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Why do the writers kill off characters when actors want to leave?

IntrepidMan

Fleet Captain
Fleet Captain
I'm thinking about Dax and Tasha Yar. Why did the writers kill them off? Dax proved she could command the Defiant--why not give her her own ship? It makes sense plot-wise and leaves the door open for returning for an episode or too as a guest star.

And Tasha--couldn't they have transferred her to another command? I'm sure it happens all the time. They did it to Beverly.

Why kill off the characters? Maybe the writers wanted to get back at the actors for quitting the show. :confused:
 
Nah, I doubt it's that personal. People leave jobs all the time in the real world. It's no different in Hollywood.

With Dax, it made perfect sense to kill off Jadzia since, by coincidence, they had already set up the ideal way to recast her, what with the Trill and the symbionts and all. They had been talking about this whole Trill thing for years. How could they resist an opportunity to actually explore the concept on screen? Story-wise, that was pure serendipity. Turning Jadzia into Ezri has a lot more dramatic potential than just sending Jadzia off on a ship somewhere.

And, honestly, there's the whole shock value thing. Killing a character off, especially if you never intend to use him or her again, is just inherently more exciting than explaining that they were transfered to the Intrepid or something.

Nine times out of ten, writers are going to go for the gut. Our job is to put characters through hell.
 
It isn't just Star Trek. After two seasons of NCIS, Sasha Alexander wanted to leave the show and the producers agreed ONLY if she agreed to being killed off in her final episode (she appeared in two more after dying. Her funeral episode and a flashback episode when her characters sister appeared).

In general, producers (not writers as the death of a major character is a producers decision) prefer to kill off departing actors because:

1) More dramatic
2) Gives the show leverage over the other actors when it comes to contract renewals.

3) Producers tend to dislike the possibility of fans clamoring for a particular actor to return and killing them off makes that more difficult.

4) As mentioned above, peeved at actors for leaving. This is especially true of a successful tv series. Producers know that many actors will work for 20 years without an opportunity at being a regular in a successful series so they see it as "ingratitude".
 
Maybe the writers wanted to get back at the actors for quitting the show. :confused:

Or the actors TELL them to kill off their characters so they can't be pestered to play them again.

Good point! I'm sure some actors get sick and tired of being asked when they're going to play So-and-So again . . . .

And what actor wants to turn down a juicy death scene?

Heck, that's how they lured Nimoy back to do Wrath of Khan!
 
Sometimes they don't however kill off characters, i.e. Wesley. Who was put on a bus so to speak.

So a number of factors come into play.

1.>The actor specifcially asked for their character to be killed off. (Though in Sci-Fi there is generally a way to get them back i.e. clone, alternate dimension etc...)

2.>Shock value.

3.>Contracts were up for renewel and the actor made a few too many excessive demands.

Though use of number 2 can back fire if you are killing a character off for the sake of killing off a character i.e. Beckett from SG:A(who was generally considered a fan favourite), killing him only served to alienate a large portion of the fan base, so much so that they had to bring the character back.
 
With Dax, it made perfect sense to kill off Jadzia since, by coincidence, they had already set up the ideal way to recast her, what with the Trill and the symbionts and all. They had been talking about this whole Trill thing for years. How could they resist an opportunity to actually explore the concept on screen? Story-wise, that was pure serendipity. Turning Jadzia into Ezri has a lot more dramatic potential than just sending Jadzia off on a ship somewhere.

Really? I thought bringing Ezri onboard was silly and a little too convenient--the new host just happens to be a dark-haired women like Jadzia, just happens to also wear a blue uniform, and just happens to stay aboard the station as a full-time member of the crew. It's like they replaced Jadzia with Jadzia 2.0--the next best thing (granted their personalities were different). If they wanted to have the new Dax visit the station once or twice to see old friends, fine. But adding her the cast with only a season to go seemed kind of dumb.

Besides, the whole new host/same symbiont story had already been told before both on DS9 and TNG. I didn't see a need to bring it up again.
 
It seems like a no-brainer to me. Yeah, there had been some one-shot episodes dealing with Trill issues, but when your departing actress is playing a character whose whole schtick is that her essence is periodically transfered from one host to another, how do you not take the opportunity to let that play out . . . with all the angst and complications that would inevitably ensue?

Like I said, pure serendipity. It was like they planned it in advance.

And, arguably, more dramatic than just explaining that Dax had taken a position at the Vulcan Science Academy or something like that . . . zzzzz
 
It seems like a no-brainer to me. Yeah, there had been some one-shot episodes dealing with Trill issues, but when your departing actress is playing a character whose whole schtick is that her essence is periodically transfered from one host to another, how do you not take the opportunity to let that play out . . . with all the angst and complications that would inevitably ensue?

Like I said, pure serendipity. It was like they planned it in advance.

And, arguably, more dramatic than just explaining that Dax had taken a position at the Vulcan Science Academy or something like that . . . zzzzz
Especially, when you factor in her romance and marriage to Worf for the Drama, and how do you explain keeping Worf around, but, shipping off his brand new wife (with the Actress unwilling to return or even allow likeness to be used again)
 
Granted, it's always a judgment call when writing off a popular character. You have to weigh the dramatic potential of a big death scene ("Ohmigod, they killed Luigi! I cried my eyes out!") versus the very real danger of pissing off the audience and leaving a bad taste in their mouths ("Those bastards killed Luigi! I'm never watching the show again!")

But, in the case of Dax, it was like saying good-bye to the latest Doctor Who. Of course you're going to go the regeneration route . . . . why waste a departing Trill?

Yar is less clear-cut, but, after less than a season, I can't imagine that the audience was so invested in her character that there would be a big backlash to killing her. And knocking off a regular, that early in the series, had the advantage of making people sit up and take notice. ("Whoa! That never happened on the old show!")

Again, more exciting and interesting than just shipping Yar off to Starbase 17 . . .
 
It seems like a no-brainer to me. Yeah, there had been some one-shot episodes dealing with Trill issues, but when your departing actress is playing a character whose whole schtick is that her essence is periodically transfered from one host to another, how do you not take the opportunity to let that play out . . . with all the angst and complications that would inevitably ensue?

Of course it's a no-brainer--it's the most convenient fix. Jadzia's leaving?--oh, let's bring in someone very similar to replace her. It's the quick and easy solution. God forbid the writers actually challenge themselves and come up with something different.

What are you talking about one-off episodes with Trill issues? Yes, we had one TNG episode that nicely summed up the host/symbiont dilemma. But Jadzia was on DS9 for 6 seasons. We had plenty of episodes dealing with Trill issues.

And, arguably, more dramatic than just explaining that Dax had taken a position at the Vulcan Science Academy or something like that . . . zzzzz
Yes, explaining Jadzia had moved on...and then bringing in some new character to replace her. Maybe the writers could have cooked up something interesting. Instead we get Ezri. How can you say introducing Ezri is more dramatic--who knows what the writers could have thought of if they had put their minds to it?



Especially, when you factor in her romance and marriage to Worf for the Drama, and how do you explain keeping Worf around, but, shipping off his brand new wife (with the Actress unwilling to return or even allow likeness to be used again)

Now this is actually a solid argument about killing off Jadzia. If they had kept her alive and shipped her off, Worf most likely would have tried to follow, and no one on the show would have liked that. (What is the Starfleet policy on couples serving together anyway?) So geting rid of Jadzia allowed Worf to stay. Makes sense. :techman:
 
I think the reason why they chose to kill off Tasha Yar as opposed to have the character get transferred to another ship or whatever was shock value. Prior to Skin of Evil, a main character had never been permanently killed in Trek. The closest we got was Spock, but he was resurrected in the next movie so that doesn't count. This was considered to be less expected.
 
Actually an interesting way would have been to have Jadzia assigned to a ship. Bring in a new science officer, female if they wanted more women sure. Then have Jadzia be killed in action at the start of the final chapter. I think that may have worked better than what we got and be something different.
 
It is a standard practice in Hollywood, although as always there are exceptions. Well observed by the poster above who noted it's intended to keep the other actors in line during contract negotiations. I wouldn't be at all surprised if I learned that during the second season of TNG, the producers used the removal of Denise Crosby as leverage. "Don't kick up a fuss, or you might be next!" Actors generally don't get the opportunity to be series regulars in something very often, so when they get told point-blank that if they leave they'll never get a chance to come back, they'll usually decide not to leave. I certainly suspect that Crosby ended up regretting her decision. She was quite fortunate that she was an actress in a sci-fi show which could contrive explanations for bringing her back! :guffaw:

A little side story I noticed when watching the special features of the NYPD Blue season two DVD was that when David Caruso left that series after only one year, the production team were tempted to brutally murder his character, Detective Kelley. But they ultimately decided that even though they thought the actor was being an asshat, the character deserved more dignity than that, so they simply transfered Kelley away instead.
 
Of course it's a no-brainer--it's the most convenient fix. Jadzia's leaving?--oh, let's bring in someone very similar to replace her. It's the quick and easy solution.

Jadzia and Ezri were not similar. Different confidence levels, different job specialties, different attitudes toward the whole Trill thing, different dynamics with The Sisko.

You may not approve of bringing in another Trill-- fine. I wasn't all that fond of Ezri either. But you're slanting the argument if you claim they're "very similar" due to hair color.
(Of different lengths.)
 
Nah, I doubt it's that personal. People leave jobs all the time in the real world. It's no different in Hollywood.

Absolutely. Sometimes fans are far too quick to impute personal motives to creators' choices. Usually it's about what's best for the story, not about personal whims or dislikes. (Usually when I've killed off characters in my fiction, they've been characters I hated to lose and I've felt terrible about it, but it was what the story needed.)

I have heard that the producers of Sliders were motivated by a certain vindictiveness toward departing cast members and thus gave their characters very ignominious fates. But that's an exception to the rule.


With Dax, it made perfect sense to kill off Jadzia since, by coincidence, they had already set up the ideal way to recast her, what with the Trill and the symbionts and all.

Indeed. I remember when I first learned, some two decades ago, that there would be a Trill regular in DS9, one of the first thoughts I had was, "Well, if the actress ever decides to leave, it'll be easy to recast the role."



Really? I thought bringing Ezri onboard was silly and a little too convenient--the new host just happens to be a dark-haired women like Jadzia, just happens to also wear a blue uniform, and just happens to stay aboard the station as a full-time member of the crew. It's like they replaced Jadzia with Jadzia 2.0--the next best thing (granted their personalities were different).

Well, that's hardly true. First off, I'm sure they looked at actresses with a variety of hair colors, and the one they chose happened to be a brunette. Second, they didn't look that much alike -- Farrell's an Amazon and de Boer's a pixie. And third, Jadzia was a science officer and Ezri was a counselor, so they didn't fill the same role any more than Data and Troi did. And fourth, how could she be a regular and not stay on a a full-time crewmember?


If they wanted to have the new Dax visit the station once or twice to see old friends, fine. But adding her the cast with only a season to go seemed kind of dumb.

Why is it dumb? Terry Farrell decided to leave the show at the end of season 6. The producers had no choice but to deal with that reality. And they couldn't very well leave Nana Visitor as the only female regular in the cast. They had to add a new woman to the cast to replace Farrell, and as Greg said, the very nature of the Dax character provided an obvious route for that. If Dax hadn't been a joined life form, maybe they would've promoted Kasidy or Leeta to regular status or something. But since the idea of taking new hosts was intrinsic to the character, it was only natural to use the opportunity to explore that premise, to show us how a new host adjusted to being joined. There was a lot of untapped story potential there, and that's an irresistible lure for a writer.


Besides, the whole new host/same symbiont story had already been told before both on DS9 and TNG. I didn't see a need to bring it up again.

It was told for one episode in TNG, and with a very different conception of the Trill in which the hosts' personality was totally subsumed, so it doesn't even count as the same kind of story. And with Jadzia we only explored it years after the fact, once she'd already acclimated, or we saw it briefly for a few minutes with Verad. This was an opportunity to explore the ongoing process of adjustment for a host who was still brand new, and moreover who'd been joined reluctantly in an emergency situation and was thus far more unprepared and conflicted than other hosts. It's clearly a very different situation that allowed examining the concept from new angles and in new depth.



Of course it's a no-brainer--it's the most convenient fix. Jadzia's leaving?--oh, let's bring in someone very similar to replace her. It's the quick and easy solution. God forbid the writers actually challenge themselves and come up with something different.

Jadzia was a gifted scientist with the confidence, wisdom, and grace of a 300-year-old elder, with a maternal affection for her crewmates. Ezri was a neurotic kid who was struggling to find her balance and her identity after having eight other personalities dumped into her head with minimal preparation. They were extremely different, indeed diametrically opposite in a lot of ways. Some of the other characters wanted Ezri to be a continuation of Jadzia, but she was very much her own person.


How can you say introducing Ezri is more dramatic

We're not. We're saying that killing off Jadzia was more dramatic than just transferring her away. Introducing a Ninth Dax was just a logical consequence of that decision.


I think the reason why they chose to kill off Tasha Yar as opposed to have the character get transferred to another ship or whatever was shock value. Prior to Skin of Evil, a main character had never been permanently killed in Trek. The closest we got was Spock, but he was resurrected in the next movie so that doesn't count. This was considered to be less expected.

I'm not sure if "shock value" is really the phrase. Or at least that's a simplification. The idea was, to some extent, to do the opposite of a "redshirt" death -- instead of having a random act of lethal violence befall some nameless extra, it would happen to a main character and its emotional impact would really be explored. And it was to make the point that death isn't always some grand meaningful thing, that sometimes it's just random and arbitrary and unfair. It was a very mature and honest treatment of the subject, and then "Yesterday's Enterprise" had to go and ruin it.
 
I'm sure that besides making sure Kira wasn't the only female series regular that the writers didn't want to pass up the opportunity to amp the drama up by replacing Worf's wife and everyone's friend with a brand new character with all the memories of Jadzia.
 
With Dax, it made perfect sense to kill off Jadzia since, by coincidence, they had already set up the ideal way to recast her, what with the Trill and the symbionts and all. They had been talking about this whole Trill thing for years. How could they resist an opportunity to actually explore the concept on screen? Story-wise, that was pure serendipity. Turning Jadzia into Ezri has a lot more dramatic potential than just sending Jadzia off on a ship somewhere.

Really? I thought bringing Ezri onboard was silly and a little too convenient--the new host just happens to be a dark-haired women like Jadzia, just happens to also wear a blue uniform, and just happens to stay aboard the station as a full-time member of the crew. It's like they replaced Jadzia with Jadzia 2.0--the next best thing (granted their personalities were different). If they wanted to have the new Dax visit the station once or twice to see old friends, fine. But adding her the cast with only a season to go seemed kind of dumb.

Yeah, how many dark haired, blue uniformed female officers are there?

Besides, the whole new host/same symbiont story had already been told before both on DS9 and TNG. I didn't see a need to bring it up again.

But we'd never seen it in action like this...
 
Of course it's a no-brainer--it's the most convenient fix. Jadzia's leaving?--oh, let's bring in someone very similar to replace her. It's the quick and easy solution.

Jadzia and Ezri were not similar. Different confidence levels, different job specialties, different attitudes toward the whole Trill thing, different dynamics with The Sisko.

You may not approve of bringing in another Trill-- fine. I wasn't all that fond of Ezri either. But you're slanting the argument if you claim they're "very similar" due to hair color.
(Of different lengths.)

Please do not accuse me "slanting the argument" by claiming that Jadzia and Ezri are similar due just to hair color. They are both Trill, both women, both Dax, both have blue uniforms, and yes, both have dark hair. Are there differences? Of course. But there are also too many similarities, and I think the writers took the easy path by creating a character similar enough to Jadzia that the audience wouldn't really mind her being gone. I think it would have been more interesting to create a much difference character.

Christopher: Perhaps in the future you can make your argument in one place instead of picking apart my post line by line and responding to each part individually. You do not seem to think that Jadzia and Ezri very similar. I do. They are both Dax. They are both Trill, both women--now I'm repeating myself. Please see my comments above.

With Dax, it made perfect sense to kill off Jadzia since, by coincidence, they had already set up the ideal way to recast her, what with the Trill and the symbionts and all. They had been talking about this whole Trill thing for years. How could they resist an opportunity to actually explore the concept on screen? Story-wise, that was pure serendipity. Turning Jadzia into Ezri has a lot more dramatic potential than just sending Jadzia off on a ship somewhere.

Really? I thought bringing Ezri onboard was silly and a little too convenient--the new host just happens to be a dark-haired women like Jadzia, just happens to also wear a blue uniform, and just happens to stay aboard the station as a full-time member of the crew. It's like they replaced Jadzia with Jadzia 2.0--the next best thing (granted their personalities were different). If they wanted to have the new Dax visit the station once or twice to see old friends, fine. But adding her the cast with only a season to go seemed kind of dumb.

Yeah, how many dark haired, blue uniformed female officers are there?
I'm sorry but your counterargument is just sloppy. There are several other differences that I have pointed out.

But we'd never seen it in action like this...
Yes, we have. Trill uncomfortable with and/or exploring past hosts experiences--yep, Jadzia experienced this. Other people uncomfortable with new Trill host who is the same yet difference from previous host--watch the TNG episode. Also see Sisko/Jadzia's encounter in Emissary.
 
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