Why was the last episode of DS9 so incredibly awful?
- Thread starter ElimGarak
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I assume you are referring to the "Satan vs. Jesus" thing between sisko and dukat, and I agree.
Gotta love this ending, probably my favorite and often considered the best.
Ian Keldon
Fleet Captain
Definitely the best Trek series ender of all.
Well thats a broad generalisation of the episode, do you have specifics that you didn't like?
I'm not sure I'd go that far - "All Good Things" is probably my favorite. But DS9's was fantastic as well.
Course when we say "best" ender...there are really only three, right? TOS didn't really have an "ender" - it just ended. I don't know about ENT, though.
Both TOS and TNG had similar ending, when we last see them, both Enterprises are sailing away toward their next mission, which is my favorite way to end a series.
Voyager completed it "mission," by arriving back at Earth, job done.
Sisko paid the price the Prophets said he would have to pay, in Sacrifice of Angels. Living up to their name of "Prophets."
Would someone please tell me what the hell to last episode of Enterprise was about?
Everything in it was great up until the comic book style ending. It was just too corny for me. Much better than Voyager's and Enterprise's ending, but a bit too much.
Both TOS and TNG had similar ending, when we last see them, both Enterprises are sailing away toward their next mission, which is my favorite way to end a series.
Voyager completed it "mission," by arriving back at Earth, job done.
Sisko paid the price the Prophets said he would have to pay, in Sacrifice of Angels. Living up to their name of "Prophets."
Would someone please tell me what the hell to last episode of Enterprise was about?
Wasn't it about the creation of the Coalition of Planets, I do seem to recall they made an episode of TNG set on the holodeck of the Ent-D with a recreation of events circa 2161 called "These are the Voyages" after this story however.
Didn't one of the writers say something like "even Shakespeare would have had a hard time writing the end of Deep Space Nine"?
I don't think any television series finale pleases all fans, but "What You Leave Behind" was/is a great sendoff for DS9.
I don't think any television series finale pleases all fans, but "What You Leave Behind" was/is a great sendoff for DS9.
While there were certain aspects of the finale I did not like, I would hardly call it a "contrived pile of garbage." However, unlike your vague generalization, I will list the things I didn't like.
1. I really did not like the reuse of battle footage from a previous episode for the "final battle." I felt it was an incredibly cheap move, especially for the series finale.
2. The whole "Sisko abruptly leaving to go die in a fire cave with Dukat" thing was totally contrived. If they spent more time on that scene, it might have worked better, but it felt like it was just thrown in at the last minute.
3. Damar's death was also very contrived.
Other than those three points, the finale was just fine.
That is actually quite funny.
I'd argue against calling it a "cheap move". Just because it's the last episode doesn't mean they have an bottomless money pit to call on.
I have 3 gripes with the final as well.
First, is to do with the reused battle footage. I don't think all the reused footage was bad. The only stuff that was out of place was the Sacrifice of Angels footage, you cut that out and the new and old footage gels far better.
Second, there should have been a scene with Ben and Jake after he joined the Prophets. I don't think you'd lose anything with the final scene with Jake looking out at the wormhole if they did have a chat before hand.
Third, the lack of Jadzia in the flashback. As I understand it there were problems due to them previously using her image earlier in the season. It would have been nice if something could have been figured out.
Other than those 3 things I enjoyed the finale.
I guess I must be the only one who honestly never really noticed any reused battle footage in the finale. Maybe it's because I don't really care for battle scenes in general to begin with. And to be honest, even with the knowledge that there are in fact reused shots, they don't really bother me at all. I guess I'm just wired differently.
As for the finale itself; it's not bad, but I was never a big fan of it. I don't know why, but somehow it feels disconnected.
As for the finale itself; it's not bad, but I was never a big fan of it. I don't know why, but somehow it feels disconnected.
Ian Keldon
Fleet Captain
I like TNG, don't get me wrong, but on it's best day it was only as good as a moderately good ep of DS9.
DS9 did far more, and far more interesting things with it's characters than TNG was ever allowed to do (thank the Great Bird for Berman's contempt of DS9 in this case).
The finale of DS9 therefore FELT like a finale. The crew was breaking up, going on to the next chapter in their lives. Things would never be the same again.
AGT felt like just another ep (2-part ep but ep nonetheless). The status quo prevailed, and we were left with the impression that their journey together was not over yet, that we could come back and pick up right from there and nothing would have changed. Which indeed it was the case with 4 feature films yet to come.
Arguably, TNG's true "finale" was Nemesis. Some characters moved on, one (Data) died, new characters were coming in (Madden), and the status quo came to an end.
Totally disagree with you, Ian and Gazomg, but that's OK. I love both shows, so perhaps I'm biased, but I honestly thought AGT was the almost perfect ending. But then, so was WYLB. I really don't feel a need to quantify which one (show or finale) was better. They were great, and I'm happy to leave it at that.
P.S. I also never noticed the reused battle scenes. To be honest, very few battle scenes stay in my mind longer than, oh, 27 seconds or so.
P.S. I also never noticed the reused battle scenes. To be honest, very few battle scenes stay in my mind longer than, oh, 27 seconds or so.
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Thing with the re-used battle footage in WYLB is it nicked one of the most iconic shots from Sacrifice Of Angels, so it stood out far more than any typical re-used footage. Though it's funny how they re-used the battle footage from Yesterday's Enterprise in Redemption, and no one really complains about that. Shouldn't there be a bigger budget available for Season Finales?
Still, it sure is odd seeing the same 'Garak fleeing an explosion' shot from Dogs Of War in with all the other exploding shots during WYLB's space battle.
Still, it sure is odd seeing the same 'Garak fleeing an explosion' shot from Dogs Of War in with all the other exploding shots during WYLB's space battle.
Remember that a large portion of the budget for any episode is taken upby things like gust stars and in WYLB we had guest characters :-
Damar
Weyoun
Dukat
Female Founder
Garak
Kai Winn
Admiral Ross
Chancellor Martok
Vic
Cassiday Yates
etc..
TV reuses footage all of the time as a cost saving measure so that money can be spend elsewhere.
Damar
Weyoun
Dukat
Female Founder
Garak
Kai Winn
Admiral Ross
Chancellor Martok
Vic
Cassiday Yates
etc..
TV reuses footage all of the time as a cost saving measure so that money can be spend elsewhere.
That whole arc was horrid. Dukat was a favored villain/anti-hero of mine before season 7. I tend to just delete out the whole thing when i think of the end.
Otherwise I felt it wrapped up things nicely, giving us a general feeling where each of the characters we had grown to know over the years was headed.
As far as my favorite ending? All Good Things gets my vote, with DS9 coming second. 3/4 is hard for me neither Voyager nor Ent's ending were particularly good.
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