In that respect, the world of Star Trek is rather obviously fantasy. Not all real bodies look ideal in skin tights. I certainly wouldn't be comfortable in public in Captain Picard's first season uniform.
Dress Uniforms
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In that respect, the world of Star Trek is rather obviously fantasy. Not all real bodies look ideal in skin tights. I certainly wouldn't be comfortable in public in Captain Picard's first season uniform.
Nobody on the SHOW was either, I'm fairly sure of that.
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Dress uniforms? Looks like they're just wearing dresses!
Loose the pants and shoes and you have regulation Starfleet nightshirts.
Captain Rob, I do believe you beat me to it. 
Caption: "Captain, it was you who lost that bet on the Worlds Series. Why do I have to wear a dress for a whole week too?"
A sash at the waist and they'd be quite fashionable.
A sash at the waist and they'd be quite fashionable.
One would have to be pretty lean and muscular to wear seasons 1-3 Starfleet Uniforms almost like the body of young athletic man in his late teens and early twenties to look good in those uniforms.
Same here. I figured they were the equivalent of the US Army "Blue Mess" like this
http://www.marlowwhite.com/army/uniforms/mess-blue/officer-male
Maybe I made that connection because I was Army. Or maybe the lapels of the Blue Mess being your "branch" color makes it a little Trek Like?
USN Dinner Dress Whites or Army Blue Mess aren't really a "Class A" they are for special occasions where a civilian would wear a tuxedo.
The actors didn't like their costumes because the stretch material was giving them back pain - not for aesthetic or thematic reasons. I could imagine they (like anyone) didn't like having to keep in shape for their job, but cry me a river. They were making lots of money living the dream.
The characters were supposed to be in shape. They were active Starfleet officers from an advanced future civilization. Would you rather watch this guy? "This costume is a joke. I'm an actor, not a model."
Also, setting aside that in-universe the uniforms were made of exceedingly comfortable future materials, it's unrealistic to think future fashions should echo contemporary norms. Both Julius Caesar and William Wallace butchered men while wearing "skirts". Hercules did so naked. Hitler was completely covered up.
In early TNG's vision of the future, they weren't embarrassed by their looks, and fanciful adornments were viewed as anachronistic, inefficient, and distancing.
...But the characters also complained, about both comfort and fashion. Lamentably, they made complaints somebody today might have made, rather than interestingly futuristic complaints about how the male uniform is way too tight at the butt and how it reveals way too little waist.
On the other hand, while
, the costuming of television shows always draws its inspiration from somewhere, and the TNG dress uniforms certainly harken back to the long coats closely associated with the military in the late 19th and early 20th century. When the hemline later goes up, the resemblance moves towards the 18th century... It would have been interesting to go even further that way and add stockings and fancy sleeve cuffs!
Trek is all about a future that repeats history anyway: the 1960s in spaaaaace! three centuries later, then the 1980s in spaaaaace!, etc. But it seldom dares be about distant history, which is bad for a show that should be all about distancing.
Timo Saloniemi
During the first two seasons? When?
By echo here I meant "copy," not "be influenced by." The dress uniforms hearken the long-coats, but their form-fitting thin-fabric-ed look wouldn't have been considered decent during the Victorian Era. Victoria would have thought the dress uniform as naked as some fans find the regular one.
Point is, future fashion should look wrong to us today, and we should aspire to the themes presented in well-made "wrong" future fashions.
The problem with the original TNG uniforms was the material. It needed to be less stretchy (or more) and better tailored. It looked uncomfortable, and that's not very futuristic.
To its hackneyed detriment. Flash Gordon was popular in its day too.
I'm curious about something. If future fashions should look wrong to us, why should we aspire to use them?
Another uniform which should be consigned to history. The Army still has a white mess jacket that is purely optional, but the Navy requires officers to have one after they make LCdr, even though they will probably go years without wearing it.
OT: At one time, all the US services had dress whites for officers. I went by a summertime retirement reception at Fort Meade about 25 years ago that was swarming with generals and admirals in whites. The Navy and Marines had stand-up collars, the Air Force had silver shoulder boards, the USAF had blue ties and the Army black, but it was basically a sea of white polyester. Anyway, with modern lightweight fabrics there's no real need for hot weather whites that are seldom worn anyway. The USAF dropped theirs in the mid-'90s, the Marines in 2000 and the Army last year, though it had been in a phase-out period since '09. The Navy, of course, won't turn loose of a uniform for anything, though they did put the brakes on the resurrection of the service khaki.
I'm curious about something. If future fashions should look wrong to us, why should we aspire to use them?
More realistic? For instance, I never understood all the complaints about TMP uniforms looking like "pajamas." What I'm wearing today would probably look like pajamas to someone from 200 years ago, and it makes sense that it would.
I'm curious about something. If future fashions should look wrong to us, why should we aspire to use them?
Because they would improve on current ones. The prospect of Western women going without corsets would have seemed very wrong indeed to Victorian sensibilities, but it is perfectly acceptable (thank goodness!) in the twenty-first century.
Perhaps I'm biased, but of all the Trek dress uniforms, only those from TOS look dressy to me. And as Mojochi pointed out upthread, very few services have nearly identical standard and dress uniforms. In this respect, TOS convention for dress uniforms follows contemporary practice. As to their appearance, Kirk's green tunic gets a bye, but McCoy's and Spock's uniforms are positively elegant.
Indeed. And I bet it was silk. Dupioni, probably.
Vulcans are a stoic lot.
As to the other characters: complaining in front of Sisko would be a bad idea either. He would give them a dressing-down, even though he might dislike the gala uniforms either.
Some people, Worf among them, would still try to find an excuse for not having to wear the dress uniform.
I remember Jadzia saying "...and I forget the dress uniform" or something like that.
I guess if they had the choice between being nude at a Betazoid wedding and wearing the dress uniform, most would prefer the dress uniformen. Especially Worf.
Yes, and Kirk complained about his gold braid in "The Naked Time," although his complaint was more philosophical than sartorial.
Kilana, Weyoun, Quark, Morn, Garak, Seven of Nine and Vic Fontaine are (among others) the lucky ones who don't have to wear dress uniforms.
The Doctor (EMH) could simply modify his uniform without having to change into it. He is unlikely to feel uncomfortable. I'd like to see the Doctor in the white dress uniform....
The Doctor (EMH) could simply modify his uniform without having to change into it. He is unlikely to feel uncomfortable. I'd like to see the Doctor in the white dress uniform....
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