Starfleet...Military or Not

Army Air Force/Corps, actually. Gotta stand up for my dad's service.

 

One of the modern "mega" cruise ships is like a shore resort.

 

Yep. I'm really surprised by all the amenities that cruise liners provide these days. Back in the day, a swimming pool and casino were revolutionary. Then came wave pools and indoor skydiving. Now they film TV talk shows on those things.

In many ways, a mega cruise ship offers more activities than many big name shore resorts. But if that can be done for recreation, then a military vessel with a multitude of functions -- especially a much larger 24th century one -- really can be a mobile base.

 

Actually, it is a multi-mission capable starship. It is a jack-of-all-trades. From being an explorer to science vessel to transport to diplomatic courier to being assigned as the first line of defense against against incursions ("Angel One", "Chain of Command").

Starfleet is definitely the military, we have some hiccups from the material where it is stated that it isn't. But the preponderance of actual in universe material paints it as the military arm of the Federation.

 

Thanks. I must have been confusing GR and Heinlein's service.

Thank you

 

Apparently, no one. In the two scenarios where the Xindi weapon showed up (alternate timeline in Twilight, real deal in Zero Hour) there are no Earth defenses on hand despite the fact they would have spent a year expecting a massive weapon to show up. In Twilight, Earth's only protection is the NX-01 which followed the weapon from the Expanse (although the script also included a Vulcan ship which was removed due to budget) and in Zero Hour just one Andorian ship.

 

The closest approximation, as has been mentioned before, is the Age of Sail. The Trek universe seems to be dangerous enough that, when you boldly go, your vessel needs a significant capacity for self defense. (Which make such a vessel useful for waging a defensive war). Hence, para-military organization, if not outright military.

I think that the bulk of Star Fleet likely functions like a coast guard, using smaller vessels. To explore, you need a large vessel, to carry provisions, science labs, etc.

 

So after 100 or so posts, it seems the more appropriate question(s) is:

What country's Armed Forces does Starfleet most resemble?

or

What branch of the Armed Forces does Starfleet most resemble?

 

Just by virtue of the ranking system (Admirals and Ensigns only exist in the Navy) and by the fact that they are on a Star 'SHIP," I would say the Navy would be the closest service in existence today to Star Trek. As for the country, I would say they seem to resemble the UK or Canada in terms of their demeanor and actions. Of course, that would depend upon the series too. TOS would be a bit more 'cowboy' like the U.S., whereas TNG give me a UK or Aussie feel. That's just a general impression though and it has no basis in anything other than my perceptions of the countries and how they generally react to conflicts.

 

Only a half dozen (or so) countries use the ranks of Lt. Commander, and Commander. That narrows it down a bit. TOS Starfleet certainly was modeled on the US Navy.

 

E-D is not a "base" in a military sense as it is not a facility from which operating forces and/or their supply chains originate. That is pretty clearly where starbases fit in. All the Enterprises have been operating units.

Victorian British Royal Navy: A far-flung network of colonies and territories to patrol. A significant role in policing and representing a distant government. Bases, dockyards and coaling stations dotted around the globe. Surveying, mapping and scientific duties. Some rivals to keep an eye on, but no imminent war.

Why would non-Anglophone countries use English rank titles? I wouldn't make too much of that.

 

^ST has been occasionally referred to as Hornblower in space, so some resembelence to the 18th-19th centruy RN is not enteirly unexepected.


http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Horatio_Hornblower

 

I would, in the first season of TOS, Spock wasn't a captain third class or a corvette captain, he was a lieutenant commander.

This goes to Jedi Master's question of which country's Armed Forces does Starfleet most resemble.

 

Indeed, but the Hornblower stories were definitely about a navy at war. And in the 18th century, the Royal Navy was virtually dismantled in peacetime. It wasn't till the Victorian period that a substantial peacetime naval establishment was maintained.

All that really tells us about is language preference. A Canadian officer would be both a lieutenant commander and a capitaine de corvette.

 

I'd say Starfleet most emulates the US Navy, since like the USN, Starfleet also rebranded single star flag officers. They stopped being Commodore and became Rear Admiral, Lower Half.

 

A thought exercise would be to figure out how Starfleet can not be a military, as Picard suggests, by the time of the 24th century.

What could have changed in the roughly 100 years between Kirk being a soldier to Picard stating that Starfleet is not a military orginization? Terms changed (again) so that military means something specific rather than what it mean in the early 21st century?

Is it an orginization that can be called up to be the military in times of war, rather than be a full time military force? Could they draft people from Starfleet to become gound troops during the war with the Dominion? Were the troops seen during the war with the Klingons part of Starfleet, or some other orginization that uses similar uniform styling? (Nor the Battle too Strong)

 

Picard's just parroting propaganda which downplays Starfleet's militarism because military is a dirty word in peace loving utopia. Obviously in the 23rd century, things were different and Starfleet embraced its military nature. Kirk was honest that he served in a military, Picard imply fancies himself an explorer and tries to ignore the fact that he is a military officer.

 

It could definitely be a 'personal viewpoint' thing. Picard was somebody with a strong interest in archeology and the study of things, so on some level his leanings were more scientific. On the other hand, the crowning moment of his career (the Battle of Maxia) was one where he outwitted and defeated an enemy ship in combat, and had a tactical maneuver named after him. He's indisputably a military officer of some considerable measure, but he simply prefers the analytical approach.

Kirk was seemingly trained as a soldier. Although his Starfleet wasn't any less inclined towards diplomacy than Picard's, it would seem the emphasis was skewed more towards at least the possibilities of war, and Kirk's generation had a harder edge. One might reasonably describe their outlooks as the difference between a 'peace time' and 'war time' military. Picard had seen combat in his past, and was evidently just as accomplished a soldier as Kirk, but on a personal level it didn't tally with his beliefs or interests, so he used every opportunity to downplay Starfleet's military side when asked about it, citing as evidence the fact that Starfleet hadn't engaged in large scale combat for many years, and that the organisations own mission statement emphasized exploration and discovery over simple territorial imperitives.

People mention "the speech" from TNG: Peak Performance, but what they fail to recognise is that the context of the entire premise of that episode is based around the idea that Starfleet is engaging in the war game exercise because they recognise that they need to harden up their training regime again in advance of the impending Borg threat. Perhaps the introduction of more formal uniforms the following year was also a part of this concerted move to, as it were, 'turn the tide' of thinking for a generation of officers who were not necessarily as militarily minded to begin with (the occasional graduate or NCO who'd seen battle with Cardassians aside. )

 

As I said, as a thought experiment. Instead of the obvious route that it is a miliary and Picard is full of propaganda notions, think up how it could not be one. That is considerably harder to do and might prove interesting in how it could be setup to not be a military, yet be a military in a state of energency. While also being an interstellar orginization with ships and species from a large number of member worlds (It seems other worlds still have their own forces, the Benzar for example was new to the Federation in the 2360s.)

 

My first thought was that it's a consequence of just good ol' fashioned colonialism, especially since the British Empire basically set foot on every continent. When countries gained independence and formed their own militaries, they were probably more apt to adopt English practices since that's what they had known in terms of structure, hierarchy, and order -- after all, if you see what works for their goals, you're more likely to use that knowledge for yourself. Several Southeast Asian countries, like the Philippines for example, use ranks in English for their militaries.

But military rank titles is just one area. English, or more broadly general European, styles influenced those countries' cuisine, architecture, even religious practices. Since it happened to those areas, I don't believe it would be too far off for military to be similarly affected and adopted.