What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by Amasov, Jun 20, 2020.

  1. Paul755

    Paul755 Commodore Commodore

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    They should have replaced Troi with Guinan in S2. Dont have her be a full time character but give her more appearances.
     
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  2. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Admiral Admiral

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    The most controversial opinion of them all: It's just a TV show. ;)
     
  3. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Next you'll tell me to relax!
     
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  4. Nyotarules

    Nyotarules Vice Admiral Moderator

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    Say it ain't so!
     
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  5. Kerock

    Kerock Commander Red Shirt

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    Discovery is "The Days of our Lives" of Star Trek or maybe "As the World Turns" or even "The Young and the Restless"
     
  6. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Gene Roddenberry was brighter and more creative than Rick Berman or Brannon Braga but a far worse steward of the franchise.
     
  7. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It's ok to not agree with some of the principles of Star Trek (Socialism and no money in the federation) but still enjoy the franchise. It's not an all or nothing thing, and that's the problem with our tendency to label things and people these days.
     
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  8. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Admiral Admiral

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    I can't argue with this.

    Gene Roddenberry threw in the towel after just two seasons of TOS. The grind was getting to him and NBC moving Star Trek to Friday Nights at 10:00 was the perfect excuse for him to get out because he could hide behind saying he saw the writing on the wall. The drama behind-the-scenes with TMP is well-known. And even if Gene Roddenberry's health declined in the late-'80s, Maurice Hurley only became showrunner toward the end of TNG S1 because the situation behind-the-scenes was spiraling out of control under Gene Roddenberry and his lawyer.

    Rick Berman, OTOH, just made creative choices that not everyone agrees with (including me) and stuck around too long. But he was able to keep Star Trek going.

    They both had what the other was missing.
     
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  9. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Roddenberry was a great ideas man. Berman a great office guy who kept the engines running.
     
  10. Oddish

    Oddish Admiral Admiral

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    Considering that he wasn't even knowledgeable enough to realize that you're supposed to promote an ensign, it's amazing that Trek was as good as it was.
     
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  11. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Admiral Admiral

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    Rick Berman had showrunners underneath him who could do great work. Michael Piller for one, Ira Steven Behr for another. Similar to how Alex Kurtzman had Michael Chabon for PIC S1 and has Michelle Paradise for DSC S3 (not going to go into DSC S3 spoilers, but I will say I think Michelle Paradise is the best showrunner for DSC yet).

    When it comes to Harry Kim... I'm now convinced they were just being an asshole to Garrett Wang. There's a story there we're not being told about.
     
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  12. AresB

    AresB Commander Red Shirt

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    That's how he felt in a 2011 interview.

    Another odd turn, in my opinion, was the non-promotion of Ensign Kim. I mean, come on people! Kim was probed, beaten, tortured and held the distinction of being the first Voyager crew member to die and come back to life. What more does a guy have to do to get promoted to Lieutenant for frak’s sake? To add further insult to injury, other crew members such as Tuvok (Russ) and Paris were being promoted, demoted and then re-promoted throughout the seven-year run of Voyager.

    I'm not trying to be negative here; just saying it like it is. During the fourth season, I called writer/producer Brannon Braga and asked him why my character hadn't received a promotion yet. His response? “Well, somebody's gotta be the ensign.” Geez, thanks. Thanks for nothing. At some point, I even approached Kate Mulgrew and frustratedly asked her why I wasn't promoted yet. In hindsight, this action on my part was hilarious because Kate Mulgrew had no more influence in promoting my character than a random person on the street. I would like to take the time to say that I had no influence on these Kim developments.
     
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  13. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I had another opinion that is very controversial I would think. My opinion on Doctor McCoy has diminished over the years, mainly because I find his racism towards Spock cringeworthy. People seem to love it in a joking matter, but McCoy was a bit of a racist and it hasn’t aged well. He was still a decent character but Phlox and Bashir are my two favorite Doctors in Star Trek and Culber is quickly gaining on them.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2020
  14. FormerLurker

    FormerLurker Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    McCoy was both a product of his time, and a product of his upbringing. I think it's fair to say that McCoy being raised in Georgia accounts for a lot of his overt racist behavior, especially toward Spock. Couple this with the fact that the show aired in the 1960's, and there is an argument that McCoy was shortchanged as a character following the run of the Original Series. Imagine a character arc for McCoy in one of the films, showing him obviously calling himself up short in an exchange with Spock, and when asked, he admits he's realized that what he had viewed as jokes at the time were closer to the racism of his ancestors from the 20th century, and offering an apology to Spock for them. That would have been profound.
     
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  15. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think that would have saved his character for me. I can rewatch the series knowing that yes McCoy was racist towards Spock, but in the end he realized the errors of his ways, apologized and both grew closer together because of it. It would have been a very Star Trek thing to end his character arc with.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2020
  16. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Admiral Admiral

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    It's one of those things where if Kirk said something sexist or McCoy said something racist, to quote T'Bonz, you have to pretend they didn't say that. I have a different standard in general for shows and films made before the '90s, or it would be impossible (or at least a lot harder) to enjoy them.

    Those types of attitudes in "The Cage" are something I didn't mind seeing retconned out of Discovery and I hope they stay retconned out in Strange New Worlds.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2020
  17. Farscape One

    Farscape One Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Thank you, Lord Garth.

    I do the same thing. I keep in mind the era something is produced, and base my enjoyment on those standards. I can easily separate a 60s show from 21st century mindsets. This is why I can enjoy stuff from virtually any era.
     
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  18. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I do that for all shows, it makes no sense to judge old media by contemporary standards, especially standards that are constantly changing.
     
  19. scotpens

    scotpens Professional Geek Premium Member

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    I never thought of McCoy's occasional gibes about Spock's pointed ears or his Vulcan physiology as "racist." In return, Spock would taunt McCoy about his emotionalism and his supposedly primitive medical skills. They could both get away with the superficial feuding because at heart they were good friends who respected one another.

    Maybe I just don't buy into the 21st-century mindset that wants to see racism even where it doesn't exist.
     
  20. Farscape One

    Farscape One Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Exactly how I feel, from start to finish on this post.
     
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