Will there ever be any novels set between 2161 and 2254?

[Procutus]

I realize that I'm most likely a minority of one here with this one, but if there was ever a 'lost era' in Trek that really hasn't been explored in print yet, it's the years between the founding of the Federation after the Romulan War in 2161 up to the Enterprise visiting Talos IV under Captain Pike in 'The Cage', 2254.

One of the things about this gap of almost 100 years that I'm curious about what were some of the classes of starships that become the 'workhorses' for Starfleet after, the retirement of the Daedalus class in 2196 (according to the ST Chronology) and prior to the commisioning of the Constitution class ships in the 2240s.

Not to mention I imagine there would be a lot of interesting socio-political ground to explore in these decades as well.

Again, I doubt we'll ever see this, but it does seem like it's a period of time that has been overlooked.

 

[Christopher]

There have been books with flashback segments set in that period, such as the Sarek flashbacks in Spock's World and Sarek and the flashbacks to Pike's formative years in Burning Dreams. The Final Reflection took place in that period, though it's no longer compatible with canon. Same with the flashbacks in Final Frontier and Best Destiny. There's also Vulcan's Glory, the TOS Starfleet Academy young-adult novels, My Brother's Keeper: Republic, and various short stories.

 

[Rush Limborg]

^I recommend Final Frontier. It actually fits quite nicely as a "transition" between ENT and TOS--provided you tweak the given years a bit.

There's a reference to an Enterprise that "first really tied the races of the Federation together".

Hmm...

 

[Procutus]

I'll have to re-read Final Frontier. It's been years since I first read it and I remember liking it a lot. I wonder if the original intent of that line was the ship featured in the rec-room of the refitted E in TMP?

 

[JD]

I realize that I'm most likely a minority of one here with this one, but if there was ever a 'lost era' in Trek that really hasn't been explored in print yet, it's the years between the founding of the Federation after the Romulan War in 2161 up to the Enterprise visiting Talos IV under Captain Pike in 'The Cage', 2254.

One of the things about this gap of almost 100 years that I'm curious about what were some of the classes of starships that become the 'workhorses' for Starfleet after, the retirement of the Daedalus class in 2196 (according to the ST Chronology) and prior to the commisioning of the Constitution class ships in the 2240s.

Not to mention I imagine there would be a lot of interesting socio-political ground to explore in these decades as well.

Again, I doubt we'll ever see this, but it does seem like it's a period of time that has been overlooked.

I'm thinking that perhaps they are waiting to come up with a conclusion to the RW storyline before they move to that period.

 

[Procutus]

^

I agree with you that using that approach would make sense, as any novels set in that period would have the RW backstory to work off of.

I remain hopeful. It's taken over 40 years, but I'm finally getting to read about the war, so who knows?

 

[Sci]

One of the things about this gap of almost 100 years that I'm curious about what were some of the classes of starships that become the 'workhorses' for Starfleet after, the retirement of the Daedalus class in 2196 (according to the ST Chronology) and prior to the commisioning of the Constitution class ships in the 2240s.

Well, if nothing else, we know that Kelvin-type starships were being used in the early 2230s!

 

[seigezunt]

Was there ever a book written of Forbidden Planet? ;-)

 

[Christopher]

Was there ever a book written of Forbidden Planet? ;-)

Yes, a 1956 novelization by Philip MacDonald under the pseudonym W.J. Stuart.

 

[Procutus]

One of the things about this gap of almost 100 years that I'm curious about what were some of the classes of starships that become the 'workhorses' for Starfleet after, the retirement of the Daedalus class in 2196 (according to the ST Chronology) and prior to the commisioning of the Constitution class ships in the 2240s.

Well, if nothing else, we know that Kelvin-type starships were being used in the early 2230s!

Good point. I assume that they exist in the Prime Universe.

 

[Christopher]

Well, if nothing else, we know that Kelvin-type starships were being used in the early 2230s!

Good point. I assume that they exist in the Prime Universe.

Yes, because the timelines didn't diverge until the moment of Nero's arrival.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Was there ever a book written of Forbidden Planet? ;-)

Certainly! There was even a 1991 reprint of it about the time of the Bob Carlton stage musical, "Return to the Forbidden Planet". I bought a copy as a gift/research for the Australian actor playing Robbie/Ariel.

 

[Procutus]

Well, if nothing else, we know that Kelvin-type starships were being used in the early 2230s!

Good point. I assume that they exist in the Prime Universe.

Yes, because the timelines didn't diverge until the moment of Nero's arrival.

Unless this is an entirely different universe to begin. I can see Nero's intervention affecting Kirk's life, but not changing when the Enterprise was launched, the spatial positions of planets (Vulcan and Delta-Vega), when Chekov was born, how long Admiral Archer lived, and things like that that.

I truly believe that both Spock and Nero when back into time, but much like the U.S.S. Defiant did, they emerged into a parallel universe where there were already a vast number of differences.

 

[Christopher]

Unless this is an entirely different universe to begin.

It isn't.

I can see Nero's intervention affecting Kirk's life, but not changing when the Enterprise was launched

Oh, that's easy to explain. A huge, super-advanced, apparently Romulan ship destroys a Starfleet vessel in 2233 -- don't you think Starfleet would get worried about a new Romulan offensive and adjust their shipbuilding priorities? Not to mention reverse-engineering the advanced technology detected by the Kelvin's scans of the Narada. After all, the new Enterprise is much bigger and more powerful than the Prime one -- it would've taken a lot longer to design and build.

the spatial positions of planets (Vulcan and Delta-Vega)

The shot of Spock "seeing" Vulcan in the sky of Delta Vega is a physical impossibility (no planet that close to a hot desert world like Vulcan could possibly be frozen over), and it only appeared in a hallucinatory mind-meld sequence. Even screenwriter Roberto Orci has acknowledged that it's most likely a symbolic representation of Spock sensing Vulcan's destruction telepathically.

And clearly this isn't the same Delta Vega seen in "Where No Man Has Gone Before." It's certainly not impossible for two planets to have the same name (how many Romes and Londons and Alexandrias and Springfields are there in the world?).

when Chekov was born

There doesn't need to be a direct and obvious cause and effect. Start a new timeline and lots of things are going to turn out differently just by the luck of the draw and the operation of chaos theory. Or maybe there is a more direct link. Maybe Starfleet's new shipbuilding priorities led to Andrei Chekov getting a different job that allowed him to start a family four years earlier.

how long Admiral Archer lived

Nobody said it was Jonathan Archer. Could've been his grandchild.

Besides, if you insist that every continuity discrepancy requires a whole separate reality, then all past Star Trek would have to fall into over a dozen separate realities. Look at the huge contradictions between TOS and The Wrath of Khan. How the hell did Khan's multiethnic followers turn into a bunch of blond Aryans, and how were they all in their 20s after being stranded for 15 years? How come they had movie-era Enterprise insignias and equipment rather than TOS-era? How come Khan recognized Chekov? How in the hell could Kirk say he'd "never faced death" after losing Gary Mitchell, his brother, his sister-in-law, Edith Keeler, Miramanee, and his freaking unborn child??!!!

Star Trek is loaded with contradictions, yet we choose to gloss them over and pretend it's a consistent reality. The continuity glitches in the new movie are no greater than the ones that have already existed within the franchise for decades. It's a double standard to gloss over those past discrepancies yet claim the ones in the new movie are irreconcilable.

 

[Rush Limborg]

Besides...given enough time and effort, every discrepency will have an explanation.

For example...while Kirk has seen death, he tends throughout TOS to, after a moment of silence, brush it off and get on with the next assignment. He's never actually faced death, per se. He's looked at it--and denied its impact on him.


As for Archer...I recall the refs said he died the year of the NCC-1701's launch (2245)--after the Kelvin.

Perhaps the defence buildup also resulted in advances in medicine, etc., resulting in a longer life span for him. Been known to happen.

 

[Sci]

Good point. I assume that they exist in the Prime Universe.

Yes, because the timelines didn't diverge until the moment of Nero's arrival.

Unless this is an entirely different universe to begin.

It's not.

I can see Nero's intervention affecting Kirk's life, but not changing when the Enterprise was launched,

Easy. The destruction of the Kelvin at the hands of an incredibly powerful Romulan ship (the Universal Translator being able to detect Nero's language) leads to increased tensions between the Federation and Romulan Star Empire. Maybe one or the other breaches the Neutral Zone and skirmishes start, if not another all-out war. As a result, maybe some people end up promoted to the admiralty that weren't before, and starship development projects that were underway for years get delayed. So maybe the Constitution development project gets delayed in the mid-2230s, and maybe Admiral Beckman ends up in the charge of the Constitution project instead of Admiral Bennet. When development resumes, Admiral Beckman decides to have the designers go back to the drawing boards and re-design the whole thing just before the Constitution and the Enterprise go into production, adding another ten years before the class is finally launched in 2258.

the spatial positions of planets (Vulcan and Delta-Vega),

Different Delta Vega. Is it that hard to imagine, given how many Springfields there are?

when Chekov was born,

What, major changes in the political landscape can't affect when two people meet or when two people decide to have children?

how long Admiral Archer lived,

It had never been canonically established when Archer died -- nor, for that matter, did ST09 make it clear that the Admiral Archer Scotty is referring to is Jonathan Archer.

Actually, if we take the bio screen from "In A Mirror Darkly" as being authoritative, then it's most likely that Scotty wasn't referring to Jonathan Archer. Because that bio screen made it clear that Archer went on to become Federation President. Scotty wouldn't be calling him "Admiral Archer" after becoming President, any more than anyone in the Army would have been calling him "General Eisenhower" after he'd been in the Oval Office.

 

[Christopher]

^Wow, we independently gave practically the same reply.

 

[Rush Limborg]

^Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand...you gave it first, Chris.

I think Sci's just subtly following The 33rd Rule of Aquisition. (Look it up.)

 

[Christopher]

Now, there's no call for that. There are lots of times that people make a post without realizing someone else has given a similar response earlier in the day.

(Besides, how would paraphrasing another person's post constitute sucking up to the boss?)

 

[Rush Limborg]

^Well, Imitation Is The Sincerest Form Of Flattery, and all that.