Why Is "Into Darkness" So Hated?

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by TedShatner10, May 20, 2022.

  1. Birb-of-Prey

    Birb-of-Prey Commander Red Shirt

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    Because someone threw a bunch of superficially Star Trek-y things in a blender without worrying how they would work and sold it off for some easy latinum.
     
  2. jbohn

    jbohn Commander Red Shirt

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    What ruined Into Darkness for me was that so much of it was so familiar... like they took a bunch of the major moments from the previous film, mixed them around a bit and re-used them. The first time I saw it in the theatre, I could not get past the feeling like I had seen half of the movie before:

    Both films had:
    - Bad guy with a huge ship
    - Kirk goes off a cliff
    - Kirk chased by a monster / local population
    - Main characters go to a club to hang out
    - unnecessary underwear scene
    - characters have to quickly get from point A to point B and transporters can't be used
    - Enterprise emerges from hiding (Titan / underwater)
    - attack/crash in San Francisco
    - character close to Kirk dies to push his story forward
    - Old Spock shows up
     
  3. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Star Trek 2009: So good they made it twice.
     
  4. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I'll take it.
     
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  5. Smellmet

    Smellmet Commodore Commodore

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    I'd add the space jump to that list . Even though it was a good sequence it was a bit lazy having done something very similar in the previous film.

    I would also say the Enterprise rising above the clouds after nearly crashing near the end of the film was the bit lifted from 09, not the underwater scene.
     
  6. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    This is a good point. It's a scene I find so annoying that I generally skip it on my ID rewatches.
     
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  7. Vasquez Rocks

    Vasquez Rocks Commodore Commodore

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    Starships are no longer needed if you can just beam from planet to planet.
     
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  8. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That depends on how many people or how much stuff you can beam, doesn't it?
     
  9. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    People say that all the time yet nothing is shown supporting the notion. As a counterexample. Stargate starts out with a teleportal to various worlds, yet for some stupid reason the dumb humans insist upon building starships.
     
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  10. Deks

    Deks Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Nonsense.
    Even with TW beaming, you'd need ships for exploration purposes.
    SF doesn't just go from one star to another and lands on planets meeting new cultures... they explore nebulas, supernovas, anomalies, star clusters, etc.
    Besides, you can't exactly initiate first contact with an unknown alien species by simply beaming onto their planet (which would definitely make you appear hostile).

    TW beaming however would make things easier... in the sense that SF could technically just beam a starship from one location to the next. The device might need to be as large as a drydock in that case, but that's a small price to pay if you ask me.

    Also, SF could easily use the technology to beam self-assembly facilities to a given location (say outer reaches of UFP space) and assemble a starbase or defense perimeter remotely.
    It could also provide other ships with much needed support and supplies very fast.
     
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  11. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Starfleet becomes the Protoss?
     
  12. Prometheus59650

    Prometheus59650 Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I like the film just fine.

    Don't get me wrong, everything wrong with it that you want to point to is probably valid, but I still like it. I like the throughline from beginning to end of Kirk and Spock beginning to understand one another and forging a friendship, though, Spock's scream is ridiculous.
     
  13. Deks

    Deks Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    If you wish to use that particular analogy... fine... but TW beaming would greatly add to SF's logistical capabilities and easier management of remote areas of space where SF activity may be lower.
     
  14. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Well, naturally. Transwarp beaming is very useful. I just found the scifi comparison funny.
     
  15. Deks

    Deks Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    We aren't told what the limitations of TW beaming are in canon, but according to the novelization of Star Trek Into Darkness, beaming to Qo'noS for Khan was a more complicated plot. The small portable transwarp beaming device on the jumpship only had enough power to beam Khan to an automated cargo station on Earth's orbit. From there he accessed a heavy-load transporter to beam onto an unmanned vessel in orbit of Luna. Khan had equipped the ship with another unauthorized transwarp device wired into the empty ship’s engine. Utilizing the entire energy output of the engine for a single massive burst, he could have beamed anywhere in our galactic region. Transporting to Qo'noS completely burned out the device, so no one was able to follow him using it.

    So, if that novelization has merit, it would suggest the engine of an empty ship of unknown size in the 23rd century would have allowed Khan to beam anywhere in 'our galactic region'... meaning that the range could be as large as tens of thousands of ly's... possibly 30 000 - 40 000 LY radius (similar to what the Sikaris spatial trajector technology was capable of - and even if the range was limited to about 10 000 Ly's or less, by the 24th century, it would likely be on par or superior compared to the spatial trajector technology).

    Anyway... its a real shame (and a missed opportunity) that TW beaming has only been mentioned thus far but never actually seen or used in the prime timeline.
    The fact Spock knew about it suggests the technology was beginning to be used in some way before he left the prime timeline.

    Perhaps ST: Prodigy will (finally) touch upon it (and hopefully not just discard it).
     
  16. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I always thought it was similar to the interphase beaming (if I'm recalling the term correctly) that caused some sort of tissue damage. In any case, yes it would be nice to see it in the Prime Universe.
    Again, I hope so, but I won't hold my breath. Tech is usually at the service of the plot, such as how it got Khan to Kronos in a short amount of time. However, it did set up one of my absolutely favorite fight scenes and Klingon designs in all of Trek so there is that.
     
  17. Vger23

    Vger23 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Gary Seven and The Providers may have been examples in TOS of transwarp beaming in the 23rd century.
     
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  18. drt

    drt Commodore Commodore

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    Maybe Scotty studying how that was accomplished is where the idea originally came from in the Prime timeline.
     
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  19. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The real loss is Disco S3 not beaming across the galaxy in the tap of a badge (which is what I initially assumed S3E01 was doing), I was very excited for an utterly chaotic future only for them to... sweep it under the rug. And then find technobabble reasons why badge teleporting doesn't work (like they retconned it that it's the ship's transporter doing the work, no longer the badge itself as prototyped in Nemesis)
     
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  20. Phoenix219

    Phoenix219 Commodore Commodore

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    I just hated that it was Khan, and not either 1) just a disgruntled Star Fleet officer or 2) one of the other augments, accidentally thawed out first, desparately trying to free Khan.