Spoilers What if Picard is totally wrong about all of it?

[Alexander Corrino]

Really? That's interesting. So Maurice was not in fact an abusive father or husband, as was the scuttlebutt early in the season? There were those bits in the Picard family home which definitely implied that there was violence going on but you couldn't really tell who was doing what, or to whom.

If things really are going down this way I assume we will see the Picards again before the end of the season, amirite?

We will, I think that guess is pretty much a fact - Jean-Luc has to resolve his issues for the plot to progress (although I will VERY much question the wisdom here if they turn this into a “he faced his past and now everything is peachy and he can live happily ever after” thing, that’s NOT how childhood trauma - or any trauma - works, as I very well know from my own personal experiences, I can only hope that Sir Patrick remembers this as well - he should, given his own past - and made sure things won’t be portrayed like this).

Here is the excerpt from the interview where Sir Patrick said this (reading pre-season interviews reveals a LOT if you read them all, especially Sir Patrick’s because once he gets talking he talks, and quite extensively - lol - I can only highly recommend doing so, with Sir Patrick a lot of interviews do more than just promote the new season, you get real plot points from him):



Here’s the whole interview: https://decider.com/2022/03/03/star-trek-picard-season-2-partick-stewart-interview/amp/

 

[ThreeEdgedSword]

1. HA, I suggested something like that way back. Didn't know this interview, but he made another remark that things were not as they seemed. Everyone said no, because SPS has experienced domestic violence himself.
2. So really the big thing Picard has to learn is to commit to a woman, I suppose. Well, the Beverly/ Picard might get very happy.
(For some reason, I'm hearing the Love and Marriage song in my head now...)

ETA: I keep coming back to hat line about Picard being the last of his name... I can see a retconned son or three (that he's never known of) in his future...

 

[Timofnine]

1. HA, I suggested something like that way back. Didn't know this interview, but he made another remark that things were not as they seemed. Everyone said no, because SPS has experienced domestic violence himself.
2. So really the big thing Picard has to learn is to commit to a woman, I suppose. Well, the Beverly/ Picard might get very happy.
(For some reason, I'm hearing the Love and Marriage song in my head now...)

ETA: I keep coming back to hat line about Picard being the last of his name... I can see a retconned son or three (that he's never known of) in his future...

Maybe Picard can’t commit to a women because he is secretly gay, having casual off screen flings with men, and deep down inside he knows that he would only be using a lady for the sole purpose of having a baby and continuing the family line. He’s been tempted throughout the series but deep down maybe this is the reason that he has never settled with a lady? So instead he had a relationship with his career and duty which was his true devotion and love?don’t get me wrong, women have loved him and he has cared for them deeply back… but it may have been just not right for him and all a bit of a nexus illusion? When I say secretly gay btw, I don’t mean because he is scared of coming out or talking about it, as sexual orientation is surely not a problem in the 24th century, but because as we know he is a very private man and keeps his cards close to his chest and probably didn’t want to make a big issue out of it?

 

[Alexander Corrino]

Maybe Picard can’t commit to a women because he is secretly gay, having casual off screen flings with men, and deep down inside he knows that he would only be using a lady for the sole purpose of having a baby and continuing the family line. He’s been tempted throughout the series but deep down maybe this is the reason that he has never settled with a lady? So instead he had a relationship with his career and duty which was his true devotion and love?don’t get me wrong, women have loved him and he has cared for them deeply back… but it may have been just not right for him and all a bit of a nexus illusion? When I say secretly gay btw, I don’t mean because he is scared of coming out or talking about it, as sexual orientation is surely not a problem in the 24th century, but because as we know he is a very private man and keeps his cards close to his chest and probably didn’t want to make a big issue out of it?

I’ve thought of this as well (of course I have) and it would make sense if they had Q as the dude he really wants (I mean Q is RIGHT THERE, it’s so FRUSTRATING that they’re clearly not really doing anything in the P/Q department for now), but I doubt they’ll be going there.

Partly because I don’t think the writers would have the guts for a storyline like this. Imagine the Trekbro outcry at this. It’s one thing to introduce Seven as bi (two women are always seen as more “palatable” to an audience than two men) but to make Jean-Luc Picard, Trekbro hero, canonically gay? Oh God. I mean I get “but Picard is not gay stop being into him” comments from said Trekbros all the time - I can only IMAGINE how amplified their homophobia would become if Trek made him canonically gay. (Not that I wouldn’t be intrigued by such a step of course tho.)

The other reason why I doubt this will be done is because I simply don’t think a storyline like this works in the 24th/25th century. Jean-Luc would have loved men as well. There aren’t any stigma towards this anymore, and as for having kids being what prevented it all - he and a potential husband or boyfriend could always have adopted a child. I can’t see this as the reason for him focusing on women but also not doing so in the end for fear of using them. And if you take that reason away there’s no reason left because homophobia is not a thing in the future. If anything, I’d like to think his relationships with guys failed just as much as those with women did.

I do have to point out ONE little interesting thing tho - in all the interviews pre season 2, Sir Patrick never even ONCE said anything like “Picard just couldn’t make it work with women”. He always carefully used a gender-neutral way expressing it. I’ve also gone through the script of the first episode and there is also no mention of Jean-Luc loving only women in the past. It is only referred to as him “loving someone” or “choosing to be alone” etc. Women are never specified. Just an interesting detail. But it likely means nothing since people are conditioned to see him as heterosexual and heteronormativity is so extreme that people will perceive any mention of romance as hetero romance by default unless it is explicitly specified that it’s not. But still. An interesting detail nonetheless.

Sir Patrick said once, in an interview long ago in the 90s, that Jean-Luc might have “suppressed homosexual tendencies” and that he “has had plenty of relationships”. Maybe he remembered that interview and that’s where the gender neutral way of expressing things comes from. Who knows.

 

[ThreeEdgedSword]

We've come a long way since the glbqt+ ignoring Nineties. But's going to be a very, very, very long time until Trek make any of their protagonist captains queer (male or female). If ever.

That aside, I would hope that the message for Jean-Luke is a bit more universal than just "commit to a romantic relationship," maybe something more general, like letting go of his fear (tieing in with not trusting the masked BQ), letting people in etc. (which, judging from the slightly clumsy setup with Laris, may include a romantic relationship).

 

[Alexander Corrino]

It hasn’t escaped me indeed that none of Trek’s queer characters is a series lead character. It IS time for a queer series lead, in fact it’s LONG overdue. I would be the first to cheer if they chose to reveal that Jean-Luc is queer - they don’t have to “make him gay” for that, a mention of him having been in love with men and women would be enough, I’ve always viewed him as bi anyway, no surprise there for me personally but that’s just me - but yeah I doubt it’s going to happen. The storm this would create would take attention away from the story they’re trying to tell. (Would be very happy to eat these words of mine tho - with ketchup, please.)

And I agree that there has to be more than just “okay I’m now madly in love with Laris she’ll fall into my arms and yay happily ever after”. This wouldn’t be realistic at all AND it would do Laris a disservice. It’s bad enough already that they’ve turned her into nothing more than a plot device that eventually helps Jean-Luc to face his feelings instead of letting her be her own character. I mean if I were Laris I’d be like “yo bro, slow down. first you reject me and tell me nothing’s gonna change when you know damn well that’s not how it works and now you show up again and tell me you’re ready to commit? So, what’s it gonna be tomorrow? Dude, I ain’t here for this kind of ping pong game, bye”.

 

[ThreeEdgedSword]

Just to be clear, I'm sorry to be a downer on this issue and I admire yor optimism! I don't disagree with your general points.

 

[Timofnine]

Also, in Generations when Picard is in the Nexus he imagines having a traditional family - a wife and children. He admits that as much as he wants it “none of this is real”, though Guinan replies “It can be if you want it to be”. Almost like showing Picard what he truly wanted in life but knowing that it would be an illusion to his heart?

Being tempted by Laris might have been Picard realising that she could very well be the last chance he has of having a family in his old age… but then he leaves the nexus of his mind one more time and comes back to the reality of who he is?

Besides, maybe Laris only wanted to inherit his vineyard and family business anyway?

 

[Alexander Corrino]

Let’s not forget that Jean-Luc is no longer human tho. I don’t think a golem can… umm… make children? I mean I’m sure he’s fully equipped and functional, he IS a Soong type golem, but I doubt kids are part of the equation anymore.

But the kid angle will play a role in the future of the show, I’m fairly certain of that. They wouldn’t be hinting at him being the last Picard if it wasn’t. There was this leaked s3 character description that mentioned a son he never knew he had showing up in s3. It wouldn’t surprise me. Season one dealt with him being able to make new friends, season 2 deals with his love life and season 3 deals with the family aspect.

Also I love the idea of Laris being actually the villain… maybe she hired the watcher to get rid of anything Picard once and for all and this is what Q is trying to prevent. Plot twist!

 

[Unicron]

The masked Borg Queen from the Stargazer is a resurrected Elnor with a voice modulator.

You can all thank me later when I'm proven right on episode ten.

Anything else you need solved?

She'll probably turn out to be a future Spot who got turned into a humanoid via the transporter, and then later assimilated by the Borg.

 

[Timofnine]

She'll probably turn out to be a future Spot who got turned into a humanoid via the transporter, and then later assimilated by the Borg.

Well this could actually be partly correct? If Jurati is indeed going to be the Borg Queen, maybe she quickly uploaded the animated AI Spot that she coded in the Confederation universe in to her brain to keep her company on this mission to save history? If this was to be the case though, next weeks episode would be called 3 of 1 not 2 of 1? Unless they don’t count the AI Spot consciousness as technically it would still be a ‘pet’ and just be there to give both characters an imaginary cat to stroke as they bicker and b*tch at each other, like that evil James Bond villain Blofeld, or the villain off Inspector Gadget who always stroked a cat too? All evil geniuses need a cat to stroke….

 

[Yistaan]

I'm honestly wondering if Picard forcing Renee to go through with a mission she just honestly doesn't feel ready for is in fact what causes the evil timeline. Q's played this gimmick before in AGT.

 

[Crusher Disciple]

Okay, my second guess is that the Borg Queen is a direct ancestor of Grudge.