The Violence of 1x25 "Conspiracy"

Discussion in 'Star Trek: The Next Generation' started by JTShanks, Mar 28, 2015.

  1. JTShanks

    JTShanks Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I'm guessing we all know of how violent this episode gets, in fact it get's extremely aggressively violent and gruesome to the point of not only being disturbing but also out of place for Star Trek.

    But let's discuss it and maybe try to understand why it became so violent or if the violent ending was even intentional.

    What are your thoughts on the gruesome scene in this somewhat famous episode of TNG?
     
  2. Kor

    Kor Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Yes, I also thought it was out of place. Nothing like that was ever shown before or after that on TNG.

    Kor
     
  3. Makarov

    Makarov Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    While I think the story was good, the violence part felt completely out of place and strange. It's definitely a funny moment... "yeah that happened." I'm glad this wasn't standard for TNG, but it makes for a funny easter egg.

    I felt the character who's head exploded was actually a sympathetic character in his prevous appearance.

    The question of intentionally disturbing or not? I'm guessing the special effects people just went wild with it. They probably didn't have time to adjust it to the right level of disturbing.

    I find instant phaser deaths pretty disturbing whenever they happen on the show... the most toys, the deaf diplomat episode, etc... maybe that's a good though to show that violence is an ugly thing.
     
  4. Orphalesion

    Orphalesion Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Phaser deaths are pretty disturbing, though I actually find them even more disturbing in many episodes of TOS where they are so...quick and clean....the person just causally "fading" out of existence *shudders*.
    I do wonder what the motivation behind a lot of Conspiracy was. Did they experiment with giving the shore more action and "excitement"? The parasites were supposed to lead up to the Borg being introduced both the writer's strike and budget problems nixed that. If the plans had worked, would this kind of violence be more prevalent on TNG?
     
  5. Kor

    Kor Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I wonder what age rating this episode receives when it's shown on TV these days. That was the time before the whole system of TV-Y, TV-Y7, TV-PG, TV-14 and TV-MA.

    Though I would assume that with an older show like this, they just give the whole series a TV-PG without having reviewed each episode. :vulcan:

    Kor
     
  6. -Brett-

    -Brett- Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That's overstating it just a bit. It's only violent by the standards of a show where a heated argument was the most violent the average episode got.

    The effects looked too cheesy to be actually disturbing.
     
  7. Silvercrest

    Silvercrest Vice Admiral Admiral

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    He was?
     
  8. Mr. Laser Beam

    Mr. Laser Beam Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    ^ Kind of, yeah.

    Remmick was a pain at times, but at the end he seemed to be just a professional who was doing his job. He wasn't being irritating on purpose.
     
  9. Unicron

    Unicron Boss Monster Mod Moderator

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    The earliest drafts that became "Conspiracy" would have had no alien influence at all, but a group of corrupt admirals who were acting for personal gain. Gene Roddenberry wanted it changed because it didn't fit with his more utopian vision for TNG humans, so that's why an outside controlling influence was introduced.
     
  10. Mojochi

    Mojochi Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Frankly, I found the Varon T Disruptor death to be more violent, despite being less graphic. Plus, the graphic nature of Remmick's death is debatable given the quality of FX. I'd agree to it being a somewhat misplaced notion for what they'd been doing

    Disturbing is perceptual. Duras is shown impaled. Gowron shivs a guy too. Daniel Kwan leaps into a plasma stream. I imagine some might find those disturbing. Personally, I was a little creeped out by Lt. Hagler's blood polymerizing scene in Schisms, and that wasn't graphic at all. Just the mention of blood, him being bluish, and the actor sold it
     
  11. Dexter Remmick

    Dexter Remmick Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    It was out of place from what we had been acclimated to thus far in the series.
    I thought the violence was just in the direction I felt the writers were going
    at the time. I always wished they had bigger plans for the parasites, and needed to
    show them as one of the most dangerous threats SF had ever encountered.

    Part of me still wants the storyline to pop up in a new series. In the end, we are lead
    to believe a signal was broadcast to their homeworld.
     
  12. Kilana2

    Kilana2 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    They removed this famous scene from the German episode. But you can watch it on Youtube or as screenshots. It´s disgusting, but on the other hand Mars Attacks like. :barf:
     
  13. Kilana2

    Kilana2 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The parasites appear in the Litverse.....:lol:
     
  14. Dexter Remmick

    Dexter Remmick Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Haven't delved into much of the lit. Just a smattering of Voyager stuff. Is it any good? The parasite plot to be more specific.
     
  15. Kilana2

    Kilana2 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The parasites appear in the DS9 novels. It is revealed that

    they are related to the Trill symbionts and the result of genetical manipulation/experiments on a planet named Kurl conducted on Trill symbionts. The parasites appear on DS9 and Bajor and possess a familiar Bajoran.

    The DS9 relaunch is great. And the parasites are still frightening. Nonetheless the scenes with them are less violent than the TNG episode.
     
  16. CorporalCaptain

    CorporalCaptain Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    To me, it played like TNG was just trying to keep up with the times. This was, after all, in the first season of any Star Trek show that was produced post-Alien chest-burster. It seemed completely understandable, in that light; the queen critter even comes out of Remmick's chest, so there you go, they were doing an Alien riff. But at the same time, it also played like a bad idea.

    I agree with this completely. For some reason, in TWOK, TPTB felt the need to change the TOS dematerialization effect into something during which someone could scream in agony while getting burned out of existence. This change might also have a bearing on why they chose to go with the exploding head idea in "Conspiracy": somehow, the "fading" out of existence effect was no longer in vogue.

    It's also worth fast-forwarding in TNG a couple of seasons to "The Vengeance Factor." Whats-her-name (Yuta) gets dramatically burned up by a phaser on maximum, as she is lunging at the Biker Alien (Chorgan). You can see the TWOK influence in the vaporization effect, and while they kept the sci-fi violence angle tilted more towards violence than it was in the TOS "fading out" effect, it's tamer than both TWOK and "Conspiracy." This tells me that TPTB didn't want to revisit exploding heads and chest-bursters anymore.
     
  17. Dexter Remmick

    Dexter Remmick Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Thanks for the info. I'll look into them. This plotline is the motivation for my name/avatar.
     
  18. Kilana2

    Kilana2 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Take a look into the Literature Forum. There are a lot of advises regarding the novels. The parasites appear also in “The lives of Dax” (short stories about all the Dax hosts, one of them dealt with the parasites).
    Unity and Worlds of DS9 – Trill – Unjoined are important for the parasite story-arc, also Mission Gamma 4.
     
  19. Dexter Remmick

    Dexter Remmick Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Again thanks. I'll head over there now.
     
  20. jimbotron

    jimbotron Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    This was about as gruesome as the head explosion from Scanners. However, the chorus' deaths in Loud as a Whisper was pretty gruesome too. It was animated rather than an actual explosion of meaty bits, but you see their internal organs and skeletons disintegrating in a fairly detailed manner.