What was Roddenberry's state of mind in TNG S3?

[ConRefit79]

Watching the writers comments in the extras on season 3's 6th disc make it sound like Rodennberry was getting very perverted. Kind of reminds me of some of the obsurd things Frank Herbert has in Dune Chapterhouse. What was Roddenberry's state of mind then?

 

[Dukhat]

Considering that he died not long after that, I'd guess his state of mind wasn't all that great.

 

[Tenacity]

I think that was after his stroke, but by season three wasn't Roddenberry largely out of the picture when it came to production?

 

[locutus101]

I don't think he was still in the loop.

 

[C.E. Evans]

Does it really matter what state his mind was in? By season 3, Rick Berman was pretty much running the show. He would run things by Roddenberry, but by then Roddenberry really had become more of a paid executive consultant than someone truly calling the shots. He seemed to be more actively involved with the show than he really was because people kept constantly coming to him for interviews.

 

[BillJ]

According to Chaos on the Bridge, Maurice Hurley was running the show for the latter half of season one and all of season two. Roddenberry seemed to bow out of the day-to-day role early on. His last writing credit was on "Datalore".

 

[ConRefit79]

According to Ira Steven Behr's, Roddenberry called him into a meeting about a script the writers submitted and were excited about. It had to do with a Picard on a pleasure planet dealing with some kind of personal anxiety about being promoted and losing the Enterprise. Roddenberry hated that idea but liked the pleasure planet idea. He wanted Picard there and to get laid. And to have all kinds of suggestive debauchery in the background. That script became Captain's Holiday.

That's why I asked the question, cause it sounds like he still had power to sink scripts. And his ideas were off the wall and inappropriate for a family program.

 

[BillJ]

That's why I asked the question, cause it sounds like he still had power to sink scripts. And his ideas were off the wall and inappropriate for a family program.

Sure, he did. But that doesn't translate to the day-to-day running of the show. And Star Trek was never intended to be a "family" program. It was meant for adults. Plus, there's nothing wrong with getting laid.

 

[ConRefit79]

Never said that was wrong. I'm paraphrasing what he told Ira. He felt there needed to be more sex in the episode instead of exploring some personal fears Picard may have had. Much of what Roddenberry told Behr he wanted in the episode never made it. Doubt it would have got past the censors of the time.

 

[BillJ]

Never said that was wrong. I'm telling you what he told Ira. And he felt there needed to be more sex in the episode instead of exploring some personal fears Picard may have had. Much of what Roddenberry told Behr he wanted in the episode never made it. Doubt it would have got past the censors of the time.

You would be surprised. Kirk had an STD. Other shows were doing sexual content. The reason it wouldn't get made is because Paramount never did anything risky with the property. It was a cash cow and they weren't interested in rocking the boat.

The 90's and early-2000's were the era of McTrek. Lets hope Bryan Fuller has a freer hand, or else Discovery will be just as bland and inoffensive. Never pushing the envelope.

 

[Mudd]

Watching the writers comments in the extras on season 3's 6th disc make it sound like Rodennberry was getting very perverted.

Nothing new - you've seen "The Cage," right?

Never said that was wrong. I'm paraphrasing what he told Ira. He felt there needed to be more sex in the episode instead of exploring some personal fears Picard may have had. Much of what Roddenberry told Behr he wanted in the episode never made it. Doubt it would have got past the censors of the time.

There were no censors.

There were, however, Paramount executives who turned thumbs-down on a lot of stuff.

 

[BillJ]

Nothing new - you've seen "The Cage," right?

There were no censors.

There were, however, Paramount executives who turned thumbs-down on a lot of stuff.

I always did wonder how Roddenberry made a show more conservative than TOS, when he was trumpeting the fact he wouldn't have to deal with network censors?

 

[Lance]

According to the Blu Ray special features, he did come up with a few truly weird comments in S3, including that "Worf isn't a main character" (perhaps remembering back to some early point of S1?)

I've seen rumours around that "Menage a Troi", credited onscreen to Gene's long-time personal assistant Susan Sackett, may have been subject to some kind of uncredited writing by Roddenberry himself. Certainly he'd been peddling a script called "Ferengi Gold" in the previous season that never got produced, and "Menage a Troi" certainly feels a lot like it's got Roddenberry's dabs on it in places......

 

[Doug Otte]

Around the time that Who Watches the Watchers first aired, I remember reading a comment from Roddenberry that it was an outstanding episode, and a good example of what he intended the series to be like. I agree with him. It's still my favorite episode. They managed to combine an adventurous story, compelling moral issue about rationality vs. religion, uplifting message for any human but especially women, beautiful location shooting, beautiful set design, beautiful costume design, and made it very emotional as well.

 

[BillJ]

Around the time that Who Watches the Watchers first aired, I remember reading a comment from Roddenberry that it was an outstanding episode, and a good example of what he intended the series to be like. I agree with him. It's still my favorite episode. They managed to combine an adventurous story, compelling moral issue about rationality vs. religion, uplifting message for any human but especially women, beautiful location shooting, beautiful set design, beautiful costume design, and made it very emotional as well.

I used to really like this one, it just hasn't aged well for me.

 

[Kevin Wolff]

I used to really like this one, it just hasn't aged well for me.

The opposite for me. I hated it for years, and now I love it. It's Ray Wise's dopiest performance. He acts like he should be in Bill and Ted's Excellent adventure. But the rest of the performances were solid, and the fact that Picard was never able to get through to her about not being a god was very effective.

 

[Kevin Wolff]

According to the 50-year mission volume 2, Gene was still very much involved in season 3 and still gave some notes in season 4 but came in less. By comparison, he was arguably about as involved with S4 TNG than he was with S3 TOS. However, Berman and Piller were able to handle him more, and when he said no to a story, they could often change his mind. Examples are developing Worf and the Klingons in general, any time travel, and any serialization. Leaving Worf disgraced after Sins of the Father was a turning point. A door was left open almost by mistake. By the end of season 4 he was about gone. He died soon after a personal screening of ST6. Apparently he was not coherent enough to really watch it.
By now, the torch was passed to Berman, or as Marina Sirtis was quoted, Berman didn't so much have the torch passed to him as he pried it from Gene's still warm hand. Harsh.

 

[Lance]

According to the 50-year mission volume 2, Gene was still very much involved in season 3 and still gave some notes in season 4 but came in less. By comparison, he was arguably about as involved with S4 TNG than he was with S3 TOS. However, Berman and Piller were able to handle him more, and when he said no to a story, they could often change his mind. Examples are developing Worf and the Klingons in general, any time travel, and any serialization. Leaving Worf disgraced after Sins of the Father was a turning point. A door was left open almost by mistake. By the end of season 4 he was about gone. He died soon after a personal screening of ST6. Apparently he was not coherent enough to really watch it.
By now, the torch was passed to Berman, or as Marina Sirtis was quoted, Berman didn't so much have to torch passed to him as he pried it from Gene's still warm hand. Harsh.

She has got a way with words, does Marina.

 

[JesterFace]

I wonder, what was the last episode of TNG that Gene saw before his passing.

 

[RAMA]

Watching the writers comments in the extras on season 3's 6th disc make it sound like Rodennberry was getting very perverted. Kind of reminds me of some of the obsurd things Frank Herbert has in Dune Chapterhouse. What was Roddenberry's state of mind then?

I think Roddenberry genuinely believed in "free love": an old concept. One that was gaining some ground in that era that Trek was produced and into the 70s, before AIDs kind of brought it to a halt. Unfortunately a lot of his ideas met up with reality and there was also a lot of ugliness involved with some of his "habits".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_love

I do tend to think a lot of Americans seem to be prudish, and I agree with some of Roddeberry's ideas but not a lot of people were ready for those ideas in Trek.