good.

The Ubermensch, or the over human, is an ideal to strive towards. To better ones self and society. And not succumb to flights of fancy. Aiming towards being infallible essentially. The show has preached just that time and time again between federation values, and the prime directive. It's literally the federations mission statement.

Some of his other themes:

Will to power was a commentary on society. An egalitarian state signifies a departure from the desire to accumulate, and a drive towards self actualization. The federation represented an egalitarian state, where the idealism had transcended that of contemporary society's. Again, as it was mentioned quite frequently in the show.

The show also criticized herd mentality, and emphasized the importance of individualism.

The prime directive, and all the circumstances that occur because of it, is also a direct representation of the Genealogy of Morals.

If you're familiar with his works, I honestly don't know how one cannot see it. Nietzsche's finger prints are all over federation idealism.

edit: P.S It's not like it's conjecture that Roddenberry read Nietzsche. He named an alien race after Nietzsche on Andromeda.

 

[fireproof78]

Listen to Gene Roddenberry talk about his vision of the future, and humanity, and then read Thus Spoke Zarathustra. From the Augments, to Federation ideals. The Trek universe is littered with references.

Not seeing it. The Augments are bad guys. The Federation's "ideals" are mutable and somewhat generically "good". GR was mostly believing his own hype.

I honestly don't think you have read the book.

Well for starters, there's the misconception that the Ubermensch implied eugenics. For example, Hitler, master Aryan race, ww2. For star trek reference, Khan, the augments, eugenics wars.

Then we have egalitarianism in relation to the Ubermensch. Federation with an idealistic society.

The federation also embodies the notion that god is dead. Where purpose and values are not found through other worldly influences, but through our own goals and the common good.

The Ubermensch, or the over human, is an ideal to strive towards. To better ones self and society. And not succumb to flights of fancy. Aiming towards being infallible essentially. The show has preached just that time and time again between federation values, and the prime directive. It's literally the federations mission statement.

Some of his other themes:

Will to power was a commentary on society. An egalitarian state signifies a departure from the desire to accumulate, and a drive towards self actualization. The federation represented an egalitarian state, where the idealism had transcended that of contemporary society's. Again, as it was mentioned quite frequently in the show.

The show also criticized herd mentality, and emphasized the importance of individualism.

The prime directive, and all the circumstances that occur because of it, is also a direct representation of the Genealogy of Morals.

If you're familiar with his works, I honestly don't know how one cannot see it. Nietzsche's finger prints are all over federation idealism.

edit: P.S It's not like it's conjecture that Roddenberry read Nietzsche. He named an alien race after Nietzsche on Andromeda.

The only aspect of that analysis that I will disagree is the emphasis on the individual. While I may not be as familiar with the work of Nietzsche, the Federation had a lot of social planning, and contributions to society by the individual.

I'm not really how to articulate it, or familiar enough with Nietzsche to see how the individual works in society, so I apologize for any misunderstanding. But, I do agree that Star Trek became more and more about the ideal human, and evolving past where humanity is at the moment.

As for the OP, most people have articulated it well, but the action-adventure in space with social commentary idea is what has always been clear to me. It means a lot of different things to different people, though

 

[Nightdiamond]

!967 through 1987 TOS and Movies: Adventures in space with social commentary. There is hope for humanity in the future.

!987 through 1994 TNG : Adventures in Space with subtle Utopian messages. Humans have officially made it. All vexing problems have been solved.

!995 through 2001: DS9 VOY : Action and adventure in space with grittier edge. More battles while not forgetting our human values and progress.

2001 through 2005 Enterprise, TNG Movies: Attempts to be cool and relevant, rougher language, sexuality.

2009 Movies: non stop action and adventure in space. Main goal is to compete as a block buster, and achieving box office success, keeping Trek relevant in the mainstream.

Seriously, no sarcasm, I think this describes some of it

 

[fireproof78]

!967 through 1987 TOS and Movies: Adventures in space with social commentary. There is hope for humanity in the future.

!987 through 1994 TNG : Adventures in Space with subtle Utopian messages. Humans have officially made it. All vexing problems have been solved.

!995 through 2001: DS9 VOY : Action and adventure in space with grittier edge. More battles while not forgetting our human values and progress.

2001 through 2005 Enterprise, TNG Movies: Attempts to be cool and relevant, rougher language, sexuality.

2009 Movies: non stop action and adventure in space. Main goal is to compete as a block buster, and achieving box office success, keeping Trek relevant in the mainstream.

Seriously, no sarcasm, I think this describes some of it

One point that I will expand upon is 2009 movies. There are also some social commentary woven throughout, which is also part of keeping it relevant.

 

[BillJ]

2009 Movies: non stop action and adventure in space. Main goal is to compete as a block buster, and achieving box office success, keeping Trek relevant in the mainstream.

Seriously, no sarcasm, I think this describes some of it

One point that I will expand upon is 2009 movies. There are also some social commentary woven throughout, which is also part of keeping it relevant.

Agreed. I'm pretty sure every show has been about monetary success and part of that success is keeping it "relevant in the mainstream".

 

[Nerys Myk]

Listen to Gene Roddenberry talk about his vision of the future, and humanity, and then read Thus Spoke Zarathustra. From the Augments, to Federation ideals. The Trek universe is littered with references.

Not seeing it. The Augments are bad guys. The Federation's "ideals" are mutable and somewhat generically "good". GR was mostly believing his own hype.

I honestly don't think you have read the book.

Well for starters, there's the misconception that the Ubermensch implied eugenics. For example, Hitler, master Aryan race, ww2. For star trek reference, Khan, the augments, eugenics wars.

Then we have egalitarianism in relation to the Ubermensch. Federation with an idealistic society.

The federation also embodies the notion that god is dead. Where purpose and values are not found through other worldly influences, but through our own goals and the common good.

The Ubermensch, or the over human, is an ideal to strive towards. To better ones self and society. And not succumb to flights of fancy. Aiming towards being infallible essentially. The show has preached just that time and time again between federation values, and the prime directive. It's literally the federations mission statement.

Some of his other themes:

Will to power was a commentary on society. An egalitarian state signifies a departure from the desire to accumulate, and a drive towards self actualization. The federation represented an egalitarian state, where the idealism had transcended that of contemporary society's. Again, as it was mentioned quite frequently in the show.

The show also criticized herd mentality, and emphasized the importance of individualism.

The prime directive, and all the circumstances that occur because of it, is also a direct representation of the Genealogy of Morals.

If you're familiar with his works, I honestly don't know how one cannot see it. Nietzsche's finger prints are all over federation idealism.

edit: P.S It's not like it's conjecture that Roddenberry read Nietzsche. He named an alien race after Nietzsche on Andromeda.

NO I haven't read the book, nor have I claimed to.

And I don't think Roddenberry actually created "Andromeda" and I doubt he came up the "Nietzscheans.". His contributions to "Andromeda" were his rejected pilots from the 70s, Planet Earth and Genesis II. That's where the name "Dylan Hunt" comes from, but little else.

Star Trek isn't a singular vision, in spite of the Roddenberry hype. Many people, writers, producers and others, contributed to its ideas. The Prime Directive is a plot device to provide character conflict and drama. Khan and the Eugenics wars are just a riff on WWII and the Nazis and the fears of a Third World War. "Space Seed" like many episode came from "outside" and were rewritten by people like Coon, Roddenberry and Fontana.

 

[Sector 7]

!967 through 1987 TOS and Movies: Adventures in space with social commentary. There is hope for humanity in the future.

!987 through 1994 TNG : Adventures in Space with subtle Utopian messages. Humans have officially made it. All vexing problems have been solved.

!995 through 2001: DS9 VOY : Action and adventure in space with grittier edge. More battles while not forgetting our human values and progress.

2001 through 2005 Enterprise, TNG Movies: Attempts to be cool and relevant, rougher language, sexuality.

2009 Movies: non stop action and adventure in space. Main goal is to compete as a block buster, and achieving box office success, keeping Trek relevant in the mainstream.

Seriously, no sarcasm, I think this describes some of it

I think these are good descriptions of Star Trek. I do, however, believe we had very good social commentary since 2009, especially in Star Trek into Darkness.

 

[Tim Walker]

At its best, Trek is: 1. Exploring the human condition 2. Social commentary 3. Examining moral/ethical questions

Such justifies the efforts to produce Trek episodes. If it was just a matter of entertainment, why not do something cheap like a so-called "reality show."

 

[BillJ]

Such justifies the efforts to produce Trek episodes. If it was just a matter of entertainment, why not do something cheap like a so-called "reality show."

Because reality shows don't entertain everyone. I doubt people that are entertained by reality programming are somehow opposed to scripted drama.

Most folks seem to like a mix.

The only thing that justifies Star Trek for the studio is the potential return on investment.

 

[Amaris]

I think it was David Gerrold who once called Trek "a buddy cop show in space", referring to Kirk and Spock.

The original pitch calls Trek "Action - adventure - science fiction" which is a pretty good fit, except for TNG which is more like "diplomacy - technobabble - speeches"

Some fans like to say things like "an exploration of the human condition" but for the life of me I don't have a clue what "the human condition" is.

Alive, followed eventually by dead.

 

[Tim Walker]

Posts to other forums have commented that technobabble is a big part of Trek.

So, could you kill Trek by dropping most of the technobabble?

 

[erastus25]

I think these are good descriptions of Star Trek. I do, however, believe we had very good social commentary since 2009, especially in Star Trek into Darkness.

I don't consider shoe-horning modern geo-political issues into a ridiculous plot to be "good" social commentary. The ideas of drone warfare raised by STID were overshadowed by the ludicrous nature of the torpedos, and the suicide bombing at the beginning of the movie turned out to be a total misdirection.

 

[BillJ]

I think these are good descriptions of Star Trek. I do, however, believe we had very good social commentary since 2009, especially in Star Trek into Darkness.

I don't consider shoe-horning modern geo-political issues into a ridiculous plot to be "good" social commentary. The ideas of drone warfare raised by STID were overshadowed by the ludicrous nature of the torpedos, and the suicide bombing at the beginning of the movie turned out to be a total misdirection.

So... pretty much SOP for Star Trek.

 

[erastus25]

I think these are good descriptions of Star Trek. I do, however, believe we had very good social commentary since 2009, especially in Star Trek into Darkness.

I don't consider shoe-horning modern geo-political issues into a ridiculous plot to be "good" social commentary. The ideas of drone warfare raised by STID were overshadowed by the ludicrous nature of the torpedos, and the suicide bombing at the beginning of the movie turned out to be a total misdirection.

So... pretty much SOP for Star Trek.

At times yes, but not always. I'll just agree to disagree on STID. The merits/demerits of that film have been debated enough around here.

 

[Salinga]

TOS: Cowboy Trek.
TNG: Diplomacy Trek.
DS9: War Trek.
VOY: Pulp Trek.
ENT: Immature Trek.

 

[Nightdiamond]

I think these are good descriptions of Star Trek. I do, however, believe we had very good social commentary since 2009, especially in Star Trek into Darkness.

I don't consider shoe-horning modern geo-political issues into a ridiculous plot to be "good" social commentary. The ideas of drone warfare raised by STID were overshadowed by the ludicrous nature of the torpedos, and the suicide bombing at the beginning of the movie turned out to be a total misdirection.

I'm not a big a fan of STID, but I do get what JJ is doing.

I think the action and acting is too hyper, similar to what you see in the Transformers movies. That's the fanbase.

I like action scenes, but it's was like one hyperactive fast paced action scene after another. Hard to get over Spock being so over emotional.

The studio idea is that the Transformers formula = big box office, so mold Star Trek into that formula too.

But JJ couldn't avoid it. If Trek 2009 failed at the box office, then the franchise might have been in danger falling off the map for a long time.

So they had to pull out all the stops and gimmicks, if it would make money.

Like Carole Marcus gratuitous panty and bra scene for kicks.

JJ even admitted he was never a huge fan of Star Trek--so it goes without saying he was brought in to save it and make the franchise money.

-----by following the current box office success formula.

 

[Kemaiku]

The same as every other Trek before it.

 

[BillJ]

TOS: Cowboy Trek.

Actually, it is Star Trek.