Okay, not sure if this belongs in GTD or Trektech, but I'm posting it in GTD because it impacts far more than technology.
Anyhow, over in this thread, me and Sci (and others) began by discussing a possible Federation Governmental structure.
The Star Trek Encyclopedia puts the UFP as being 10,000 LY in diameter. Star Trek First Contact (FC) puts it more specifically at 8,000 LY.
Now, I quoted a chart there, said to be from the ST Encyclopedia, that, using the 10k LY figure, put the speed of subspace comms transmissions at Warp 9.999996 or so (I could be adding or forgetting a 9 by mistake) in the TNG warp scale.
According to said chart, for a message to get across the UFP takes 6 months.
In DS9 and other series, we've seen ships like the Defiant race from Bajor to Earth in 4 days. Presuming optimistically that we are dealing with a case of radius and not diameter, we're still talking 4,000 LY. By the chart I referenced re Warp velocities, it should take roughly 1400 days at Warp 8 - 3.8 years or so by my back of the envelope math.
Now, ST:FC could simply be wrong wrong wrong, and DS9's working presumption of a Federation that works out to less than a few hundred LY diameter (and indeed, a pretty small circumference) could still work - but the 8-10,000 LY range has been used so often that I hesitate to throw it out.
Which leads me to two linked questions: How the hell do messages get across the UFP in that timeframe in less than months (as they must even at the stated ST Enc speed for subspace messages, in order for real-time comms to and from Starfleet Command (presumably on Earth) to work as seen in so much Trek), and how the hell do people (Our Heroes) move about the UFP so fast?
Now, before I begin. I know that "speed of plot" determines a lot of that, realistically. Yet I cannot be the only Trek fan that wants to try and see if what we have posited before us meets the acid test of reality. In short, I want to explain speed of plot through some way other than handwavium, and then look at the impact these explanations would have.
---
First off:
The size of the Federation. It's probably been argued for years. Certainly the speed and travel times suggested by later series (from TNG through to VOY) suggest a deep problem with the 8k LY spoken of by Picard in First Contact. (A perfect case of Sci-fi Writers Having No Sense of Scale, mind you)
But let's go with the ST Enc numbers...Heck, even Picard's 8000 LY from FC. The Enc numbers seem to have been used (and abused) in VOY's initial stuff, after all.
How do you move from Bajor (the outer frontier) to Earth in 4 days, then? How do you manage a functional state across those distances, when it'd take weeks for a message to get from Earth to the frontier?
Warp Highways. As postulated in the rec.arts.startrek.tech FAQ on Warp Velocities, there are corridors of space where warp velocities are higher than in the rest of space.
Possibly much higher. Works for ships and subspace messages.
Here's the problem, though - not all planets likely lay along said "highways". Most probably don't. Earth may well sit at the nexus of multiple such "highways".
To wit:
Any "modern" (TNG/DS9/VOY) exploration mission probably begins with scout ships - small crews, HORDES of supplies - heading out to find the warp highways in the region of space to be explored. This is long, boring, tedious work, probably aided and abetted by a lot of unmanned probes. (The whole thing could in fact possibly be done with unmanned probes, but those have limited range.)
As the ships find highways, they ride them out until the things come to an end, planting subspace relays along the way to "mark the trail", claim the region of space, and facilitate comms with their home base. They're equipped to do science and make first contacts and stuff, but their main mission is to do the slog that is getting the first maps of the local subspace created.
Later ships then follow up over time to do more than sketch the paths of movement. They intend to do close-in scans of planets, astronomical phenomena, etc.
What this means for society:
1. If your planet is along the path of one of these warp highways, you can actually get from point A to point B much faster than the warp speed charts indicate. Starfleet ships, when they can, try whenever possible to use these pre-charted highways. If you aren't along the highways, though, you're isolated. It might be a long, long time until you get messages from far away, to say nothing of travel of cargo or people.
2. In order to make most planets not-so-isolated, planets along the highways act as "Trunk points" for communications, travel, etc. to nearby planets not on the highway. In communications terms, I dub these "Class A stations". Communication other points along a highway in the relay network is a lot faster, possibly near-real-time.
3. Outlying planets are "Class B stations". Messages may take hours to reach the nearest Class A station, and from there may take longer to reach their destination. These are, for emphasis, stations within a certain range of Class A stations (one range for travel networks, one range for communications networks - you can expand the comms networks a bit more through automated relays).
4. Truly isolated planets are often not settled by anybody. They could be perfect for colonization, but they're too out of the way. These are Class C stations - messages may well take days or weeks to reach the nearest Class B station, after hopping through a horde of automated relays...And don't even think about real-time or near-real-time communications. Ships take even longer - travel times are measured in weeks or months.
What this means for trade:
1. If you're along a warp highway, you're a full participant in galactic commerce, trade, etc, etc. Life can easily be a paradise like on Earth.
2. The farther out you are, the less this is true. The way poverty can still exist in the UFP is that places can simply be so isolated that nobody goes by them much.
For warfare:
1. This actually gives space a sort of "terrain" on a strategic level. You want to capture everything, of course, but the planets along the warp highways are a lot more valuable. You then move out from those planets to capture more outlying places - and you ignore and let starve your enemy's truly isolated places.
2. It defines borders and creates chokepoints. Ships will, of necessity, mass at points along warp highways. Logistics will be planned with the use of the warp highways in mind. You can practice area-denial tactics at these chokepoints - either fortifications (see the defenses at Chin'Toka) or minefields. It's possible to avoid the chokepoints, but it takes a great deal longer. You give your enemy more time to detect your force, and hence more time to mobilize defenses.
3. Space is 3D, I can hear you say! My frequent objection too! But while that still applies tactically, strategically space in Trek is still very much 2D. Particularly if warp highways connect stars. then it gets difficult to approach a star "off-angle". You abandon the warp highway, and you're going a lot slower.
Anyhow, over in this thread, me and Sci (and others) began by discussing a possible Federation Governmental structure.
The Star Trek Encyclopedia puts the UFP as being 10,000 LY in diameter. Star Trek First Contact (FC) puts it more specifically at 8,000 LY.
Now, I quoted a chart there, said to be from the ST Encyclopedia, that, using the 10k LY figure, put the speed of subspace comms transmissions at Warp 9.999996 or so (I could be adding or forgetting a 9 by mistake) in the TNG warp scale.
According to said chart, for a message to get across the UFP takes 6 months.
In DS9 and other series, we've seen ships like the Defiant race from Bajor to Earth in 4 days. Presuming optimistically that we are dealing with a case of radius and not diameter, we're still talking 4,000 LY. By the chart I referenced re Warp velocities, it should take roughly 1400 days at Warp 8 - 3.8 years or so by my back of the envelope math.
Now, ST:FC could simply be wrong wrong wrong, and DS9's working presumption of a Federation that works out to less than a few hundred LY diameter (and indeed, a pretty small circumference) could still work - but the 8-10,000 LY range has been used so often that I hesitate to throw it out.
Which leads me to two linked questions: How the hell do messages get across the UFP in that timeframe in less than months (as they must even at the stated ST Enc speed for subspace messages, in order for real-time comms to and from Starfleet Command (presumably on Earth) to work as seen in so much Trek), and how the hell do people (Our Heroes) move about the UFP so fast?
Now, before I begin. I know that "speed of plot" determines a lot of that, realistically. Yet I cannot be the only Trek fan that wants to try and see if what we have posited before us meets the acid test of reality. In short, I want to explain speed of plot through some way other than handwavium, and then look at the impact these explanations would have.
---
First off:
The size of the Federation. It's probably been argued for years. Certainly the speed and travel times suggested by later series (from TNG through to VOY) suggest a deep problem with the 8k LY spoken of by Picard in First Contact. (A perfect case of Sci-fi Writers Having No Sense of Scale, mind you)
But let's go with the ST Enc numbers...Heck, even Picard's 8000 LY from FC. The Enc numbers seem to have been used (and abused) in VOY's initial stuff, after all.
How do you move from Bajor (the outer frontier) to Earth in 4 days, then? How do you manage a functional state across those distances, when it'd take weeks for a message to get from Earth to the frontier?
Warp Highways. As postulated in the rec.arts.startrek.tech FAQ on Warp Velocities, there are corridors of space where warp velocities are higher than in the rest of space.
Possibly much higher. Works for ships and subspace messages.
Here's the problem, though - not all planets likely lay along said "highways". Most probably don't. Earth may well sit at the nexus of multiple such "highways".
To wit:
Any "modern" (TNG/DS9/VOY) exploration mission probably begins with scout ships - small crews, HORDES of supplies - heading out to find the warp highways in the region of space to be explored. This is long, boring, tedious work, probably aided and abetted by a lot of unmanned probes. (The whole thing could in fact possibly be done with unmanned probes, but those have limited range.)
As the ships find highways, they ride them out until the things come to an end, planting subspace relays along the way to "mark the trail", claim the region of space, and facilitate comms with their home base. They're equipped to do science and make first contacts and stuff, but their main mission is to do the slog that is getting the first maps of the local subspace created.
Later ships then follow up over time to do more than sketch the paths of movement. They intend to do close-in scans of planets, astronomical phenomena, etc.
What this means for society:
1. If your planet is along the path of one of these warp highways, you can actually get from point A to point B much faster than the warp speed charts indicate. Starfleet ships, when they can, try whenever possible to use these pre-charted highways. If you aren't along the highways, though, you're isolated. It might be a long, long time until you get messages from far away, to say nothing of travel of cargo or people.
2. In order to make most planets not-so-isolated, planets along the highways act as "Trunk points" for communications, travel, etc. to nearby planets not on the highway. In communications terms, I dub these "Class A stations". Communication other points along a highway in the relay network is a lot faster, possibly near-real-time.
3. Outlying planets are "Class B stations". Messages may take hours to reach the nearest Class A station, and from there may take longer to reach their destination. These are, for emphasis, stations within a certain range of Class A stations (one range for travel networks, one range for communications networks - you can expand the comms networks a bit more through automated relays).
4. Truly isolated planets are often not settled by anybody. They could be perfect for colonization, but they're too out of the way. These are Class C stations - messages may well take days or weeks to reach the nearest Class B station, after hopping through a horde of automated relays...And don't even think about real-time or near-real-time communications. Ships take even longer - travel times are measured in weeks or months.
What this means for trade:
1. If you're along a warp highway, you're a full participant in galactic commerce, trade, etc, etc. Life can easily be a paradise like on Earth.
2. The farther out you are, the less this is true. The way poverty can still exist in the UFP is that places can simply be so isolated that nobody goes by them much.
For warfare:
1. This actually gives space a sort of "terrain" on a strategic level. You want to capture everything, of course, but the planets along the warp highways are a lot more valuable. You then move out from those planets to capture more outlying places - and you ignore and let starve your enemy's truly isolated places.
2. It defines borders and creates chokepoints. Ships will, of necessity, mass at points along warp highways. Logistics will be planned with the use of the warp highways in mind. You can practice area-denial tactics at these chokepoints - either fortifications (see the defenses at Chin'Toka) or minefields. It's possible to avoid the chokepoints, but it takes a great deal longer. You give your enemy more time to detect your force, and hence more time to mobilize defenses.
3. Space is 3D, I can hear you say! My frequent objection too! But while that still applies tactically, strategically space in Trek is still very much 2D. Particularly if warp highways connect stars. then it gets difficult to approach a star "off-angle". You abandon the warp highway, and you're going a lot slower.
<-Imagine him laughing madly
